Week 17 practice/roster news: MM practicing! TB, Gilly, Rex, Branch not

[RobertWeathers]

This is not true. I wish someone who has access to the 22s can show the numerous times Dorsett has been wide open. It is to the point that opposing teams know Brady does not look his way, so they don't bother covering the guy. It is particularly obvious on most of Brady's ints this season.

...which means either the QB or the coaching staff do not view him as a viable playmaker.

 

[maineman209]

Table scraps. Check downs.

You can't sit there and tell me he has been a playmaker in this offense. I know there is only enough balls to go around but he's had hundreds of snaps and to only be thrown at dozen or so times is bad.

Once Hogs and MM come back (maybe) he'll be buried again or gone

Dorsett's nine receptions in chronological order:

7 yds
23 yds
38 yds
17 yds
5 yds
11 yds
39 yds
4 yds
24 yds

Incomplete passes to Dorsett (4):

Wk-1 (KCY):
... Dorsett had one target, zero receptions.
... With 4:47 remaining in Q4 and KCY leading 35-27, Brady attempted a "deep middle" pass on 2nd-and-17 from the NE-18 to Dorsett that fell incomplete.
... Brady completed 16 of 36 passes for the game (44%) targeting 8 different players. Hogan caught 1 of 5; Burkhead caught 1 of 3; Cooks caught 3 of 7.

Wk-6 (@NYJ):
... Dorsett had three targets, zero receptions.
... With 3:13 remaining in Q2 (with the Jets leading 14-7), on 2nd-and-10 from the NE-21, Brady targeted Dorsett over the "deep middle". Buster Skrine INTERCEPTED at the NYJ-22 (57 yards downfield). The Jets failed to score on their ensuing possession.
... With 12:51 remaining in Q3 and the score tied at 14-all, on 2nd-and-13 from the NE-49, Brady targeted Dorsett "short right" and the pass was broken up by Darryl Roberts.
... Later on that same drive, from the NYJ-33, Brady targeted Dorsett "deep left" and the pass was broken up by Buster Skrine.
... Brady completed 18 of 38 passes for the game (53%) targeting 6 different players. Hogan caught 1 of 4 White caught 4 of 7; Gronk caught 6 of 10.

NOTE: These two games represent Brady's lowest (KCY) and second-lowest (@NYJ) completion percentages this season. His only other game below 63% was wk-14 @Mia.

=======
I'm not telling you or anyone else that Dorsett is a "playmaker".

Aside from saying that I think he's an underappreciated downfield blocker (the downfield blocking of most players who are not OL or TE is usually ignored), I'm not really characterizing Dorsett as anything in particular, and certainly not at either extreme of "playmaker" or "worthless". I'm mostly just posting his stats in the context of other potential pass-catchers this season. Seems to me that it's you who's characterizing him.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Dorsett's nine receptions in chronological order:

7 yds
23 yds
38 yds
17 yds
5 yds
11 yds
39 yds
4 yds
24 yds

Incomplete passes to Dorsett (4):

Wk-1 (KCY):
... Dorsett had one target, zero receptions.
... With 4:47 remaining in Q4 and KCY leading 35-27, Brady attempted a "deep middle" pass on 2nd-and-17 from the NE-18 to Dorsett that fell incomplete.
... Brady completed 16 of 36 passes for the game (44%) targeting 8 different players. Hogan caught 1 of 5; Burkhead caught 1 of 3; Cooks caught 3 of 7.

Wk-6 (@NYJ):
... Dorsett had three targets, zero receptions.
... With 3:13 remaining in Q2 (with the Jets leading 14-7), on 2nd-and-10 from the NE-21, Brady targeted Dorsett over the "deep middle". Buster Skrine INTERCEPTED at the NYJ-22 (57 yards downfield). The Jets failed to score on their ensuing possession.
... With 12:51 remaining in Q3 and the score tied at 14-all, on 2nd-and-13 from the NE-49, Brady targeted Dorsett "short right" and the pass was broken up by Darryl Roberts.
... Later on that same drive, from the NYJ-33, Brady targeted Dorsett "deep left" and the pass was broken up by Buster Skrine.
... Brady completed 18 of 38 passes for the game (53%) targeting 6 different players. Hogan caught 1 of 4 White caught 4 of 7; Gronk caught 6 of 10.

NOTE: These two games represent Brady's lowest (KCY) and second-lowest (@NYJ) completion percentages this season. His only other game below 63% was wk-14 @Mia.

