Bennett doesn't think Brady is GOAT that he has played with?

[MitchKumstein]

If any of us had been working at a company for a couple of months and then went out to lunch with a group of coworkers, and at that lunch were asked in front of everyone what was the best place that they ever worked, I would hope that the answer for every one of us would be "This company, by far"

 

[JetFan79]

Well that's your rule. Brady has done enough. I can't think of anything a prespective of a 10 year wait would do to change what he has achieved. Maybe someone can make a hisoric 5 or more year run but it's unlikely with free agency........One quarback had mastered that formula and we all know which one that is.

What happens if over the next decade they give QBs different color jerseys and make it so they can't be touched at all? And also say that you can't hit a WR for at least 2 seconds after catching a ball? Maybe you can only hold the WR and then only tackle him after a second or two.

That could alter the stats and performances a ton.

Sounds ridiculous, sure. But I'd argue if you look at the game in the 60s/70s/80s and compare it to now, the changes that have already occurred are even more drastic. You used to be able to demolish QBs and WRs. Now if you tap a QB's helmet with your pinky, or hit a WR up high, it's a penalty.

So that's why I think you need time to pass so you can really take the different generations of the game into account.

I dunno, maybe it's more fun to buy into what the league and advertisers are selling and just believe every generation are the new goats... not my thing though.

 

[jah]

What happens if over the next decade they give QBs different color jerseys and make it so they can't be touched at all? And also say that you can't hit a WR for at least 2 seconds after catching a ball? Maybe you can only hold the WR and then only table him after a second or two.

That could alter the stats and performances a ton.

Sounds ridiculous, sure. But I'd argue if you look at the game in the 60s/70s/80s and compare it to now, the changes that have already occurred are even more drastic. You used to be able to demolish QBs and WRs. Now if you tap a QB's helmet with your pinky, or hit a WR up high, it's a penalty.

So that's why I think you need time to pass so you can really take the different generations of the game into account.

I dunno, maybe it's more fun to buy into what the league and advertisers are selling and just believe every generation are the new goats... not my thing though.

Sounds valid enough to me. I choose to believe Brady is the GOAT but at the end of the day, it's a made up distinction.

 

[Tony2046]

Na, it takes time to accurately view/judge things like this. Once Brees, Manning, Brady, Hackenberg and Rodgers have retired... wait a decade, and then it'll be easier to look back and compare them to each other and the greats before them.

Much easier to weigh all the different variables like stats, rule changes, state of the game at the time, and so on.

Otherwise you always have current fans screaming, "oh this guy is the goat!" Look at the NBA. Kids think that Steph guy is the goat. Seems like a symptom of the human condition. Always have to be important somehow.

I'll label your post as delusionally objective.

You can't use "rule changes" or "state of the game" when comparing Brady to Manning, Brees or Rodgers because they all play or played in the same era. You can't transplant an era vs era or Brady vs Montana argument into a Rodgers vs Brady query.

You don't need a decade to compare stats or watch game film. Aaron 1-0 vs Brady 5-2.

Aaron is just the next Manning. The next fallback guy for those who refuse to choose Tom Brady.

Actually Aaron is better than Manning. He has a perfect Super Bowl record. Or is that argument only valid when comparing Brady vs Joe?

 

[JetFan79]

I'll label your post as delusionally objective.

You can't use "rule changes" or "state of the game" when comparing Brady to Manning, Brees or Rodgers because they all play or played in the same era. You can't transplant an era vs era or Brady vs Montana argument into a Rodgers vs Brady query.

You don't need a decade to compare stats or watch game film. Aaron 1-0 vs Brady 5-2.

Aaron is just the next Manning. The next fallback guy for those who refuse to choose Tom Brady.

Actually Aaron is better than Manning. He has a perfect Super Bowl record. Or is that argument only valid when comparing Brady vs Joe?

Comparing those three will be a great debate down the road a bit. Aaron is at a disadvantage now because he's no where near done yet.

But Aaron could easily be the best combined package of skills ever at QB.

