PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

Brady for MVP this year or is there someone more deserving?


THE HUB FOR PATRIOTS FANS SINCE 2000

MORE PINNED POSTS:
Avatar
Replies:
312
Very sad news: RIP Joker
Avatar
Replies:
316
OT: Bad news - "it" is back...
Avatar
Replies:
234
2023/2024 Patriots Roster Transaction Thread
Avatar
Replies:
49
Asking for your support
 

Who should win MVP?

  • Tom Brady

  • Carson Wentz

  • Leveon Bell

  • Alex Smith

  • Other - Give details of your write in vote and why

  • Russell Wilson


Results are only viewable after voting.
Status
Not open for further replies.
Well, then defenses are excuses because without top defenses most QB's wouldn't have MVPs or SB or considered great because the defense saved them and gave then SB they could never get on their own on a lesser team.
Not sure what you are looking for here.
Are you saying not winning but blaming it on your defense makes you mvp worthy?

Aren’t we rewarding success? When you have to analyze why a team didn’t win and give out blame in order to tout a player perhaps that player shouldn’t be touted.

My opinion has always been that stats that don’t lead to wins are hollow. Are we really going to start saying pretty numbers are more valuable than wins?
 
Not sure what you are looking for here.
Are you saying not winning but blaming it on your defense makes you mvp worthy?

Aren’t we rewarding success? When you have to analyze why a team didn’t win and give out blame in order to tout a player perhaps that player shouldn’t be touted.

My opinion has always been that stats that don’t lead to wins are hollow. Are we really going to start saying pretty numbers are more valuable than wins?
Yeah good point, but are we rewarding wins even though the mvp had nothing to do with it, and might have even blown the game if not for a good defense to save the day?
I mean a mvp should be the playmaker i was thinking like say kamara. A guy that you will probably lose the game if hes out. Just an example, or Barry Sanders where there is no team without him.
Well if stats that don't lead to wins are hollow then they don't matter at all. QB's like
Dilfer should be MVP because his stats are bad but he won the SB. Pretty is putting down numbers ,comp% is not just a number and especially on a bad team with a bad OL. You do 70% with a bad OL and carry a team to a playoff with a bad defense I see you as mvp even if lose. I think there is a grey line here between winning and effort and talent that MVP is missing.
I mean seriously Brees with his stats , effort, talent, dedication and = 0 MVP. something wrong, but you have smart point.
 
1. It’s a travesty that Brees hasn’t won the award. Unfortunately for him the defense has taken him out of the running many years. I was in complete shock in 2009 and realized this award is political when Manning won, not just won, but in a complete landslide over Brees. Manning NEVER had to deal with major injuries besides in 2010 and he struggled to an embarrassing degree. Brees had much less talent in9 and put up a 109.6 rating to Manning’s 99.9. That’s an enormous difference, even though Manning had his (as always) two Hall of Fame receivers. Brees finished 13-2; Manning finished 14-2. Manning had the better defense. The other part of it is “the narrative” which somehow ALWAYS went to Manning, some absurd perception of carrying a terrible team despite that he had a phenomenal supporting cast. Brees took the Saints on his shoulders and should have won the “the narrative” but somehow lost. It’s really incredible the lengths they went to in order to ballwash Manning. And now there is “fatigue” about Brady’s excellence and he idea that “he doesn’t need any more,”but Manning absolutely needed that fifth. Also, Brees was just unfortunate that in 2011 he had a historic season but Rodgers had a more historic season. It’s ironic that Ryan and Newton have MVP awards in that division, while Brees is easily more worthy of having the hardware.

2. Russell Wilson does not deserve to be in the discussion. The Seahawks are always a middle ranked offense and this year is no difference. Wilson put up some historically bad first half numbers; I think he had something like 5-6 games where the offense failed to score a TD before halftime. He has no sense of the pocket and is responsible for many sacks, which don’t count against his stats. But even if he was lights out this season and you don’t agree with the previous points, missing the playoffs is rightfully a non-starter for MVP because he failed to accomplish the minimum goal of regular season success. Another way of thinking about it: if you put any other QB on Seattle this year, they can’t have a worse ultimate result than Wilson, which is failing to qualify for the playoffs. But theoretically, a different quarterback could have made the playoffs. Maybe they would have it maybe they wouldn’t have, but there is virtually no bar that they would need to set higher, since the Seahawks failed in the regular season, and the QB is most correlated player to team success and failure.
yeah make a better point than I, and maybe Wilson should not win. Seahawk does have a middle well run the team. I kind of threw that name out there wasn't thinking. Thanks, good point.
 