=======
I'm not telling you or anyone else that Dorsett is a "playmaker".

Aside from saying that I think he's an underappreciated downfield blocker (the downfield blocking of most players who are not OL or TE is usually ignored), I'm not really characterizing Dorsett as anything in particular, and certainly not at either extreme of "playmaker" or "worthless". I'm mostly just posting his stats in the context of other potential pass-catchers this season. Seems to me that it's you who's characterizing him.

Britt is a very good run blocker and at 6-3 220. I'd rather have him out there.

 

[long distance]

Mike saw this thread and decided to join the discussion
(had exact same thought myself then)

 

[maineman209]

This is not true. I wish someone who has access to the 22s can show the numerous times Dorsett has been wide open. It is to the point that opposing teams know Brady does not look his way, so they don't bother covering the guy. It is particularly obvious on most of Brady's ints this season.

So, opposing defenses don't assign a player to cover Dorsett? He's just running around out there wide open and Brady deliberately doesn't even look at him but throws into coverage elsewhere instead?

If you seriously believe that, then you must also think that the Pats should have traded Brady and kept JG?

 

[maineman209]

Britt is a very good run blocker and at 6-3 220. I'd rather have him out there.

Based on what I've seen from tape review, Dorsett is also a very effective blocker.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Based on what I've seen from tape review, Dorsett is also a very effective blocker.

Agree. Hes done well but his size limits what he can do and who he can block

 

[luuked]

Mike saw this thread and decided to join the discussion
(had exact same thought myself then)

Great catch. I was about to add that to my answer to @TomPatriot when I just saw it on Twitter.

Here is a bit more context:

 

[primetime]

Britt is a very good run blocker and at 6-3 220. I'd rather have him out there.

Amendola proves that size really doesn't matter much when it comes to blocking as a wide receiver. Britt's never been anything but lazy as a downfield blocker. It's one of the stated reasons why the Titans kicked him to the curb a few years ago.

 

[luuked]

Agree. Hes done well but his size limits what he can do and who he can block

To me the argument boils down to who would you more trust to run the correct route in the playoffs ? Someone who by then has been here 3-4 weeks or someone who has been there since September ?

Who would you trust to actually finish decoy routes ? The guy who has been doing it diligently since he was traded here or the guy who was released by the Browns ?

Not saying that this is the way it will go but those are the thoughts in my mind when it comes to potentially deciding between the two.

The main reason I find Britt intriguing is because of his Rutgers days. Being there under Schiano means that somewhere inside of him has to be a mentally tough player who grinds away and doesnt just coast on "talent" and his size. I would love to see what he could do after a full offseason.

I am certainly not married to Dorsett but if I had to chose just with playoffs in mind (and MM coming back) I go with the latter.

 

[PatsFan2]

Mike saw this thread and decided to join the discussion
(had exact same thought myself then)

I don't see the comparisons Floyd bobbled a catchable pass. In the case of Britt: Brady was locked on the Defender read his eyes and made a great play...mistake QB. That said Brady went back to Britt shortly after for a moderate gain.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Amendola proves that size really doesn't matter much when it comes to blocking as a wide receiver. Britt's never been anything but lazy as a downfield blocker. It's one of the stated reasons why the Titans kicked him to the curb a few years ago.

...and that Titans organization was another train wreck while he was there.

Rams ran the ball very well in 2014 and 2015 when he was there.

2016 was a train wreck.

What I do know is the NEP signed him b/c they thought he could help them as a downfield blocker in the run game. I suspect if they felt he sucked at it, he would not be with the team.

 

[maineman209]

Agree. Hes done well but his size limits what he can do and who he can block

Yeah, at his size, Dorsett isn't going to be Gronk-spiking any LBs, but he's done a really effective job of getting in the way of LBs long enough to help spring Lewis and Burkhead on a few runs - and done so without drawing any flags by trying to overcompensate for his stature.

Getting in the way of a defender for long enough is the essence of blocking.

 

[PatsFan2]

To me the argument boils down to who would you more trust to run the correct route in the playoffs ? Someone who by then has been here 3-4 weeks or someone who has been there since September ?

Who would you trust to actually finish decoy routes ? The guy who has been doing it diligently since he was traded here or the guy who was released by the Browns ?

Not saying that this is the way it will go but those are the thoughts in my mind when it comes to potentially deciding between the two.

The main reason I find Britt intriguing is because of his Rutgers days. Being there under Schiano means that somewhere inside of him has to be a mentally tough player who grinds away and doesnt just coast on "talent" and his size. I would love to see what he could do after a full offseason.

