Talk with Judge - Labor lawyer who deals with Unions every day

[andrewssix]

Awesome, but the only problem:
"The case was originally brought to the court by former Rams equipment manager Todd Hewitt more than four years ago."

I know it has taken 4 years to get settled, but the last few paragraphs explain how it could help players in the league now:

"...However, it’s a carrot that the NFL Players Association can definitely dangle to other courts when challenging the league’s authority over player issues, including league-mandated suspensions and fines. It has also set a precedent for the other 21 states that house NFL teams to follow suit. Equally as important, it’s a significant chip within the confines of collective bargaining...More than anything, this ruling could act as a tip of the iceberg. There is now precedent set when it comes to a high court challenging the commissioner’s nearly unchecked powers. In the state of Missouri, that precedent is there in black and white....In what might seem like a minor ruling based on a specific complaint could have wide-ranging ramifications moving forward. After all, the collective bargaining issues between the NFL and the union brings out the best in the lawyers involved. They’re not going to sit idly by and pretend this specific ruling doesn’t apply to other cases around the league."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/vincent...s-roger-goodell-and-the-nfl-a-major-defeat/2/

 

[JMC00]

Based on the article, that was from the Missouri high court.

Where does one go? federal court?

Perhaps some of our legal eagles can opine but I always thought state high courts rulings take precedence to everyone except the Supreme Court.

Doesn't mean they can't bring it up as an example to the Federal Judge that a Missouri Supreme Court made a ruling that that invalidates the commissioner as arbitrator pertaining to league employees in their state.

IMO While Brady won't be able to get Goodell removed as arbitrator based on that ruling the Federal Judge won't take the ruling lightly.

Still Goodell is a coward and he will appoint someone else arbitrator who will have been instructed by Goodell on what to do, just like Troy Vincent is being instructed by Goodell. Goodell doesn't want to be attached to the punishment because it is ultimately going to fail. He is just doing this because he has looked like an incompetent buffoon for years.

 

[Bobsyouruncle]

Humor me. Prove his innocence.

Prove your innocence.

 

[ViperGTS]

I can't prove ****, however, I'm not going to just ignore my gut on this just because I've lived most of my life in Mass. Or because I started going to Red Sox games when I was 5. Or because I watched Russell, Cousy, etc., practice at Babson college. Or because I fell asleep listening to Bruins games as a little boy. Or because watching the Patriots play over the last 15 years has been such a pleasure. My gut says to me Brady was involved. I don't dislike him for it. I've said I don't think it's a big deal. But, I think it's true.

I'm a fan of he's guilty or not. Show me proof before I'm going to call someone a cheater. The farthest extent I'll go, is they knew he wanted them at 12.5. That's it. That's all that's been proven.

This has nothing to do with my Pats allegiance. I go off of what I've read and what has been explained to me. If you can't prove "****" then you can have whatever your guts feels. That's fine. It's just not what's allowed in any adjudication cases. It its also what this report is. A gut feeling.

 

[tom444]

You're denying science

Rubbish. I repeat, there is NO scientific evidence that proves unequivocally that he is innocent. It doesn't exist, no matter how hard you pretend it does.

 

[tom444]

Prove your innocence.

Prove yours.

 

[upstater1]

Rubbish. I repeat, there is NO scientific evidence that proves unequivocally that he is innocent. It doesn't exist, no matter how hard you pretend it does.

I already provided it. You didn't address it. You deny it.

The science is on page 77 of the Wells report, which you havent even read.

You're a total troll, who once confronted with facts, scientific facts, just denies them.

 

[SVN]

Its amazing that some equipment guy hears chatter aroind the league and makes the NFL start an investigation and now the QB has to prove his innocence based on chatter. Why didnt wells ask the colts guy what is this chatter and where is it coming from ? Wouldnt it be worth pursuing if you are really doing a thorough investigation for 100 days ?

