Rewatch Thread: NE @ Chicago (Week 7)

[Sicilian]

The pass to Develin reminded me of times that Brady has chucked it deep to a covered Matthew Slater on 3rd and 2. It doesn't make sense to me to force it to covered receivers who aren't known for being good pass catchers. I'm not going to vehemently fight it, but I agree it was a poor decision by Brady in general. He's allowed a few of those. EDIT: By allowed, I mean, a few bad decisions are excused.

 

[Kontradiction]

You are the one who continues to fail to meet the standards of this thread.

You just say its fine despite visual and clear evidence it was not. There is not a single thing about that throw that is "fine". And you can't even articulate it but you keep talking about a catch/non-catch that is totally irrelevant to the overall point.

You're trying to make the point that the throw was a bad decision because there were men in the area. Using that point of view, every contested throw can be logged as a bad decision. That's folly. The decision was fine. The throw hit Develin in the hands - even off-balance. The execution was not. Or, you could say that the execution by the Bears' DBs was better than the execution by Develin. Either way, you would be right. However, putting the blame on the quarterback in that situation is asinine. That was showed to you in the other thread that you've since bailed out in. You're now trying to make that case here and, instead of defending your analysis, are whining about reporting a non-spam post to the mods as spam. But at least you're coming around to the view that the decision is relevant to the re-watch thread, though.

If you can't stay on topic please leave this thread and stick with the hot take crowd.

I am staying on topic. You’re actually the one taking it off course. Your original analysis here was the definition of a hawt taek.

 

[luuked]

Lazar starting his A22 review.



I just want to point out how horrific the A22 angle in Soldier Field is. You barely see more than from the broadcast angle. Garbage..

 

[WaterfallJumper]

Yikes, what's going on in here?

@luuked I appreciate a lot of what you do, but maybe you should consider just letting this one go. I think Kontra's right, but even if he were wrong, you don't have to threaten to report for spam just because another poster has a differing opinion and won't stand for being steamrolled.

It seems to me that the other team made a play. It happens. Perhaps it was a riskier throw than others, but that doesn't inherently bother me. Brady has made a career out of aggressive playmaking. The goal is to win, not to always be "right" or "safe" with each pass, and some of his "bad" plays or "questionable" decisions have led to championships. Life isn't always so binary that we can judge every play on its minutia.

These threads are useful for improving our understanding of football, but trying to turn each play into good or bad decision making based on incomplete information tends to back you into corners since we don't really know the scheme and playcalls. Add to that a dengration or belittling of contrasting opinions, and I've grown a bit tired of the Rewatch experience. Too often, there's an appeal to authority (Chatham, Lazar, etc) that comes off as a bit condescending, and sometimes wrong. They're great resources, sure, but they're not infallible.

At the risk of sounding rude -- and I apologize ahead of time, because I think you're generally a solid poster -- you remind me of the IYI principle (that is, "Intellectual Yet Idiot" as popularized by Nassim Nicholas Taleb, if you're interested in thought-provoking books). I think I"m going to take a short break from your posting in hopes that you show some a more charitable attitude again soon. I do appreciate what you're trying to do, and I think you bring value to the board. Looking forward to chatting again sometime soon.

All the best.

 

[Kontradiction]

Wrong.

I am trying to make the point that the play was meant to go to Edelman and at the very last moment Brady changed his mind and threw a floater to Develin in the flat. You don't do that.

Sure you do if Edelman has a man right behind him in position to make the play and Develin is going out into the flat open at the time. You even posted the pic yourself...



Edelman is not open, Develin is. Edelman is Brady's primary read. He makes that read then checks it to Develin. He made the right call and hit Develin.

If he wants to hit Develin in the flat

He did hit Develin... right in the hands.

the pass needs to have zip on it or at least be thrown towards either the sideline (which was impossible given Develins position) or his feet. But TB12 didn't have time to do that as the Chicago player was already in breathing distance.

Brady put that ball about as well as you could put it. It was to the outside. Develin simply caught it, couldn't maintain, and it squirted out before changing possession. None of that has to do with Brady. All of that has to do with the execution after the pass is released. But it sounds like your ire should probably be directed toward McDaniels there. You seem to be indicating that you have a problem with a pass even being called in the first place. That's also not on Brady.

So he threw a littler touch pass over there. If you slow down the replay you see Develin actually waiting for the pass to arrive and the Chicago defender breaking on the ball. A pick 6 was avoided by a fraction of a second. What happened afterwards I don't care about. It is the decision to throw a pass without any speed behind it into the vicinity of your FB in a situation where you are already up 2 scores that is an issue.

Most throws at the NFL level are near pick-6's that are avoided by fractions of seconds. That's what happens when the pass (and particularly passes into the flats) has a man in the area. That doesn't make the play call nor the decision a bad one. What happened afterwards was Develin catching the ball. The quarterback's job was done. The decision to throw it there was fine. It's on Develin to hang on to the ball from there. He didn't. That's an execution issue.

My take is thought out and supported by video evidence. It is literally the opposite of a hot take.

No, it isn't. You developed a pre-formed conclusion based on who threw the ball then worked backwards in order to support your thesis. That's a hawt taek. And I'm actually giving you credit when I call it that much. I could have simply said that the take was so bad that it just looks like a hawt taek.