Yeah good point, but are we rewarding wins even though the mvp had nothing to do with it, and might have even blown the game if not for a good defense to save the day?
I mean a mvp should be the playmaker i was thinking like say kamara. A guy that you will probably lose the game if hes out. Just an example, or Barry Sanders where there is no team without him.
Well if stats that don't lead to wins are hollow then they don't matter at all. QB's like
Dilfer should be MVP because his stats are bad but he won the SB. Pretty is putting down numbers ,comp% is not just a number and especially on a bad team with a bad OL. You do 70% with a bad OL and carry a team to a playoff with a bad defense I see you as mvp even if lose. I think there is a grey line here between winning and effort and talent that MVP is missing.
I mean seriously Brees with his stats , effort, talent, dedication and = 0 MVP. something wrong, but you have smart point.
There is only 1 MVP. It’s a competition. Since the point of the game is to win, most valuable had to be tied to winning. I suppose you could put the best player on the worst team and arguably they could still be the best player but they surely wouldn’t be most valuable.
Brees has had a nice career but what year(s) do you think he should have been deemed most valuable of all nfl players? I think you have a good argument for 09 but I don’t see what other years you have one.
 
Brees deserved the MVP in 2009. Simple as that. Favre getting it wouldn't have been awful though.. But of course Manning got it because of course.
 
Brees deserved the MVP in 2009. Simple as that. Favre getting it wouldn't have been awful though.. But of course Manning got it because of course.

Favre had essentially as good a year as Brady did this year in 2009 at the same age(okay 2 months younger).

Its really amazing he didn't get the MVP considering how much people fawn over Brady for putting up his numbers at age 40.
 
There is only 1 MVP. It’s a competition. Since the point of the game is to win, most valuable had to be tied to winning. I suppose you could put the best player on the worst team and arguably they could still be the best player but they surely wouldn’t be most valuable.
Brees has had a nice career but what year(s) do you think he should have been deemed most valuable of all nfl players? I think you have a good argument for 09 but I don’t see what other years you have one.
Yeah just getting my head around this, but what if Berry Sanders did run for 2083 yards on the 9-7 lions in 1997 and it's all him? No good defense, OL or QB. Berry not the MVP ? because they cant win ? Lions wouldn't even get to the playoffs if Sanders didnt do that.

This is not really about Brees, yeah think he knows he's been shafted, but I don't think he cares. Probably be Mayor of NO in 2 years. I just used him as an example of someone that its crazy Cam has one but not him so.. maybe the thinking is a little crazy or as smart guy ice_ice , like you, said its political, and if so its really doesn't mean much right ? Just a scout badge

I mean you have to think to yourself probably one of the best, accurate, and consistent to play the game has =0 de uno, err nada and sanders is not MVP 1997 ? so it's about wins and the person that is MVP to carry a team is not that important., hence not that valuable.
Hense Smith was a way better RB because he ran with 1-10 OL, but sanders is not better even though his OL was junk.

Just getting my head around this.
 
Last edited:
Favre had essentially as good a year as Brady did this year in 2009 at the same age(okay 2 months younger).

Its really amazing he didn't get the MVP considering how much people fawn over Brady for putting up his numbers at age 40.

Favre came in 4th that year. If you want to assert that Manning was given yet another undeserved MVP that year, I wouldn't argue with you.
 
Favre had essentially as good a year as Brady did this year in 2009 at the same age(okay 2 months younger).

Its really amazing he didn't get the MVP considering how much people fawn over Brady for putting up his numbers at age 40.

Unlike Brady this year- Favre had stiff competition for MVP. Also he benefited from the 09 Vikings good defense IIRC. Much better than the Pats defense this year. Jared Allen was a monster.
 
Unlike Brady this year- Favre had stiff competition for MVP. Also he benefited from the 09 Vikings good defense IIRC. Much better than the Pats defense this year. Jared Allen was a monster.

The 2009 Vikings finished 10th in points allowed(312) vs the 2017 Patriots finishing 5th(296)
 
The 2009 Vikings finished 10th in points allowed(312) vs the 2017 Patriots finishing 5th(296)

I was sure the Vikings had a really good defense that year. Their run defense was the best in the league, ours is a weakness. We also have nobody like Allen was.
 
@pherein

Silver lining.

Brees is the best quarterback who has never won a regular season MVP award. No one will really care. It takes away virtually nothing from his legacy. Derek Jeter never won an MVP award. Kobe Bryant only won one! When people compare Kobe to Jordan or LeBron, no one even broaches regular season MVP awards.

Marino is the best quarterback to have not won a Super Bowl. His name is basically synonymous with either failure, pity, or bad luck. That is his legacy, fair or not. He won an MVP. So did Newton, Ryan, McNair, and Gannon. All three are considered to have complicated legacies due to zero rings. What’s the first thing you think of when you consider the legacy of LaDainian Tomlinson? Great player but ring-less...ultimately didn’t accomplish the ultimate goal.

I hope Brees wins an MVP, but it isn’t going to matter much at all. He has a Super Bowl MVP and signature moment. I expect that as he moves past Manning in the bulk stats, he’ll also pass him in consensus all-time QB rankings. I love that he got the last laugh in 2009 with the precious forehead choking as he always does.
 
