The Superbowl Rewatch thread: the great defensive duel

[pencilneckgeek]

Also, this thread is not some sort of "exclusive club." Everyone is welcomed to participate, to post an analytical tweet that's relevant, or to post original analysis, or a clip from the game.

Above all, if you don't understand something, whether it be terminology or concept, etc. Please ask!

Thank you for this. There's a lot to learn here, and sometimes we learn best by putting ourselves out there and being wrong.

 

[EddardSnow67]

Great analysis already and I'm looking forward to more. I would just like to add that James Develin is incredible and the most underrated player on the team, which is saying something. I hope someone puts together film of the game he played last night. It was epic.

 

[gitgronked82]

My biggest takeaway watching this defense through the playoffs was how incredibly effective the DL stunts were. We really didn’t need to blitz to create pressure. I can’t believe it was so effective. Why do you guys think it worked so well? The DL played with great technique and there are some talented players there, but none id call stars outside of trey (and I suppose Hightower and kvn were part of quite a few of these)

They’re well coached, but it amazes me that it was so effective given the simplicity of it

 

[ALP]

My biggest takeaway watching this defense through the playoffs was how incredibly effective the DL stunts were. We really didn’t need to blitz to create pressure. I can’t believe it was so effective. Why do you guys think it worked so well? The DL played with great technique and there are some talented players there, but none id call stars outside of trey (and I suppose Hightower and kvn were part of quite a few of these)

They’re well coached, but it amazes me that it was so effective given the simplicity of it

the stunts are tough to stop even if you know when they're coming if they're executing very well, and all the gifs ive seen show reallyw ell executed stunts

also, isn't it nice to have a QB like Brady, when things aren't working, just go empty backfield and spread lmao???

 

[EddardSnow67]

My biggest takeaway watching this defense through the playoffs was how incredibly effective the DL stunts were. We really didn’t need to blitz to create pressure. I can’t believe it was so effective. Why do you guys think it worked so well? The DL played with great technique and there are some talented players there, but none id call stars outside of trey (and I suppose Hightower and kvn were part of quite a few of these)

They’re well coached, but it amazes me that it was so effective given the simplicity of it

They had their OLBs up to the LOS a lot in this game, so you could technically call it blitzing when those guys rushed. It's mostly showing pressure from enough guys to occupy all the OL, except one or two are dropping into coverage. The confusing thing is that it's a different guy dropping back every time. Pass protection is mostly zone blocking, and is predicated on free OL being able to determine which gap they can help out on. Confusion creates late help, which creates rushing lanes.

From there, they change it up even more by running loops within that structure and occasionally bringing overload pressure to a given gap from the secondary or having a dropping linebacker blitz late through a gap opened by a stunt.

All you can really do is be aware of what they do. You can't really prepare for it beyond that, beyond having really, really good individual offensive linemen who can really handle one on one blocking and have great awareness and feel for where the rush is coming from. The Rams were a really good OL as a sum of its parts, but individually they have weaknesses. Those were exploited.

Also, if you can get a lot of man up rushing attempts for your pass rushers, they'll win a lot of them, especially inside. When you can get four or five OL blocking one on one against rushers, it's a pretty safe bet one of them is going to get beat.

 

[mgteich]

My guess is that most overrated is Allan. Most posters have wanted to keep Develin. Most have wanted to cut Allan.

.

I would just like to add that James Devlin is incredible and the most underrated player on the team, which is saying something..

 

[EddardSnow67]

the stunts are tough to stop even if you know when they're coming if they're executing very well, and all the gifs ive seen show reallyw ell executed stunts

also, isn't it nice to have a QB like Brady, when things aren't working, just go empty backfield and spread lmao???

It's really incredible, isn't it?

"Ok, we're going with 22 personnel, one of those is a fullback, and then we're going to spread the field."

It sounds completely nuts, but it works because of the QB and the focus and tireless precision of everyone on the offense. How many teams are willing to line up their full back wide at that point in the game? Or even have a full back?

 

[EddardSnow67]

My guess is that most overrated is Allan. Most posters have wanted to keep Develin. Most have wanted to cut Allan.

He's also very underrated. Just hard nosed players, same effort play in and play out. Reliable as hell. Tell them to do something and they'll do it.

 

[Deus Irae]

If someone could pull the INT from Brady, particularly where the ball it tipped at/near the line, and make a gif of it, I'd appreciate it. I think that part keeps getting missed by people saying "Bad pass!".

 

[1960Pats]

Thanks again to all of you who post here. Every article and video has been educational as well as enjoyable. One of my favorites was the Baldinger video of Roberts blowing up the Rams O Lineman, but they've all been great.

