Reiss: Pats won’t pick up 5th year option on DTs Danny Shelton and Malcolm Brown

[Deus Irae]

My biggest concern with my post was that it was too self-evident and thus superfluous. Yes, the pollyannas are over-represented on this site, but the overall negativity of New England is a well known and often discussed thing. Reporters in other parts of the country constantly talk about whether player x is a good fit for New England based on his ability to handle the negativity. I mean, come on, just turn on any sports show in Boston.

The entire northeast (Not just New England) trends very critical. that doesn't make

Negativism is deeply ingrained in the New England psyche. No other place (that I know of anyway, with the possible exception of other NE cities) takes delight in bashing their team.

true, as anyone who's listened to New York, New Jersey or Philadelphia sports radio could tell you. For that matter, while it's been years since I've listened to it, Miami sports talk used to be the pretty much the same way.

 

[Kontradiction]

The entire northeast (Not just New England) trends very critical. that doesn't make



true, as anyone who's listened to New York, New Jersey or Philadelphia sports radio could tell you. For that matter, while it's been years since I've listened to it, Miami sports talk used to be the pretty much the same way.

According to relatives that I have living down there, it's just gotten worse.

 

[Deus Irae]

Are you feeling okay? I specifically mentioned other northeast cities, and you even quoted where I did so.

I feel fine. If you had posted with any consistency

Only in New England could a team go to 10 SBs, have the greatest dynasty in NFL history, and people still constantly rant about what bums they are.

would not have been part of that post. Also, when you lead off with "New England", and you later abbreviate with "NE", some people are naturally going to figure that NE means New England, and that leads to the idea that your "other NE cities" is a mangled way of talking about Providence, etc...

As an aside, your postings seem reminiscent of a recent prolific poster who is no longer with us.

 

[Deus Irae]

According to relatives that I have living down there, it's just gotten worse.

That doesn't surprise me, given the recent history of the Heat, Dolphins, and Marlins. Crappy ownership down there had been in the process of alienating the fans for years, even before I moved north. And, given the number of transplants from the northeast, the reaction was going about the way one would expect.

 

[MassPats38]

Negativism is deeply ingrained in the New England psyche. No other place (that I know of anyway, with the possible exception of other northeast cities) takes delight in bashing their team. I live in Texas now, and people love the Cowboys. If anything, they are annoying in how they constantly overestimate the Cowboys' chances. Only in New England could a team go to 10 SBs, have the greatest dynasty in NFL history, and people still constantly rant about what bums they are.

I live in Texas as well, and there are plenty of folks bashing on the Cowboys who are fans of the team. An extended run of success (in contrast to the Boys, who became less than successful prior to the Pats run two decades ago) likely breeds a different fan with different expectations (consider Pats fans age 23 and younger probably were never aware of a team without Super Bowl goals/fans 30 and under never lived the Patsies years when a win was huge).

People appreciate playoff runs when that is new. A first round win is old hat now for the Pats, so people are not dancing in the streets after that. The Boys fans were annoying in the early 90s, and still would grumble after losses despite the run of success.

I would agree with Deus that every fan base runs the spectrum of optimism to pessimism. The difference in Texas, in my opinion, is the media on the hometown teams. I haven't heard a ton of negativity here in that regard.

 

[maust]

Ray Farmer was the Browns DC and was fired.

Ray Farmer has never been a DC, or for that matter a coach, anywhere. Although he has been known to play coach in his head by texting one from the stands

 

[luuked]

Negativism is deeply ingrained in the New England psyche.

The pessimism is one thing but combine it with people who are too lazy to actually understand the sport they are watching beyond fantasy football and an unwillingness to research things and you get the pimpin group of bozos that can be observed in this thread.

Half of the people don't know the difference between a Will, Sam and a Mike or what the job of DEs in a BB scheme is but they keep *****ing about slow LBs and how we should have kept Chandler Jones even though he was a total misfit for a BB defense once he got beyond his rookie deal.

On the same note they call someone that got drafted at #31 and played in 45 out of 48 regular season games a bust.

No clue about anything that goes beyond the surface of the sport, no clue about drafting philosophies or success rates but boy if there is a TMZ level thread about the newest burp from Brady or Gronk about not feeling appreciated they will post the **** out of it in there. After all gossiping doesn't require any time investment or knowledge..

 

[Deus Irae]

The pessimism is one thing but combine it with people who are too lazy to actually understand the sport they are watching beyond fantasy football and an unwillingness to research things and you get the pimpin group of bozos that can be observed in this thread.

Half of the people don't know the difference between a Will, Sam and a Mike or what the job of DEs in a BB scheme is but they keep *****ing about slow LBs and how we should have kept Chandler Jones even though he was a total misfit for a BB defense once he got beyond his rookie deal.

On the same note they call someone that got drafted at #31 and played in 45 out of 48 regular season games a bust.

No clue about anything that goes beyond the surface of the sport, no clue about drafting philosophies or success rates but boy if there is a TMZ level thread about the newest burp from Brady or Gronk about not feeling appreciated they will post the **** out of it in there. After all gossiping doesn't require any time investment or knowledge..

Yep. And the thing that is amazing is that they're getting their information from media folks who are remarkably ignorant about the game themselves, especially for a city that prides itself on being smart and knowledgeable about sports.

 

[PP2]

It was the 5th year option of their rookie contracts.

Which is cheaper than a veteran contract, and that's the point I was trying to make- that I don't remember the Pats ever paying out the last year of any player's contract. They either cut or resign before the last year kicks in, and it's usually a balloon payment.

 

[maust]

Which is cheaper than a veteran contract, and that's the point I was trying to make- that I don't remember the Pats ever paying out the last year of any player's contract. They either cut or resign before the last year kicks in, and it's usually a balloon payment.