Peyton, even after his physical ability faded, was able to win with just pure football brilliance.

And Tommy? Unmatched competitiveness, unreal ability to read a D and find the open guy in under two seconds. The guy could almost play w/o an oline.

 

[Galeb]

Comparing those three will be a great debate down the road a bit. Aaron is at a disadvantage now because he's no where near done yet.

But Aaron could easily be the best combined package of skills ever at QB.

Peyton, even after his physical ability faded, was able to win with just pure football brilliance.

And Tommy? Unmatched competitiveness, unreal ability to read a D and find the open guy in under two seconds. The guy could almost play w/o an oline.

You miss Brady's most important quality. The humility to truly evaluate self and change. He doesn't just do it between seasons, he does it between plays. Few people who live achieve that level of flexibility, and it is that that separates him from the rest of the competition.

In 20 years, Brady will be the only one in the discussion for GOAT... and that's if he never plays another game.

 

[50-yard-line]

I don't think it has to do with emotion as much as the ability to always see the whole field, anticipate and quickly process toward making the right decision. That compensates for a lot of relative physical shortcomings.

There's that, I agree, but Rodgers' biggest drawback is that he is risk-averse when he needs to take a chance (Hail Mary's excepted).

 

[JetFan79]

You miss Brady's most important quality. The humility to truly evaluate self and change. He doesn't just do it between seasons, he does it between plays. Few people who live achieve that level of flexibility, and it is that that separates him from the rest of the competition.

In 20 years, Brady will be the only one in the discussion for GOAT... and that's if he never plays another game.

Whoa, slow down there. This is Tom Brady we're discussing here. Not some master of Self.

 

[Galeb]

Whoa, slow down there. This is Tom Brady we're discussing here. Not some master of Self.

His mastery of self at the age of 40 is greater than the vast majority of people will ever achieve in their entire lives. Your refusal to acknowledge this point has no impact on the truth of it.

 

[The Brandon Five]

What happens if over the next decade they give QBs different color jerseys and make it so they can't be touched at all? And also say that you can't hit a WR for at least 2 seconds after catching a ball? Maybe you can only hold the WR and then only tackle him after a second or two.

That could alter the stats and performances a ton.

Sounds ridiculous, sure. But I'd argue if you look at the game in the 60s/70s/80s and compare it to now, the changes that have already occurred are even more drastic. You used to be able to demolish QBs and WRs. Now if you tap a QB's helmet with your pinky, or hit a WR up high, it's a penalty.

So that's why I think you need time to pass so you can really take the different generations of the game into account.

I dunno, maybe it's more fun to buy into what the league and advertisers are selling and just believe every generation are the new goats... not my thing though.

Unless you're the Broncos, in which case fire at will.

Broncos repeatedly hit Cam Newton helmet-to-helmet

 

[Tony2046]

Comparing those three will be a great debate down the road a bit. Aaron is at a disadvantage now because he's no where near done yet.

But Aaron could easily be the best combined package of skills ever at QB.

Peyton, even after his physical ability faded, was able to win with just pure football brilliance.

And Tommy? Unmatched competitiveness, unreal ability to read a D and find the open guy in under two seconds. The guy could almost play w/o an oline.

Aaron is a good QB with elite broken play skills. He is one of the best pre-snap QB's in the league and keeps the Defense on their toes the entire game but he doesn't consistently find his mismatches etc.. He is often one of the league leaders statistically in "time to throw" and sacks taken. He's fun and exciting to watch but his game relies on the broken play.

Anyways as you say he isn't done yet but as of right now he's just a better version of Russell Wilson. He's not in Brady or Manning territory.

 

[TBR]

Watch him play. The guy is flat out amazing at times. The way he can shimmy around the pocket extending plays like he has some 6th sense and then make a sick throw that maybe only he could pull off.

It's not insanity. I'm not saying who I'd choose. Would probably depend on other variables (scheme, coaches, weapons...). But I'm sure if you polled the masses, the results would be pretty evenly split.

Aaron Rodgers has deposited $3 in your PayPal account.