Last edited:
Good Lord. Reading this is evidently worse than a riddle.

Re: pherien
 
Favre had essentially as good a year as Brady did this year in 2009 at the same age(okay 2 months younger).

Its really amazing he didn't get the MVP considering how much people fawn over Brady for putting up his numbers at age 40.
Not really. Favre was ninth in yards, 3rd in TDs, and 3rd in completion percentage. While that seems relatively comparable the issue was the two guys who beat him out of most QB numbers were Brees and Manning and they both finished with better records. Those two were ahead of him in yards, TDs, comp percentage, (Brees ahead in rating), etc. So when you have two guys with both better numbers in nearly every QB stat AND more wins what justification is there for MVP for Favre

Brady'sc ase for the MVP isn't that he is the 3rd best QB and he's 40, it's that he's the best QB this year period.
 
@pherein

Silver lining.

Brees is the best quarterback who has never won a regular season MVP award. No one will really care. It takes away vertically nothing from his legacy. Derek Jeter never won an MVP award. Kobe Bryant only won one! When people compare Kobe to Jordan or LeBron, no one even broaches regular season MVP awards.

Marino is the best quarterback to have not won a Super Bowl. His name is basically synonymous with either failure, pity, or bad luck. That is his legacy, fair or not.

I hope Brees wins an MVP, but it isn’t going to matter much at all. He has a Super Bowl MVP and signature moment. I expect that as he moves past Manning in the bulk stats, he’ll also pass him in consensus all-time QB rankings. I love that he got the last laugh in 2009 with the precious forehead choking as he always does.
Yeah your right and perfect wasn't really trying to make this a Brees debate, just using him as and example of maybe how messed up the thinking is with MVP, as a Saints fan I think people think we are mad Brees has no MVP, but we are not, I think its comical and shows what the MVP really stand for and how erratic it is, and that its diminished MVP when guys that truely deserve it never get it, because PM is popular or Rogers is cute and sexy , or wow look at the rookee that doesnt have better stats but we like him.

NO only thing with Brees is we want a chance for him to fight against tom in the game to end all games. A fun battle of great QB's. toe to toe. Brees if you know him wants Brady. He knows he's good or better but wants it. Brees and Brady are good friends and talk alot, but I think if you ask one person he want to fight in a SB he would say Brady and think if you ask Brady who he wants to fight in SB? Id be surprised if PM or care just to win, but he would love to kick Brees ass.
These guys are carnivores Brady want no question that stats don't mean **** and he can beat him and Brees wants Bradys head on a platter, so beat PM and Brady, never done, but friends, and its pretty cool fun if happens
 
Yeah your right and perfect wasn't really trying to make this a Brees debate, just using him as and example of maybe how messed up the thinking is with MVP, as a Saints fan I think people think we are mad Brees has no MVP, but we are not, I think its comical and shows what the MVP really stand for and how erratic it is, and that its diminished MVP when guys that truely deserve it never get it, because PM is popular or Rogers is cute and sexy , or wow look at the rookee that doesnt have better stats but we like him.

NO only thing with Brees is we want a chance for him to fight against tom in the game to end all games. A fun battle of great QB's. toe to toe. Brees if you know him wants Brady. He knows he's good or better but wants it. Brees and Brady are good friends and talk alot, but I think if you ask one person he want to fight in a SB he would say Brady and think if you ask Brady who he wants to fight in SB? Id be surprised if PM or care just to win, but he would love to kick Brees ass.
These guys are carnivores Brady want no question that stats don't mean **** and he can beat him and Brees wants Bradys head on a platter, so beat PM and Brady, never done, but friends, and its pretty cool fun if happens

It would be an awesome Super Bowl. Whoever wins, Goodell gets tarred and feathered during the presentation ceremony. I’ll never forget this tweet on the day Brady was suspended.



Basically the only high-powered NFL figure who was willing to do something like this. I can’t ever root against Payton if he is playing anyone else, and if the Pats don’t win, I’d gladly root for the Saints. I wish I had known what a conniving weasel Goodell was during Bogusgate with New Orleans.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.


Wednesday Patriots Notebook 4/17: News and Notes
Tuesday Patriots Notebook 4/16: News and Notes
Monday Patriots Notebook 4/15: News and Notes
Patriots News 4-14, Mock Draft 3.0, Gilmore, Law Rally For Bill 
Potential Patriot: Boston Globe’s Price Talks to Georgia WR McConkey
Friday Patriots Notebook 4/12: News and Notes
Not a First Round Pick? Hoge Doubles Down on Maye
Thursday Patriots Notebook 4/11: News and Notes
MORSE: Patriots Mock Draft #5 and Thoughts About Dugger Signing
Matthew Slater Set For New Role With Patriots
Back
Top