Car@NE - Rewatch Thread

[NG Pats Fan]

Watch the defensive line on that touchdown...

So you have thre down lineman and a couple edge defenders standing up. I can't tell if the edge defenders are linebackers or not, I believe one of them is van noy.

So the call is one of the edge defenders runs a crossing blitz underneath through the inside tackle. The other edge defender blitzes on the outside.

Here's the problem:

Fundamentally, they did everything perfectly. Athletically, they are lacking.

1. The end who does the crossing blitz has a very slow burst off the snap..and takes way to long to make his break. Just not a lot of speed or athleticism there.

2. The interior lineman don't even try to hit any type of pass rush move despite the call being a blitz. All they do is bullrush forward, get stuffed, then knocked into each other

3. The last edge rusher ( was this van Noy?) is so slow getting off the snap that by the time he even reaches the right tackle, newton practically has the ball out of his hands..and of course the pass rush move he attempts to make is a very weak shuck and doesn't fool the tackle at all. Whoever this last edge rusher is, he showed poor burst, poor speed, and a weak pass rushing move


No pressure in newtons face = easy touchdown connection.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

And another one.. and again Gilmore not involved in the bust



Maybe we can slowly stop bashing Gilmore specifically..

I'd like to see the actual pre-snap here. Butler is lined up right across from Funchess so if they were in man coverage Butler really messed up but wound up with the serendipitous interception. But I suspect he thinks they're in some sort of zone. I can't really tell what is correct from these screen shots. Given how the rest of the game (and season) has played out so far, I suspect Butler is right and Rowe was wrong again, but I can't tell at this point.

 

[luuked]

Watch the defensive line on that touchdown...

So you have thre down lineman and a couple edge defenders standing up. I can't tell if the edge defenders are linebackers or not, I believe one of them is van noy.

So the call is one of the edge defenders runs a crossing blitz underneath through the inside tackle. The other edge defender blitzes on the outside.

Here's the problem:

Fundamentally, they did everything perfectly. Athletically, they are lacking.

1. The end who does the crossing blitz has a very slow burst off the snap..and takes way to long to make his break. Just not a lot of speed or athleticism there.

2. The interior lineman don't even try to hit any type of pass rush move despite the call being a blitz. All they do is bullrush forward, get stuffed, then knocked into each other

3. The last edge rusher ( was this van Noy?) is so slow getting off the snap that by the time he even reaches the right tackle, newton practically has the ball out of his hands..and of course the pass rush move he attempts to make is a very weak shuck and doesn't fool the tackle at all. Whoever this last edge rusher is, he showed poor burst, poor speed, and a weak pass rushing move


No pressure in newtons face = easy touchdown connection.

Just to be sure, since you said touchdown I assume you are talking about:



Correct ?

 

[Kontradiction]

And another one.. and again Gilmore not involved in the bust



Maybe we can slowly stop bashing Gilmore specifically..

Yeah it's looking more and more like a lot of this is actually falling on McCourty. Rodney said as much last night, too. As the captain and the leader of the secondary, it's going to be up to him to make sure everyone knows their assignments if they're confused. Rowe had a god awful game yesterday as well as these plays have shown.

 

[luuked]

I'd like to see the actual pre-snap here. Butler is lined up right across from Funchess so if they were in man coverage Butler really messed up but wound up with the serendipitous interception. But I suspect he thinks they're in some sort of zone. I can't really tell what is correct from these screen shots. Given how the rest of the game (and season) has played out so far, I suspect Butler is right and Rowe was wrong again, but I can't tell at this point.

I cant wait for the coaches tape to be available on gamepass so we can get the full presnap sequence for some of those scenes. The broadcast version is unfortunately limited.

 

[luuked]

Yeah it's looking more and more like a lot of this is actually falling on McCourty. Rodney said as much last night, too. As the captain and the leader of the secondary, it's going to be up to him to make sure everyone knows their assignments if they're confused. Rowe had a god awful game yesterday as well as these plays have shown.

I agree sort of. The only thing that makes me take it a bit easy on DMac is that if there are so many breakdowns all over the field with sometimes multiple players doing different things at the same time then realistically there is not much he can do to rescue the play (except call a TO). There seems to be a fundamental issue with understanding the play/scheme which is just baffling to me as I have yet to see anything really complex.

 

[long distance]

@luuked . Great to open the thread early since we are on a short week (thank heavens) and long list of doom threads

I actually had a “request“ for Tony (or somebody) to assemble just all pre-snaps. Because what we see above was the rule not exception in communicating. To me the problem is not the miscommunication - the problem is that this sort of overdose-communication is allowed/tolerated.

This is not the first game everyone is signalling everybody - while the snap is already on! So to me this is as much on the coaches as on the players. Coaches need to stop allowing/tolerating this. And as someone said perfectly before - telling other people what to do is simply against the #1 principle here - do your job. Green dot signals the call and that's it. If someone blows or doesn't understand his assignment good. At least it will be one guy blowing it not the whole group and at least its clear where the problem is.

In the last re-watch thread I posted mic'd up KVN sharing a sense that he doesn't sound like a leader, commander or somebody that would put some fire in the unit - because fire, hunger (the problem from game 1, remember) is still a problem (thanks for posting that Rowe clip because of all the ugly plays on D to me that was the ugliest). Then you have Roberts correcting KVN's own alignment just before snap etc.etc.

Im posting it here again to take note what LB coach is saying to players @0:44



_____

Im also not too worried about this secondary going forward - but this just has to stop

 

[SammyBlueCat]

Receivers of all shapes and sizes and skill levels running freely and openly all over the field must stop.