 

[luuked]

@luuked I appreciate a lot of what you do, but maybe you should consider just letting this one go. I think Kontra's right, but even if he were wrong, you don't have to threaten to report for spam, just because another poster has a differing opinion and won't stand for being steamrolled.

I have taken it to messaging him directly about it.


But honestly I am done with it. Not worth the effort to do any of it. Will take a timeout from this myself. Not worth the trouble.

 

[luuked]

Sure you do if Edelman has a man right behind him in position to make the play and Develin is going out into the flat open at the time. You even posted the pic yourself...



Edelman is not open, Develin is. Edelman is Brady's primary read. He makes that read then checks it to Develin. He made the right call and hit Develin.



He did hit Develin... right in the hands.



Brady put that ball about as well as you could put it. It was to the outside. Develin simply caught it, couldn't maintain, and it squirted out before changing possession. None of that has to do with Brady. All of that has to do with the execution after the pass is released. But it sounds like your ire should probably be directed toward McDaniels there. You seem to be indicating that you have a problem with a pass even being called in the first place. That's also not on Brady.



Most throws at the NFL level are near pick-6's that are avoided by fractions of seconds. That's what happens when the pass (and particularly passes into the flats) has a man in the area. That doesn't make the play call nor the decision a bad one. What happened afterwards was Develin catching the ball. The quarterback's job was done. The decision to throw it there was fine. It's on Develin to hang on to the ball from there. He didn't. That's an execution issue.



No, it isn't. You developed a pre-formed conclusion based on who threw the ball then worked backwards in order to support your thesis. That's a hawt taek. And I'm actually giving you credit when I call it that much. I could have simply said that the take was so bad that it just looks like a hawt taek.

Cool I read it all wrong, you win.

 

[Kontradiction]

I have taken it to messaging him directly about it.


But honestly I am done with it. Not worth the effort to do any of it. Will take a timeout from this myself. Not worth the trouble.

I responded to you. Apologies for the delay. I'm supposed to be working right now.

 

[ALP]

i'd like to see how barner ran

 

[PP2]

Cool I read it all wrong, you win.

Quite honestly there is no win/loss in analysis. We will never know what the play call was or what the protection was, or who flunked their assignments, so all we can do is speculate endlessly. For me, there is really no right or wrong in this regard even though I get into my share of arguments with posters.

You have your perspective, Kontra has his. There is nothing wrong with either of your perspective- just absolutely unnecessary to turn it into a personal attack. That contributes nothing to the discussion.

On that play if anyone's to blame, it's White for not picking up the rush. Because if he does, Brady has time to reset his feet and fire the ball right into Develin, instead of lobbing it.

 

[jah]

Holy **** lmao

I don't even know where I stand on this issue, and I swear I've read like 20 arguments in favor of each position.

 

[Kontradiction]

Holy **** lmao

I don't even know where I stand on this issue, and I swear I've read like 20 arguments in favor of each position.

Well, I'm here to tell you that you're wrong.

 

[Ring 6]

You are the one who continues to fail to meet the standards of this thread.

You just say its fine despite visual and clear evidence it was not. There is not a single thing about that throw that is "fine". And you can't even articulate it but you keep talking about a catch/non-catch that is totally irrelevant to the overall point.

If you can't stay on topic please leave this thread and stick with the hot take crowd.

How can the fact that brady threw a pass to an open receiver that should have been caught for a first down but was dropped have nothing to with the quality of the decision?

 

[Clonamery]

Devlin was wide open, Brady made a good decision but threw an "Eli Manning" pass to Devlin, Devlin was pressured but still could/should have caught the pass, ball squirted loose and luckily wan't caught by 2nd Bears player. Was that kind of day.

 

[The Brandon Five]

Devlin was wide open, Brady made a good decision but threw an "Eli Manning" pass to Devlin, Devlin was pressured but still could/should have caught the pass, ball squirted loose and luckily wan't caught by 2nd Bears player. Was that kind of day.

It was caught by a Bears player.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

Devlin was wide open, Brady made a good decision but threw an "Eli Manning" pass to Devlin, Devlin was pressured but still could/should have caught the pass, ball squirted loose and luckily wan't caught by 2nd Bears player. Was that kind of day.

This is where I’m at on this play. Except it was caught by a bear.

 

[Clonamery]

It was caught by a Bears player.

It's a joke. But I should have added

 

[Sicilian]

This thread went south so fast, I half-expected it to end up about Malcolm Butler.

 

[Tony2046]

Here one of my favorite little plays in the game by the defense:


Whatever the opposite of "communication issues" is that was it. KVN stays with Burton for a bit, gives him a little chip knowing that Chung and others will flow to the Bears TE and goes to pressure Trubisky. He bought enough time for the underneath coverage to be there.

How often have you seen this play out with a defender immediately going after the QB, the QB lobbing a pass over him and the outlet player gaining good yardage ?

It is the little things.

There was another play like that IIRC. I'll try to find it later.

But yes , great communication

 

[ALP]

There was another play like that IIRC. I'll try to find it later.

But yes , great communication

normally i would agree

but in this case, the way the play unfolded, the best decision would have been to stay w/ the receiver because roberts was bearing down on the QB at pretty much the same time