NE@DEN REWATCH thread

[captain stone]

Shout out to Dorsett. Anyone notice on the deep patterns her ran he drew the safety his side along with the corner. IT allowed cooks to only have to beat man coverage with no help. That’s how much teams respect Dorsetts speed...

Double-covering Dorsett while single-covering Cooks doesn't seem like a real good idea to me.

 

[Tony2046]

Double-covering Dorsett while single-covering Cooks doesn't seem like a real good idea to me.

He wasn't double covered. Zone responsibilities.

I've seen what NG is talking about on the all 22 a few times. I'll see if I can find an example and post it.

I've seen it work in Hogan's favor as well although with Cook's putting the pressure on the Safety.

 

[Tony2046]

Just want to post Chatham's podcast.

 

[luuked]

Shout out to Dorsett. Anyone notice on the deep patterns her ran he drew the safety his side along with the corner. IT allowed cooks to only have to beat man coverage with no help. That’s how much teams respect Dorsetts speed

I think Dorsett will be a big weapon next year as he continues to learn the playbook

Havent paid attention to that but if true it just once again goes to show how much a full team sport football is. Everyone has a role to play even if the stats and cameras dont show it.

 

[TomPatriot]

Solder's improving form improves the left double team as well . starting to look like last mid-season. That's quite huge good news. Big part of opening up running game. Should be good news for Gillislee as well..

In the first gif watch Andrews hold his block for the entire play so there’s no weak side help. Between that and the double team and Develin burying Marshall they get a nice gain. Davis couldn’t get thru the trash to the ball. That’s why the Broncos really needed 8 in the box but then . . . that passing game. A DC’s nightmare.

Develin is an asset at the point of attack.

 

[Wheelman]

1st play after fumble - 1st qtr, 13:22, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB
1st down to Burkhead looks like designed play for Burkhead. Other 4 eligibles run well past the 1st down marker.

kickoff return TD
Blatant hold by Bolden not called.
Shaq Barrett, #48, sets up Bolden nicely to cut back inside. Barrett is running straight and a bit to the right of Bolden.
So #48 gets Bolden to turn his hips making him think #48 is going to go around the outside. Bolden is now out of position and #48 cuts back inside. #48 now has the leverage to get thru Bolden. Bolden holds him. Jersey being pulled significantly.

Watching all-22 EZ cam from BB Breakdown you can see 3 refs view obstructed by other players. That's why it wasn't called I think. Otherwise it was great blocking by everyone else.

I didn't see anyone in the media or here talk about this, but I think the NBC video crew caught it. 1st replay they showed was #48 with his hands on his hips. 2nd replay showed Bolden with the blatant hold.

Brady QB Sneak - 1st qtr, 1:52
I don't think anyone actually touches Brady when his knee first goes to the ground. They should have given Brady the 1st down.

2nd qtr, 14:17, DEN 1, 3rd and goal
I think Amendola beats Harris(#25) with the Edelman XLIX TD route. But White misses the block. 2nd(Allen drop) and 3rd down both should have been TD's. 21-6, not 17-6.

Gronk catch called incomplete - 2nd qtr, 10:03, DEN, 19, 1st and 10
Gronk is actually touched down at the 1. Not a TD. But still a terrible call.

3rd and 4 Draw play - 2nd qtr, 9:18, DEN 13.5 3rd and 4
I liked the draw call, nice huge hole, Should have been a touchdown. If Mason had not engaged #96 square, and kept him outside while engaging him. It's a TD!
Only thing I can think of is Mason has to sell the pass in case other defenders key in on that? That's another 4 points left out there.

3rd qtr, 13:00, 2nd and 4
Flowers is held clearly, fingers inside the jersey on outside run. Where the **** is the hold Umpire #44. It's right in front of you! The umpire is taken out of the game later on. How unfortunate...

3rd qtr, 11:37, OWN 46, 2nd and 10
Pats dared them to run with dime personnel. and pass rushing front 5 on the field. And they ran with it for a 1st down.

When the Pats were in the base defense the past two games(not sure beyond that), Richards was in for Chung except for one play this game where Chung manned the slot with McCourty in single high.

Richards played in the 3 safety package a few times this game. McCourty - Richards - Chung and Harmon - McCourty - Richards.

Pats in dime with pass rushing front 5 after making 41-16. Richards replaces Flowers(#59) at some point making it 7 DB's.

Still leaving points out there. Hopefully we keep improving. ST play was nice.

 

[TomPatriot]

I love this thread. Really good stuff.

 

[Tony2046]

Re Muffed Punt:

Reposting Chatham's podcast. This one has time markers. Btw: It's a great podcast.





Chatham answered the question.