 

[ChesBay]

Bottom line, you can't prove Brady didn't want, and pass along the desire, to have game balls under inflated. What you just posted doesn't prove his innocence.

I think you're experiencing a major "fail" here....when it comes to critical thinking. The burden of proof was on the NFL...and they acknowledged that burden of proof by the mere virtue of invoking the need for Ted Wells to investigate and create this report. If they didn't feel the need to prove anything, they simply would have charged the Patriots/TB accordingly....without the need for the investigation. I'm not the one that has to prove TB's innocence, which is why my argument was stating what we know for certain vs what we don't know for certain...all predicated on the aforementioned 243 page report. Therefore, my point is that the investigation, and its resultant report, does not prove his guilt. And the report pretty much reflects that exact sentiment. The NFL must live with the fact that 103 days and $5M could not produce the evidence they originally thought they could find.

 

[tom444]

I'm a fan of he's guilty or not. Show me proof before I'm going to call someone a cheater. The farthest extent I'll go, is they knew he wanted them at 12.5. That's it. That's all that's been proven.

This has nothing to do with my Pats allegiance. I go off of what I've read and what has been explained to me. If you can't prove "****" then you can have whatever your guts feels. That's fine. It's just not what's allowed in any adjudication cases. It its also what this report is. A gut feeling.

Your gut says he wanted 12.5, fine. Mine says he wanted the balls to fell the way he wanted then to, and didn't care if they were under 12.5 to accomplish it.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Humor me. Prove his innocence.

Humor us, GFY.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Your gut says he wanted 12.5, fine. Mine says he wanted the balls to fell the way he wanted then to, and didn't care if they were under 12.5 to accomplish it.

TROLL

 

[tom444]

I think you're experiencing a major "fail" here....when it comes to critical thinking. The burden of proof was on the NFL...and they acknowledged that burden of proof by the mere virtue of invoking the need for Ted Wells to investigate and create this report. If they didn't feel the need to prove anything, they simply would have charged the Patriots/TB accordingly....without the need for the investigation. I'm not the one that has to prove TB's innocence, which is why my argument was stating what we know for certain vs what we don't know for certain...all predicated on the aforementioned 243 page report. Therefore, my point is that the investigation, and its resultant report, does not prove his guilt. And the report pretty much reflects that exact sentiment. The NFL must live with the fact that 103 days and $5M could not produce the evidence they originally thought they could find.

I never said the NFL handled it correctly. I never said the Wells report was proof of his guilt. I said I believe Brady was involved in the deflation of footballs below the legal limit.

 

[The Gr8est]

Your gut says he wanted 12.5, fine. Mine says he wanted the balls to fell the way he wanted then to, and didn't care if they were under 12.5 to accomplish it.

Where is there any evidence at all that Brady liked the balls to be under 12.5 psi?

 

[Bobsyouruncle]

Prove yours.

That was fun, now I can't prove my innocence and you can't prove yours so I guess we're guilty. Perhaps that's why accusers must prove guilt, and not the other way around. You know, proving a negative and all that.

Brady will not be able to prove he didn't ask someone to deflate balls any more than you or I. The fact they couldn't find any proof he did so leaves the presumption of innocence, just like you or I.

 

[tom444]

Humor us, GFY.

Troll.

 

[tom444]

TROLL

You're the ones tossing names around just because I see things in a different light.

 

[tom444]

Where is there any evidence at all that Brady liked the balls to be under 12.5 psi?

The fact they were under 12.5.

 

[flasox27]

You're the ones tossing names around just because I see things in a different light.

I think your light is better expressed on a different site. I am sure there are 31 other sites that welcome your illiterate flat earth point of view.

 

[The Gr8est]

The fact they were under 12.5.

I just got the filter in my water softener changed out because I was getting reduced water pressure and flow.

Doesn't mean I preferred it that way.

So the balls after the Rats game was 16 psi. I guess that proves Brady likes an overinflated ball.