Official Post Game Thread- Pats beat the Ravens

[1960Pats]

I have never seen rain so hard that the camera lens was covered with water to the point where you could barely see the play. That happened on the last few plays last night. What a deluge!

I had to mute the game at several points because I just couldn't stand Collinsworth's color commentary. On the replay of the Ravens' CB Marcus Peters' injury, there was blatant and obvious holding going on and Collinsworth just ignored it. On a replay where a Dugger blitz showed him with a clear path to Jackson until he was grabbed and held, Collinsworth said nothing. Then when a replay was called up because the producer thought that maybe a hold on Winovich might have been missed, he was all "Nah". Finally, there was a penalty called against the Ravens (unnecessary roughness on Judon on Meyers away from the ball?) and Collinsworth was in denial. I certainly didn't mute those last few minutes though. It was great to hear him predict that Jackson was going to pull it off over & over. He sure hates the Pats.

Collinsworth was the single biggest influence on the "why did they pass" narrative on the Butler play. He completely ignored the lack of timeouts and Lynch's failures on short yardage plays.

He was also rambling that he asked Tom about deflating the balls when Brady was completing one of his biggest passes during the first greatest comeback in SB history earlier in the game.

For a man who played the game he doesn't seem to appreciate the game as much as he should. Maybe he's jealous because he didn't win a ring when he had the chance.

A grin still comes over my face when I think of the Collinsworth, Polian and Goodell types after all of those Pats SB wins. That grin is even coming to me now.

 

[1960Pats]

That is not excuse making at all but simply important context.

If you think having something like 2-3 actual practices in the entirety of October because of the repeated COVID facility shutdowns and losing key players 48h before a game is not a major reason why they looked so awful against the Broncos then I don't know what to tell you.

We are not talking about coming out flat from a BYE. Guess why they have started to gel more in the last 3 weeks ? Because they actually got to practice regularly and put gameplans in motion.

Crying about the virus is the same as crying about injuries or poor weather. All teams have to deal with those things so suck it up and play better. That's been the attitude of the Pats that I've seen over the years and it worked well.

I guess for some people the Pats didn't win the Ratbirds game because they played better but because of the poor weather and the many injuries the Ratbirds had to deal with.

If you want important content, how about the fact that the Pats haven't put enough talent on the field? I'd say that has been far more detrimental than a virus that mainly attacks people in the 80's and not 20-30 year old atheletes.

Enough already with the excuses.

 

[1960Pats]

After the fight I saw in them last night I wouldn't rule them out. In fact I think they'll make the playoffs. That was an impressive win.

It'll be very tough but the Pats could do it.
They're 2 games behind 6 teams at 6-3 and 2 1/2 behind Buffalo at 7-3.
Buf/Mia are fighting for the AFCE and I don't think they can catch both of them, but it is possible. If not I'd pull for Buffalo because we already have a win vs Miami.
Ten/Indy fighting for the AFCS will leave one of them in the battle for a WC.
The other teams at 6-3 are Cleveland, Baltimore and Vegas and the Pats have beaten two of them.
There are also a few common games for those teams, which can help because it gives a team a loss but it also gives the other team a win. These are those games;
Bal - Clev
Buf - NE
Clev - Ten
Indy - LV, Ten
Mia - Buf, LV, NE

Bal, Buf, Clev and Indy also face Pitt
LV and Mia also face KC

The Pats just need to get on a roll.

 

[Nikolai]

The coaches are rooting against him?

Ehhhhh...I misread the post and thought it was about fan criticism of Izzo.

But yeah...maybe. Maybe Izzo won't quit trying to slip into their girlfriends/wives DMs or something. Your guess is as good as mine.

 

[JMC00]

and they put themselves in that position, not some virus.

So the Pats purposely made Newton test positive days before the Chiefs game and then decided to fly halfway across the country the day of the game?
It was Pats and not the league that didn't allow them to practice for almost 2 weeks before the Broncos game while the Broncos got to practice?


AFC playoff contenders played so far
-Dolphins (W)
-Raiders (W)
-Chiefs (close loss, basically played with no QB)
-Bills (really close loss)
-Ravens (W)

Pats have beaten or had close games with 5 of the 7 AFC teams currently "in" the playoffs

This is not a 4-5 team without that 2 week **** show. It's a 7-2 or 6-3 team

 

[jah]

Crying about the virus is the same as crying about injuries or poor weather. All teams have to deal with those things so suck it up and play better. That's been the attitude of the Pats that I've seen over the years and it worked well.

I guess for some people the Pats didn't win the Ratbirds game because they played better but because of the poor weather and the many injuries the Ratbirds had to deal with.

If you want important content, how about the fact that the Pats haven't put enough talent on the field? I'd say that has been far more detrimental than a virus that mainly attacks people in the 80's and not 20-30 year old atheletes.

Enough already with the excuses.

You're right that other teams have to deal with this stuff too, but I think you're also missing the point of pointing out why the team might have been so bad in October. It's not to "make excuses", it's to explain why there's a reasonable chance the performance improves in the near future. It's also not the case that *every* team has had an outbreak of the scale we had in October. The roster, especially on offense, has indeed been mismanaged to an extent that shows on the field. I just happen to believe it's still got potential to win some games.