Q: is there a timing window that the ST Gunners must have with the Punter to ensure pressure on the punt returner but not too much to force a fair catch?

A: (Paraphrasing his answer) No. A Gunner wants to get to the PR as fast a possible to prevent a return. A fair catch is a good result. So the Gunner is not going to slow down to time his arrival. The muff was a bad decision by the PR. Typically a PR will call for a fair catch if the Gunner is within 5-10 yards from him depending on the Punts trajectory.

He answers a few other good questions such as: Why was Chung playing slot receiver? , Does MB have problems with double moves:? etc...

 

[long distance]

yes, please

 

[NE-VT]

Thank you.. any chance the pre-snap is available or are you working with what footage you were able to get your hands on?

I was able to make this. I am not sure if it shows what you are looking for. Maybe @Tony2046 can do the all-22 if it does not. The broadcast did not show any more wide scope pre-snap.

 

[NE-VT]

1st play after fumble - 1st qtr, 13:22, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB
1st down to Burkhead looks like designed play for Burkhead. Other 4 eligibles run well past the 1st down marker.

kickoff return TD
Blatant hold by Bolden not called.
Shaq Barrett, #48, sets up Bolden nicely to cut back inside. Barrett is running straight and a bit to the right of Bolden.
So #48 gets Bolden to turn his hips making him think #48 is going to go around the outside. Bolden is now out of position and #48 cuts back inside. #48 now has the leverage to get thru Bolden. Bolden holds him. Jersey being pulled significantly.

Watching all-22 EZ cam from BB Breakdown you can see 3 refs view obstructed by other players. That's why it wasn't called I think. Otherwise it was great blocking by everyone else.

I didn't see anyone in the media or here talk about this, but I think the NBC video crew caught it. 1st replay they showed was #48 with his hands on his hips. 2nd replay showed Bolden with the blatant hold.

Brady QB Sneak - 1st qtr, 1:52
I don't think anyone actually touches Brady when his knee first goes to the ground. They should have given Brady the 1st down.

2nd qtr, 14:17, DEN 1, 3rd and goal
I think Amendola beats Harris(#25) with the Edelman XLIX TD route. But White misses the block. 2nd(Allen drop) and 3rd down both should have been TD's. 21-6, not 17-6.

Gronk catch called incomplete - 2nd qtr, 10:03, DEN, 19, 1st and 10
Gronk is actually touched down at the 1. Not a TD. But still a terrible call.

3rd and 4 Draw play - 2nd qtr, 9:18, DEN 13.5 3rd and 4
I liked the draw call, nice huge hole, Should have been a touchdown. If Mason had not engaged #96 square, and kept him outside while engaging him. It's a TD!
Only thing I can think of is Mason has to sell the pass in case other defenders key in on that? That's another 4 points left out there.

3rd qtr, 13:00, 2nd and 4
Flowers is held clearly, fingers inside the jersey on outside run. Where the **** is the hold Umpire #44. It's right in front of you! The umpire is taken out of the game later on. How unfortunate...

3rd qtr, 11:37, OWN 46, 2nd and 10
Pats dared them to run with dime personnel. and pass rushing front 5 on the field. And they ran with it for a 1st down.

When the Pats were in the base defense the past two games(not sure beyond that), Richards was in for Chung except for one play this game where Chung manned the slot with McCourty in single high.

Richards played in the 3 safety package a few times this game. McCourty - Richards - Chung and Harmon - McCourty - Richards.

Pats in dime with pass rushing front 5 after making 41-16. Richards replaces Flowers(#59) at some point making it 7 DB's.

Still leaving points out there. Hopefully we keep improving. ST play was nice.

This covers all of the plays in your write-up besides the kick return, since that was already posted.



I don't think the Mason on the 3rd and 4 Draw play was a run key thing, since Andrews fires off past the LOS. Actually, Andrews might have been the key for the DT to back up diagonally, making the Mason's block harder. I think it is pretty hard to seal block when the are backing away from you, but maybe a former OL might be able to confirm that.

I also wonder if the Patriots would not call this a draw, since the center starts looking for a block past the LOS right after snap. Not sure.

 

[Wheelman]

Allen had 11 snaps while the game was still at large. 6 run snaps, 5 pass snaps.
Allen runs a route in all 5 pass snaps

As for pass snaps here:
TD Drop
TD Reception
3 times looks covered but I can't see him the whole time from the broadcast tape.


Allen had 9 snaps in clock killing mode. 6 run snaps, 3 pass snaps.
Allen runs a route in 1 pass snap. The other 2 pass plays Allen stays in and blocks on play action fake wide receiver screen passes.