It's not a debate. It really isn't. Rodgers is a complete nobody compared to Brady. I feel like I'm complimenting him by even putting his name in the same sentence as Brady.

1 damn ring vs 5, multiple all-time records, nearly all post-season records (you know, the hardest games, the ones that matter most) and top of the leaderboard for nearly every statistical category. It's mind blowing to me that I still have to waste time on such a subject.

I do not care about random throws he may make. Russel Wilson makes crazy throws too. As does Cam Newton.

This is like arguing Stephen Curry is the greatest basketball player of all time because he can make shots that Jordan can't make.

 

[Tunescribe]

Lol, hold your breath.

No, I hold my nose.

 

[PatsWSB47]

What happens if over the next decade they give QBs different color jerseys and make it so they can't be touched at all? And also say that you can't hit a WR for at least 2 seconds after catching a ball? Maybe you can only hold the WR and then only tackle him after a second or two.

That could alter the stats and performances a ton.

Sounds ridiculous, sure. But I'd argue if you look at the game in the 60s/70s/80s and compare it to now, the changes that have already occurred are even more drastic. You used to be able to demolish QBs and WRs. Now if you tap a QB's helmet with your pinky, or hit a WR up high, it's a penalty.

So that's why I think you need time to pass so you can really take the different generations of the game into account.

I dunno, maybe it's more fun to buy into what the league and advertisers are selling and just believe every generation are the new goats... not my thing though.

You miss the point. If the rules change little or radically it doesn't matter. Sure stats would change or not depending on what the rules changes were but a player that figures out how to outshine everyone else in that environment consistently over a long period of time will be the one who will be in the GOAT conversation. Right now Brady has been that guy. In the days when quarterbacks we're demolished only a few elites stood apart. Only Montana wound up being considered the GOAT. Today even middle of the road QBs exceed many if his stats. Any thoughtful fan realizes that Montana maintains greatness over them. Don't mix up stats alone as the difference maker. Will, desire and leadership consistently over time is what makes a player an all time great. Right play at right time, knowing what to do and when to do it and actually executing it under any scenario more than anyone else makes a GOAT. Throwing for 10k yards and 75 TDs in some mamby pamby soft NFL does not.

 

[JetFan79]

You miss the point. If the rules change little or radically it doesn't matter. Sure stats would change or not depending on what the rules changes were but a player that figures out how to outshine everyone else in that environment consistently over a long period of time will be the one who will be in the GOAT conversation. Right now Brady has been that guy. In the days when quarterbacks we're demolished only a few elites stood apart. Only Montana wound up being considered the GOAT. Today even middle of the road QBs exceed many if his stats. Any thoughtful fan realizes that Montana maintains greatness over them. Don't mix up stats alone as the difference maker. Will, desire and leadership consistently over time is what makes a player an all time great. Right play at right time, knowing what to do and when to do it and actually executing it under any scenario more than anyone else makes a GOAT. Throwing for 10k yards and 75 TDs in some mamby pamby soft NFL does not.

Perhaps the solution is to change the spelling of GOAT.

To GOTE.

Instead of Greatest Of All Time, it'll be Greatest Of The Era.

Otherwise how else do ya compare a QB playing in this softened league to Montana or Unitas?

Would any of the QBs playing now do well with Deacon Jones torturing them and say Ronnie Lott demolishing their WRs for even attempting to catch a ball over the middle?

Could Unitas handle making 5 reads in a matter of 3 or 4 seconds and consistently throwing 50+ passes a game and for over 5,000yds a year?

Too damn tough to judge. Perhaps each fan will choose their own goat based on the era of football they like the most. (I'm which case I'm leaning towards Montana.)

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

Excluding Bennett (or perhaps not) I'm starting to wonder if Rodgers pays people to shill for him online. Why am I constantly seeing "Brady vs Rodgers" everywhere as if it's even a rational debate to have? It's flat out absurd. Where the hell does it come from?

They had to move on from Brady vs. Manning (something to queue the calls, make clicks, ...)