 

[jah]

So the Pats purposely made Newton test positive days before the Chiefs game and then decided to fly halfway across the country the day of the game?
It was Pats and not the league that didn't allow them to practice for almost 2 weeks before the Broncos game while the Broncos got to practice?


AFC playoff contenders played so far
-Dolphins (W)
-Raiders (W)
-Chiefs (close loss, basically played with no QB)
-Bills (really close loss)
-Ravens (W)

Pats have beaten or had close games with 5 of the 7 AFC teams currently "in" the playoffs

This is not a 4-5 team without that 2 week **** show. It's a 7-2 or 6-3 team

Those Dolphins and Raiders wins look a lot more impressive now than they did at the time.

 

[captain stone]

Sorry, only read the last couple of pages here & in the GDT...But am I the only one who thinks that Uncle Dugg might actually have Intercepted that pass to Andrews?

 

[italian pat patriot]

Sorry, only read the last couple of pages here & in the GDT...But am I the only one who thinks that Uncle Dugg might actually have Intercepted that pass to Andrews?

I was with you but then on reply not so sure...

 

[masterbouncer]

Sorry, only read the last couple of pages here & in the GDT...But am I the only one who thinks that Uncle Dugg might actually have Intercepted that pass to Andrews?

yeah have had the same thoughts, for me it looked like both were fighting for the ball during the process of the receiver going down, but lets say I am not surprised the refs immediately called down by contact though dugger took the ball away of the receiver, the receiver hasn't had full controll of the ball at any time (but I might be wrong here)

they anyway tend to stop the game to early sometimes without giving the D# any chance to make a play, oh well Goodell wants pass heavy, offensive show, the defense is there just to have someone to call a DPI on when the offense doesn't get it done by their own

 

[Thelonious]

I'm surprised they won. I thought they'd lose by double digits. So what does their winning show us?

There's a lot of talk about "11 and 5 is back in play," about how though the team may lack talent "they play hard," and so on.

11 and 5 is not back in play, and the evidence is clear that they don't always play hard. They've wilted in two or three games.

What the win does demonstrate, though, is that there are some good young players on the team, young players who need to play to show what they have and to develop it. We don't yet know how many such players there are, of course, because of Belichick's reluctance to play rookies and other newbies, resulting for example in our having to resort to gossip and guesswork re the skills of a player like Stidham. This is partly because Bill values the attributes of character and technique which experienced players bring, but it is partly also because Belichick drafts such p***-poor players at certain positions. We don't yet know how many such players we have of course, because they're not on the field.

Given all this. Should we conclude on the basis of the win that the team ought to revert to playing those vets - Cam chief among them - whom one might feel "give the team the best chance to win"? It does not. This is a lost year. They're not going to win the chamionship, and I very much doubt they're going to get into the playoffs.

The purpose of this year remains entirely getting ready for next year and the years following. Playing "tried-and-true" mediocrities, fading vets, and shiny trivial objects like Cam remains foolish. Cam is irrelevant to next year, so he ought to be seen as irrelevant to this year. Sit him, and find out what else you've got. Play the newbies. See what you have. Maybe (probably) creep up the draft ladder.

The win was a nice surprise, but its value - as a way of assessing the roster - will find realization not this year but next.

 

[catent]

Crying about the virus is the same as crying about injuries or poor weather. All teams have to deal with those things so suck it up and play better. That's been the attitude of the Pats that I've seen over the years and it worked well.

I guess for some people the Pats didn't win the Ratbirds game because they played better but because of the poor weather and the many injuries the Ratbirds had to deal with.

If you want important content, how about the fact that the Pats haven't put enough talent on the field? I'd say that has been far more detrimental than a virus that mainly attacks people in the 80's and not 20-30 year old atheletes.

Enough already with the excuses.

The hypothetical you pose about the Ravens' game, and their injuries/weather, are variables that both teams have to deal with.

Having known, core players opt-out due to COVID, and losing 10-12 days of practice due to COVID, are not consistent variables that all teams have dealt with to the same extent. Injuries don't impact a team's ability to practice together with the healthy/available players; COVID does.

Granted, injuries don't impact all teams equally, but generally speaking injuries happen (when averaged over time) in parity across all teams. That hasn't been the case with COVID.

 

[sb1]

I would say this game and denver are swapped now. Mostly people expected this game to be tough and even a loss and expected denver to be a win.
Honestly the most important game so far was the jets game last week. Without pulling out a win there in the last second , this game had no meaning.

Agreed. I think a lot of us including myself saw a 4-5 record at this point if you went week by week in the schedule with no surprises either way. ARI and MIA look like better teams than I thought they would be. I think 9-7 is the best we can expect at this point but who knows maybe they will surprise us.

 

[sb1]

The hypothetical you pose about the Ravens' game, and their injuries/weather, are variables that both teams have to deal with.