 

[long distance]

And another one.. and again Gilmore not involved in the bust



Maybe we can slowly stop bashing Gilmore specifically..

I wanted to point out that as well. There were quite a few more blown coverages but fortunately Cam is not good enough at the moment to take advantage. Also in the two last drives (IIRC) he had wide open receivers but didn't execute.

It felt so frustrating that Pats couldn't win against QB in a bad form even when winning turnover battle. But did they really win the turnover battle? Busted coverages like that are worse than TOs..

 

[luuked]

It felt so frustrating that Pats couldn't win against QB in a bad form even when winning turnover battle. But did they really win the turnover battle? Busted coverages like that are worse than TOs..

That is such a good point.

 

[long distance]

Watch the defensive line on that touchdown...

So you have thre down lineman and a couple edge defenders standing up. I can't tell if the edge defenders are linebackers or not, I believe one of them is van noy.

So the call is one of the edge defenders runs a crossing blitz underneath through the inside tackle. The other edge defender blitzes on the outside.

Here's the problem:

Fundamentally, they did everything perfectly. Athletically, they are lacking.

1. The end who does the crossing blitz has a very slow burst off the snap..and takes way to long to make his break. Just not a lot of speed or athleticism there.

2. The interior lineman don't even try to hit any type of pass rush move despite the call being a blitz. All they do is bullrush forward, get stuffed, then knocked into each other

3. The last edge rusher ( was this van Noy?) is so slow getting off the snap that by the time he even reaches the right tackle, newton practically has the ball out of his hands..and of course the pass rush move he attempts to make is a very weak shuck and doesn't fool the tackle at all. Whoever this last edge rusher is, he showed poor burst, poor speed, and a weak pass rushing move


No pressure in newtons face = easy touchdown connection.

“Athletic“ liability of front 7 is a valid point that we should examine . but with some more “evidence“ and context. Burst, speed etc. is not just about athletic ability. Experience (individual as well as collective), understanding (of the game, call etc.), mutual understanding (with the whole unit), self-confidence (lightens thinking, relaxes muscles), energy of the unit etc. - play significant role in “athletic“ performance/execution.

Since secondary worries are mostly about communication/understanding I wouldn't mind having some “re-watch“ analysis discussion of front 7 here..

 

[luuked]

Since secondary worries are mostly about communication/understanding I wouldn't mind having some “re-watch“ analysis discussion of front 7 here..

I agree. After Dussault wrote that he is more concerned about the front 7 than the secondary I am really curious how they looked.

 

[long distance]

That is such a good point.

I don't mind the 2-2 or care for #1 seed etc. . but its really absurd to give away two games like that . esp. w the toughest part of the schedule ahead.. Thankfully both Bills games come in Dec.

 

[ALP]

im not sure who, or when, but someone clearly look atthe INT play, and 17 wasn't wide open, it was Butler's man, and as soon as Butler got sense that Cam was going deep, he dropped 17 off, and bracketed the WR, hence got the INT

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

And another one.. and again Gilmore not involved in the bust



Maybe we can slowly stop bashing Gilmore specifically..

I think we all can agree that the entire secondary played like trash yesterday and has played like trash pretty much the entire year. The reason Gilmore is taking the brunt (and I’m guilty of it) is because he’s the new member of that group and that huge contract he signed. Compared to Rowe who’s still under his rookie deal this puts a huge target on Gilmore’s back to live up to the money he’s getting paid. It’s early but so far he hasn’t been that #1 corner this team needs. And neither has butler.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

Just to be sure, since you said touchdown I assume you are talking about:



Correct ?

Yes

 

[NG Pats Fan]

@luuked . Great to open the thread early since we are on a short week (thank heavens) and long list of doom threads

I actually had a “request“ for Tony (or somebody) to assemble just all pre-snaps. Because what we see above was the rule not exception in communicating. To me the problem is not the miscommunication - the problem is that this sort of overdose-communication is allowed/tolerated.

This is not the first game everyone is signalling everybody - while the snap is already on! So to me this is as much on the coaches as on the players. Coaches need to stop allowing/tolerating this. And as someone said perfectly before - telling other people what to do is simply against the #1 principle here - do your job. Green dot signals the call and that's it. If someone blows or doesn't understand his assignment good. At least it will be one guy blowing it not the whole group and at least its clear where the problem is.

In the last re-watch thread I posted mic'd up KVN sharing a sense that he doesn't sound like a leader, commander or somebody that would put some fire in the unit - because fire, hunger (the problem from game 1, remember) is still a problem (thanks for posting that Rowe clip because of all the ugly plays on D to me that was the ugliest). Then you have Roberts correcting KVN's own alignment just before snap etc.etc.

Im posting it here again to take note what LB coach is saying to players @0:44



_____

Im also not too worried about this secondary going forward - but this just has to stop

Wow Van Noy sounds like one of the least inspiring leaders I have ever heard. Not a leader at all.

Linebacker upgrade is a major priority next offseason

 

[luuked]

im not sure who, or when, but someone clearly look atthe INT play, and 17 wasn't wide open, it was Butler's man, and as soon as Butler got sense that Cam was going deep, he dropped 17 off, and bracketed the WR, hence got the INT

Butler is already off running deep leaving #17 open before Newton even starts a throwing motion.



I dont get why anyone would disagree that he played poker in this scene and assumed that Cam would not follow through on his progressions. There is clearly more than enough time for Newton to go to #17. He got lucky this time..

 

[WaterfallJumper]

No

Thanks for your insight.

 

[long distance]

OT - maybe they should move TB on D for a game or two