Or, as done most recently with Cooks, trade him

 

[borisman]

2019 Salaries for DT's : Is either as good as these players?
NFL Rankings

1
Fletcher Cox
Defensive Tackle $17,100,000
2
Kawann Short
Defensive Tackle $16,100,000
3
Marcell Dareus
Defensive Tackle $16,095,686
4
Gerald McCoy
Defensive Tackle $15,866,667
5
Jurrell Casey
Defensive Tackle $15,100,000
6
Malik Jackson
Defensive Tackle $14,250,000
7
Linval Joseph
Defensive Tackle $12,587,500
8
Timmy Jernigan
Defensive Tackle $12,000,000
9
Michael Brockers
Defensive Tackle $11,083,333
10
Brandon Williams
Defensive Tackle $10,500,000
11
Corey Liuget
Defensive Tackle $10,250,000


Mike Daniels
Defensive Tackle $10,250,000
13
Star Lotulelei
Defensive Tackle $10,000,000
14
Dontari Poe
Defensive Tackle $9,333,333
15
Damon Harrison
Defensive Tackle $9,250,000

I see several of overpaids on this list. Next year's DL draft class will match this lineup easily. It's LOADED so don't fret over not picking up Brown and Shelton's options. We can trade back and still pick-up a good tackle, though most of the greats will be gone but plenty of edge rushers. They still count as DLmen, right?

 

[Ring 6]

Which is cheaper than a veteran contract, and that's the point I was trying to make- that I don't remember the Pats ever paying out the last year of any player's contract. They either cut or resign before the last year kicks in, and it's usually a balloon payment.

But they did pick up the 5th options on those players.

I’m not sure why you feel the 5th year option is cheaper, it depends upon what the player will be worth on the open market.
They didn’t cut or resign Hightower or Jones or solder they exercised the 5th year option. ( going by another posters comment for solder because I dontremember if 5th year options were before or after him)

 

[Ivan]

Yeah I agree, especially since they just gave up a 3rd rounder for him. If he walks, it’s a waste.

That depends. Much like Trent Brown if Shelton walks after a year the compensation depends upon the contract they get. So if either get good deals then the Patriots actually got them for nothing, as they get 3rd rounders back for the 3rd rounders they used.

 

[ATippett56]

Negativism is deeply ingrained in the New England psyche. No other place (that I know of anyway, with the possible exception of other northeast cities) takes delight in bashing their team. I live in Texas now, and people love the Cowboys. If anything, they are annoying in how they constantly overestimate the Cowboys' chances. Only in New England could a team go to 10 SBs, have the greatest dynasty in NFL history, and people still constantly rant about what bums they are.

Borges, Ron
Felger, Michael

 

[maust]

Which is cheaper than a veteran contract, and that's the point I was trying to make- that I don't remember the Pats ever paying out the last year of any player's contract. They either cut or resign before the last year kicks in, and it's usually a balloon payment.

But they did pick up the 5th options on those players.

I’m not sure why you feel the 5th year option is cheaper, it depends upon what the player will be worth on the open market.
They didn’t cut or resign Hightower or Jones or solder they exercised the 5th year option. ( going by another posters comment for solder because I dontremember if 5th year options were before or after him)

Once again you failed to understand the point being made. The operative phrase was "I don't remember the Pats ever paying out the last year of any player's contract" and as a rule they do not. Jones and Cooks had their options picked up but were traded before the option year kicked in. Solder's option was picked up but he was extended before the final year kicked in, the lower priced option year was his incentive to extend. Hightower had his option picked up and due to injury concerns he was the rare Patriot star that actually played out the last year of a contract. If a player is a success the option year is less than market value, it provides a heck of a negotiating position for the team.

 

[Ring 6]

Once again you failed to understand the point being made. The operative phrase was "I don't remember the Pats ever paying out the last year of any player's contract" and as a rule they do not. Jones and Cooks had their options picked up but were traded before the option year kicked in. Solder's option was picked up but he was extended before the final year kicked in, the lower priced option year was his incentive to extend. Hightower had his option picked up and due to injury concerns he was the rare Patriot star that actually played out the last year of a contract. If a player is a success the option year is less than market value, it provides a heck of a negotiating position for the team.

Nope.

 

[maust]

Nope.

Thanks for being nonsensical in as few words as possible for a change, huge improvement that

 

[Ochmed Jones]

I think brown has been very good for what he is, a two gapping run stuffed dt that provides little pass rush.

I suspect him and Shelton to eliminate the opponents inside run game and keep the linebackers clean.

 

[cmasspatsfan]

The pessimism is one thing but combine it with people who are too lazy to actually understand the sport they are watching beyond fantasy football and an unwillingness to research things and you get the pimpin group of bozos that can be observed in this thread.

Half of the people don't know the difference between a Will, Sam and a Mike or what the job of DEs in a BB scheme is but they keep *****ing about slow LBs and how we should have kept Chandler Jones even though he was a total misfit for a BB defense once he got beyond his rookie deal.

On the same note they call someone that got drafted at #31 and played in 45 out of 48 regular season games a bust.

No clue about anything that goes beyond the surface of the sport, no clue about drafting philosophies or success rates but boy if there is a TMZ level thread about the newest burp from Brady or Gronk about not feeling appreciated they will post the **** out of it in there. After all gossiping doesn't require any time investment or knowledge..

You just described the Felger and Mazz show.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

Just for reference, the entire Patriots rookie pool this year is around $7.8 M. Factoring in the top 51 contracts, that's likely a cap hit of 4 - 5 million (someone please correct my approximations). While Brown is a solid starting DT, the other two are question marks with some promising traits. The value just isn't there to pick up their 5th year options.