Having known, core players opt-out due to COVID, and losing 10-12 days of practice due to COVID, are not consistent variables that all teams have dealt with to the same extent. Injuries don't impact a team's ability to practice together with the healthy/available players; COVID does.

Granted, injuries don't impact all teams equally, but generally speaking injuries happen (when averaged over time) in parity across all teams. That hasn't been the case with COVID.

Shows that Bill deserves every bit of the accolades as GOAT head coach that he receives. With a deficient roster we're 4-5 but we battled in all but one loss. 3 of those losses were that close to being impressive comeback wins.

Bill is not a 6 time SB winning HC without Brady but he's still the greatest HC of all time. Just imagine where this team without Bill if - say Josh was HC. We'd be battling with the Jets for last. Indisputable fact.

 

[Thelonious]

Wow! That win was very enjoyable and HUGE.

The best part is that it may turn out to be the game that knocks the Ratbirds out of the playoffs. It would be great if the Indiots got knocked out too. We could call it a Defamegate Special.

And goodbye to all of the Tankheads. Don't let the door hit you in the arse on the way out.

A little unsafe heading out that door right at the moment, what with all the fools rushing in to declaim how "the Pats are back" after a single victory over a crippled team playing in Mother Nature's carwash.

 

[Thelonious]

It is weird to say that a QB played good when he throw for only for 118 yards and run for 21 yards on 11 attempts 1.9 y/c

Exactly. The game proved two things: 1) We do have some good young players on the roster. 2) If the weather is bad enough and the opponent is crippled enough by injury, you really can win an NFL game without a competent quarterback.

 

[sb1]

Wow! That win was very enjoyable and HUGE.

The best part is that it may turn out to be the game that knocks the Ratbirds out of the playoffs. It would be great if the Indiots got knocked out too. We could call it a Defamegate Special.

And goodbye to all of the Tankheads. Don't let the door hit you in the arse on the way out.

Like I said in another post... beating them absolutely did some damage to their playoff chances. They're now the 7th seed in the AFC, 3 games behind Pitt, with a conference record that isn't all that, and we have a tiebreaker on them too. After the Titans and Pitt games they do have an easy schedule but so does the rest of their division.

Would be fun if the Pats caught them "cheating" too but maybe next time. LOL

 

[JoeA]

I'm surprised they won. I thought they'd lose by double digits. So what does their winning show us?

There's a lot of talk about "11 and 5 is back in play," about how though the team may lack talent "they play hard," and so on.

11 and 5 is not back in play, and the evidence is clear that they don't always play hard. They've wilted in two or three games.

What the win does demonstrate, though, is that there are some good young players on the team, young players who need to play to show what they have and to develop it. We don't yet know how many such players there are, of course, because of Belichick's reluctance to play rookies and other newbies, resulting for example in our having to resort to gossip and guesswork re the skills of a player like Stidham. This is partly because Bill values the attributes of character and technique which experienced players bring, but it is partly also because Belichick drafts such p***-poor players at certain positions. We don't yet know how many such players we have of course, because they're not on the field.

Given all this. Should we conclude on the basis of the win that the team ought to revert to playing those vets - Cam chief among them - whom one might feel "give the team the best chance to win"? It does not. This is a lost year. They're not going to win the chamionship, and I very much doubt they're going to get into the playoffs.

The purpose of this year remains entirely getting ready for next year and the years following. Playing "tried-and-true" mediocrities, fading vets, and shiny trivial objects like Cam remains foolish. Cam is irrelevant to next year, so he ought to be seen as irrelevant to this year. Sit him, and find out what else you've got. Play the newbies. See what you have. Maybe (probably) creep up the draft ladder.

The win was a nice surprise, but its value - as a way of assessing the roster - will find realization not this year but next.

Perhaps I missed the boat, but per your line of thinking, could you explain why the Pats even offerered Cam Newton a job?

You line of thinking seems to be "so what if we tank, we can see who we can groom for next year, let's just get rid of the vets.

 

[Thelonious]

The 49ers toyed around with our defense at will. Cam didn't have a good game but saying he "singlehandedly" lost the game is not particularly reasonable. He had overall good games against the Bills (minus the fumble at the end), the Jets and now the Ravens. Things are trending into the right direction but our margin for error is just razor thin.

The margin is not merely "thin"; it is asymptotically approaching zero. A passing TD every other game ain't gonna get it.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Collinsworth was the single biggest influence on the "why did they pass" narrative on the Butler play. He completely ignored the lack of timeouts and Lynch's failures on short yardage plays.

He was also rambling that he asked Tom about deflating the balls when Brady was completing one of his biggest passes during the first greatest comeback in SB history earlier in the game.

For a man who played the game he doesn't seem to appreciate the game as much as he should. Maybe he's jealous because he didn't win a ring when he had the chance.

A grin still comes over my face when I think of the Collinsworth, Polian and Goodell types after all of those Pats SB wins. That grin is even coming to me now.

people underestimate the effects commentators and media folk have on the public opinion. I really don’t think it was THAT bad a call if it even was bad but collinsworth was clearly frustrated and needed to cry like a little b**** about something