I am certainly not married to Dorsett but if I had to chose just with playoffs in mind (and MM coming back) I go with the latter.

The Patriots need the Slant Route back in there Offense. Britt and Mitchell gives them that option...Cooks and Dorsett don't. Just think of Britt and Mitchell like the 2014 Brandon LaFell.

 

[luuked]

The Patriots need the Slant Route back in there Offense. Britt and Mitchell gives them that option...Cooks and Dorsett don't. Just think of Britt and Mitchell like the 2014 Brandon LaFell.

Whats your point ? Either Mitchell or Britt will be here anyway to catch potential slants. Nobody asks them to cut both.

 

[RobertWeathers]

To me the argument boils down to who would you more trust to run the correct route in the playoffs ? Someone who by then has been here 3-4 weeks or someone who has been there since September ?

Agree 100%. With that said in the playoffs Brady should only throw to Gronk, Cooks, Hogs (health), MM (health), White, DLew, Burk and DA. He should only throw to Allen, Britt and Dorsett when absolutely necessary as they are the last options.

Who would you trust to actually finish decoy routes ? The guy who has been doing it diligently since he was traded here or the guy who was released by the Browns ?

Saying, "released by the Browns" makes me think you have a bias against him? That organization is a **** show. I have zero confidence in its ability to evaluate talent and learn what makes a player tick

The decoy route argument is hollow to me. Brady throws to players a) who have a play designed for them in the progression and b) he trusts. I don't think either happens for Dorsett here. For whatever reason, he is not a part of the offense.

Not saying that this is the way it will go but those are the thoughts in my mind when it comes to potentially deciding between the two.

The main reason I find Britt intriguing is because of his Rutgers days. Being there under Schiano means that somewhere inside of him has to be a mentally tough player who grinds away and doesnt just coast on "talent" and his size. I would love to see what he could do after a full offseason.

I am certainly not married to Dorsett but if I had to chose just with playoffs in mind (and MM coming back) I go with the latter.

Here is what really concerns me about Britt.

I think Britt has a little of Blount and Dillon in him. If he is in a losing, uncomfortable environment he shuts down, gets distracted and does dumb things. He was erratic in TN. He was erratic in STL/LA (and still had a 1000yd year). He melted down in CLE. To your point he had structure at Rutgers. Its a big unknown if at 29 he can embrace the culture here and allow his ability to be maximized.

At the end of the day I believe he is more proven as a WR in the NFL and a more physically-gifted athlete than Dorsett. Plus hes more of a goal line threat (run and catch) than Dorsett.

It may be with only a few weeks to learn the offense is unrealistic to think he can do what Dorsett does not but if we are talking about decoy plays with 0% chance of getting the ball, choosing Britt over Dorsett seems like a better option.

 

[PatsFan2]

My point is if it comes down to it I think Dorsett would be the odd man out. I think he offers very little value on this Team.

 

[long distance]

There is a reasonable chance none of them makes it to the start of next season.
Nevertheless I wouldn't mind having both for 2018 preseason.
If you waive Dorsett - he's gone. If you waive Britt there's a good chance you can bring him back for next year if you want (again similar to Floyd).
__

To me Dorsett had a solid season under the circumstances/jobs he had to do. Possibly he was mostly insurance for Cooks . not only for this season/injury but possibly with future small speedster in mind. Cooks will likely have a big price tag at the end of 2018 . and if Dorsett can improve in the system during another year (like White and many other young “busts“ did here) and they can't sign Cooks . Dorsett would make a pretty handy insurance again..

 

[Betterthanmost]

So, opposing defenses don't assign a player to cover Dorsett? He's just running around out there wide open and Brady deliberately doesn't even look at him but throws into coverage elsewhere instead?

If you seriously believe that, then you must also think that the Pats should have traded Brady and kept JG?

Brady is the Goat. I don't have any stupid argument in my head about that. I am not criticizing Brady, I am just pointing out facts.

Lets play where is waldo. I mean Dorsett is so open, I think even you may find it hard to find him. This is what Josh was saying to Brady and he got all pissy.
Is something wrong with the insert img on this forum?

 

[fnordcircle]

I think the team values Dorsett and Allen a lot more than this board, probably because a lot of the value they're bringing doesn't show up in a statline.

I'm not saying that either of the two are awesome but I don't think they're out there getting snaps simply because the team couldn't find a better option in FA despite them both sucking as much as a lot of posters suggest...