The thing they don't mention is, what happens to Rodgers when some of his "legs" begin to leave him (assuming they do as he's 33 years old and still going strong)

At the end of the day, ask the QBs who's career they would love to change places with and all of them would list TFB.

Game
Set
Match

 

[Joey007]

Bennett: "Aaron what's the play?"

Aaron: "Go get open"

There's actually truth to this is what's crazy. Green Bay relies solely on talent, and chucking the ball up half the time, not actual strategized plays.

So really they're the Ravens, only with a QB who's actually good.

 

[PatsWSB47]

Perhaps the solution is to change the spelling of GOAT.

To GOTE.

Instead of Greatest Of All Time, it'll be Greatest Of The Era.

Otherwise how else do ya compare a QB playing in this softened league to Montana or Unitas?

Would any of the QBs playing now do well with Deacon Jones torturing them and say Ronnie Lott demolishing their WRs for even attempting to catch a ball over the middle?

Could Unitas handle making 5 reads in a matter of 3 or 4 seconds and consistently throwing 50+ passes a game and for over 5,000yds a year?

Too damn tough to judge. Perhaps each fan will choose their own goat based on the era of football they like the most. (I'm which case I'm leaning towards Montana.)

stop with the stats as the difference maker. I won't eliminate anyone because of stats because as you say they move with rule changes. Winning under the circumstances of whatever era you are in is more important. A quarterback rating of 95 30 years ago vs one of 110 today may be very comparable because of the rules. Brady's yards an TD passes have to far exceed QBs of earlier eras but that alone won't make him the GOAT. It's all the other things he's accomplished that no one can match that sets him apart. Some day someone may, but it won't be stats, especially in season stats that do it. You seemed to be trying too hard to eliminate Brady from the GOAT. You have basically painted yourself in a corner to where you have to deny anyone vwr can be a GOAT in football though you areno against the concept because you allow it for basketball. Let it go. Brady is currently the GOAT.

 

[JetFan79]

stop with the stats as the difference maker. I won't eliminate anyone because of stats because as you say they move with rule changes. Winning under the circumstances of whatever era you are in is more important. A quarterback rating of 95 30 years ago vs one of 110 today may be very comparable because of the rules. Brady's yards an TD passes have to far exceed QBs of earlier eras but that alone won't make him the GOAT. It's all the other things he's accomplished that no one can match that sets him apart. Some day someone may, but it won't be stats, especially in season stats that do it. You seemed to be trying too hard to eliminate Brady from the GOAT. You have basically painted yourself in a corner to where you have to deny anyone vwr can be a GOAT in football though you areno against the concept because you allow it for basketball. Let it go. Brady is currently the GOAT.

Basketball may have changed a bit over time, but not nearly as much as football.

I'm not saying the determining factor is just stats. I'm saying I can't consider someone the goat if they play in an era that I don't consider as relevant as others.

The fact Brady has more rings than his counterparts means very little to me. It means something, but not much.

Hell White has a ring, is he better than Barry Sanders?

You seem to want everyone to just agree TB is the goat. I'll give the guy a crap-ton of credit and include him in the conversation for sure. But, as you can see from recent polls with only current players as options, the majority of fans don't even give TB that win.

I was trying to find a resolution that'd make ya happy but not sure that's gonna be possible.

 

[PatsWSB47]

Basketball may have changed a bit over time, but not nearly as much as football.

I'm not saying the determining factor is just stats. I'm saying I can't consider someone the goat if they play in an era that I don't consider as relevant as others.

The fact Brady has more rings than his counterparts means very little to me. It means something, but not much.

Hell White has a ring, is he better than Barry Sanders?

You seem to want everyone to just agree TB is the goat. I'll give the guy a crap-ton of credit and include him in the conversation for sure. But, as you can see from recent polls with only current players as options, the majority of fans don't even give TB that win.

I was trying to find a resolution that'd make ya happy but not sure that's gonna be possible.

What would anyone have to do for cripes sakes to ever be the greatest? If it can't be Brady then it can't be anybody.