4th qtr, 2:11, DEN 46, 3rd and 4, 21 personnel FB, Allen to the left in the slot
Allen cuts inside 3 yards from LOS, technically open, but Develin more open on the play for a 1st down. Develin goes out of bounds though. I'm sure BB got on him for that.


Allen had 9 positive run blocking snaps. Although there's one I have a question about.

2nd qtr, 14:55, DEN 2, 1st and goal, 23 personnel FB, Allen left of line at point of attack, From left to right Gronk and Hollister right of line
Power I against 11 man box. Allen engages edge defender, #48. Allen pushes(or is turned) #48 to the left, Develin helps a little before getting cut down.
Burkhead shoots the gap to the right of Allen for a gain of 1 yard.
Most of the line got pushed back immediately. Thuney to Waddle are all on the ground. About as much as you expect from that.

Was Allen supposed to set the edge? But then I don't think he would allow himself to get turned left like that? Appreciate if someone would chime in and break down the play for me.


Allen had 1 snap where there wasn't much he could do because of the D.

4th qtr, 15:00, OWN 34, 1st and 10, 12 personnel, Allen in FB position aligned to in between Mason and Waddle.
Looking at Solder to Andrews, I believe Allen is trying to(and supposed to?) go in between the blocks of Thuney and Mason. But neither Mason or Waddle can sustain their block. Mason on DT #92, Waddle on Miller #58. Allen cuts back to the right around Waddle and runs up the middle and looks for a Donkeys defender to engage. Sees one coming right late and tries to engage it and whiffs. 1 yard gain. I can't blame Allen for going the other way as Waddle is also pushed back. It was just a domino effect after Mason and Waddle lost.

Do you guys agree on where the play was supposed to go to?


Allen had 2 negative run blocking snaps. Got beat by #58 Miller and #48 Barrett with the same move that Bosa did to him last game against the Chargers

3rd qtr, 4:41, DEN 8, 2nd and 4, 12 personnel, Allen right of line, Gronk to the left inside the slot.
Allen looks right to engage, Miller #58 at the edge. Hard to tell but Miller swats Allen's hands away so Allen can't engage him. Miller uses his right hand to get away. Miller turns the corner. Allen makes slight contact with Miller. Helps prevent tackle on Lewis. But Allen is beat here, similar to last week against Bosa.

An Optimist would say he got beat but then recovered just enough to do his job. But if Lewis had to hesitate for one moment, like last game where Allen got beat by Bosa, It's a tackle by Miller.

4th qtr, 4:32, OWN 21, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB, Allen in motion from right to left of line, but off of LOS.
Allen tries to engage #48 at edge of line. Same sort of swat move as Bosa and Miller before him. #48 turns the corner and hits Lewis with another Donkey defender. Play wasn't going anywhere regardless.

Is it something Allen might need to work on? Gronk failed at this too? Is it too much for any TE? On the positive though, Allen did redeem himself later in the game successfully engaging against #48 and #56 on the same type of run block.

 

[Wheelman]

When Allen was on the field:

RUN ----- 1st qtr, 1:52, DEN 22, 3rd and 1, 22 personnel FB, Allen left of line, Gronk right of line
RUN ----- 1st qtr, 1:32, DEN 22, 4th and 1, 22 personnel FB, Allen left of line, Gronk right of line
PASS ---- 1st qtr. 53, DEN 20.5, 1st and 10, 21 personnel, Allen in motion moving to the right of line to the end of the line, Gronk right of the line.
RUN ----- 2nd qtr, 14:55, DEN 2, 1st and goal, 23 personnel FB, Allen left of line at point of attack, From left to right Gronk and Hollister right of line
PASS ---- 2nd qtr, 14:21, Den 1, 2nd and goal, 23 personnel FB, Allen left of line, Gronk right of line, Hollister in motion to right of line.
PASS ---- 2nd qtr, 10:03, DEN, 19, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB, Gronk and Allen left to right end of line.
PASS ---- 2nd qtr, 1:11, DEN 33, 1st and 10, 12 personnel, Allen right of line. Gronk to the left inside the slot.
PASS ---- 2nd qtr, 31, DEN 11.5, 2nd and 10, 12 personnel, Allen right of line, Gronk to the left inside the slot.
RUN ----- 3rd qtr, 4:59, DEN 14, 1st and 10, 12 personnel, Allen right of line, Gronk to the left inside the slot.
RUN ----- 3rd qtr, 4:41, DEN 8, 2nd and 4, 12 personnel, Allen right of line, Gronk to the left inside the slot.
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 15:00, OWN 34, 1st and 10, 12 personnel, Allen in FB position aligned to in between Mason and Waddle.
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 4:32, OWN 21, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB, Allen in motion from right to left of line, but off of LOS.
PASS ---- 4th qtr. 3:50, OWN 21, 2nd and 10, 12 personnel, Allen right of line
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 3:40, OWN 48, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB, Allen right of line
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 2:56, 50, 2nd and 8, 21 personnel FB, Allen left of line
PASS ---- 4th qtr, 2:11, DEN 46, 3rd and 4, 21 personnel FB, Allen to the left in the slot.
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 2:05, DEN 36, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB, Allen in motion from right to left of line, but off of LOS
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 2:00, DEN 34.5, 2nd and 8, 21 personnel FB, Allen in motion from left to right of line, but off of LOS
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 1:15, DEN 32, 3rd and 6, 21 personnel FB, Allen in motion from right to left of line, but off LOS
PASS ---- 4th qtr, 32, DEN 33.5, 4th and 7, 21 personnel FB, Allen and Develin left to right of line