 

[gitgronked82]

They had their OLBs up to the LOS a lot in this game, so you could technically call it blitzing when those guys rushed. It's mostly showing pressure from enough guys to occupy all the OL, except one or two are dropping into coverage. The confusing thing is that it's a different guy dropping back every time. Pass protection is mostly zone blocking, and is predicated on free OL being able to determine which gap they can help out on. Confusion creates late help, which creates rushing lanes.

From there, they change it up even more by running loops within that structure and occasionally bringing overload pressure to a given gap from the secondary or having a dropping linebacker blitz late through a gap opened by a stunt.

All you can really do is be aware of what they do. You can't really prepare for it beyond that, beyond having really, really good individual offensive linemen who can really handle one on one blocking and have great awareness and feel for where the rush is coming from. The Rams were a really good OL as a sum of its parts, but individually they have weaknesses. Those were exploited.

Also, if you can get a lot of man up rushing attempts for your pass rushers, they'll win a lot of them, especially inside. When you can get four or five OL blocking one on one against rushers, it's a pretty safe bet one of them is going to get beat.

Yeah I’ll buy that the front being up on the line makes it hard to identify and have your help ready.
On my college team (I only got to see it from a special teams perspective since I didn’t play OL) it wasn’t all that complicated to deal with a twist. If you’re man leaves, you yell twist. The other guy then displaces his man all the way to you and you pick him up, while the other guy picks up the looper. I’m sure the pats complicated things to make it harder. It just surprises me that we were so incredibly effective

 

[PP2]

All 22 is out.

More on the Hoss y Juke play that we ran 3x in a row:

 

[EddardSnow67]

Yeah I’ll buy that the front being up on the line makes it hard to identify and have your help ready.
On my college team (I only got to see it from a special teams perspective since I didn’t play OL) it wasn’t all that complicated to deal with a twist. If you’re man leaves, you yell twist. The other guy then displaces his man all the way to you and you pick him up, while the other guy picks up the looper. I’m sure the pats complicated things to make it harder. It just surprises me that we were so incredibly effective

Oh yeah, they're really on another level in terms of execution in addition to the scheme.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

If someone could pull the INT from Brady, particularly where the ball it tipped at/near the line, and make a gif of it, I'd appreciate it. I think that part keeps getting missed by people saying "Bad pass!".

I don't have a better angle, but I made this gif. I'm not sure that the ball was tipped.

 

[EddardSnow67]

I don't have a better angle, but I made this gif. I'm not sure that the ball was tipped.

It looked to me that Brady got spooked by the late zone switch on the hitch and held the ball too long, causing it to come back inside. It was a pretty nifty coverage wrinkle by the Rams, though, so I'm not surprised Brady was hesitant. He thought that corner was going to carry the seam route for a couple yards before breaking down underneath. Instead, the corner just continued past the seam directly to the hitch. You can see that a nice window opens up on the seam, Brady just didn't expect what happened.

He seemed to have more space than he thought, because the corner took too long to get his eyes back upfield and probably wouldn't have had a chance at the ball if Brady had widened the throw to the sideline.

 

[pheenix11]

Looks to me like Brady read man and the slot corner was playing zone. More of a bad read than a bad pass.

 

[EddardSnow67]

Looks to me like Brady read man and the slot corner was playing zone. More of a bad read than a bad pass.

It was a really well disguised coverage by the Rams. I agree that it wasn't the right read, but it was something Brady did seem to recognize during his throwing motion, which altered his throw. It's hard to see in that gif, but on the live broadcast they had a head on view of Brady and he really seems to hold the ball too long because of his late recognition of the coverage.

So I'd say it was a bad throw, but it was a bad throw because of a bad read. As if he realized halfway through his motion that he didn't want to throw it.

 

[SVN]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/spor...wl-liii/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.0704cf688a15

thought this was a good read

 

[WaterfallJumper]

It was a really well disguised coverage by the Rams. I agree that it wasn't the right read, but it was something Brady did seem to recognize during his throwing motion, which altered his throw. It's hard to see in that gif, but on the live broadcast they had a head on view of Brady and he really seems to hold the ball too long because of his late recognition of the coverage.

So I'd say it was a bad throw, but it was a bad throw because of a bad read. As if he realized halfway through his motion that he didn't want to throw it.

Similar concept to the one in the Clemson vs Alabama game a few weeks ago that fooled Tua. I remember thinking we should adpot that disguise, but instead it was used against us.

 

[Deus Irae]

I don't have a better angle, but I made this gif. I'm not sure that the ball was tipped.

Thanks for the effort, though my computer's fighting me on playback. But, if you don't think it was tipped, maybe I've been confusing plays.