 

[captain stone]

kickoff return TD
Blatant hold by Bolden not called.
Shaq Barrett, #48, sets up Bolden nicely to cut back inside. Barrett is running straight and a bit to the right of Bolden.
So #48 gets Bolden to turn his hips making him think #48 is going to go around the outside. Bolden is now out of position and #48 cuts back inside. #48 now has the leverage to get thru Bolden. Bolden holds him. Jersey being pulled significantly.

Watching all-22 EZ cam from BB Breakdown you can see 3 refs view obstructed by other players. That's why it wasn't called I think. Otherwise it was great blocking by everyone else.

I didn't see anyone in the media or here talk about this, but I think the NBC video crew caught it. 1st replay they showed was #48 with his hands on his hips. 2nd replay showed Bolden with the blatant hold...

Just finished re-watching the KO return; nice catch on the Bolden hold. It's clearly visible on the sky cam. Thank goodness none of the zebras saw it. Bolden sucks as both a blocker and as a runner.

 

[long distance]

When Allen was on the field:

RUN ----- 1st qtr, 1:52, DEN 22, 3rd and 1, 22 personnel FB, Allen left of line, Gronk right of line
RUN ----- 1st qtr, 1:32, DEN 22, 4th and 1, 22 personnel FB, Allen left of line, Gronk right of line
PASS ---- 1st qtr. 53, DEN 20.5, 1st and 10, 21 personnel, Allen in motion moving to the right of line to the end of the line, Gronk right of the line.
RUN ----- 2nd qtr, 14:55, DEN 2, 1st and goal, 23 personnel FB, Allen left of line at point of attack, From left to right Gronk and Hollister right of line
PASS ---- 2nd qtr, 14:21, Den 1, 2nd and goal, 23 personnel FB, Allen left of line, Gronk right of line, Hollister in motion to right of line.
PASS ---- 2nd qtr, 10:03, DEN, 19, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB, Gronk and Allen left to right end of line.
PASS ---- 2nd qtr, 1:11, DEN 33, 1st and 10, 12 personnel, Allen right of line. Gronk to the left inside the slot.
PASS ---- 2nd qtr, 31, DEN 11.5, 2nd and 10, 12 personnel, Allen right of line, Gronk to the left inside the slot.
RUN ----- 3rd qtr, 4:59, DEN 14, 1st and 10, 12 personnel, Allen right of line, Gronk to the left inside the slot.
RUN ----- 3rd qtr, 4:41, DEN 8, 2nd and 4, 12 personnel, Allen right of line, Gronk to the left inside the slot.
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 15:00, OWN 34, 1st and 10, 12 personnel, Allen in FB position aligned to in between Mason and Waddle.
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 4:32, OWN 21, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB, Allen in motion from right to left of line, but off of LOS.
PASS ---- 4th qtr. 3:50, OWN 21, 2nd and 10, 12 personnel, Allen right of line
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 3:40, OWN 48, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB, Allen right of line
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 2:56, 50, 2nd and 8, 21 personnel FB, Allen left of line
PASS ---- 4th qtr, 2:11, DEN 46, 3rd and 4, 21 personnel FB, Allen to the left in the slot.
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 2:05, DEN 36, 1st and 10, 21 personnel FB, Allen in motion from right to left of line, but off of LOS
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 2:00, DEN 34.5, 2nd and 8, 21 personnel FB, Allen in motion from left to right of line, but off of LOS
RUN ----- 4th qtr, 1:15, DEN 32, 3rd and 6, 21 personnel FB, Allen in motion from right to left of line, but off LOS
PASS ---- 4th qtr, 32, DEN 33.5, 4th and 7, 21 personnel FB, Allen and Develin left to right of line

Great job on both posts! Thanks!

 

[Wheelman]

Forgot to post the best part of game review.