CBS ranks coaches, no wonder NE is so successful

[maust]

A truly good HC can be a genuine difference maker. Andy Reid is exhibit one for the NFL's version of The Peter Principle. If he were the OC under a good defensive minded HC who had even the slightest clue how to manage a clock he might well be the best thing since sliced bread but as a HC he has time and again shown the ability to get his teams close enough to be a difference maker of exactly the wrong type.

 

[maust]

Yes but having a great Hall of Fame QB doesn't mean 6 titles ask Indy or GB.

Or Dan Marino.
A case could be made that the NFL's all time wins leader and the only coach to lead a team to an undefeated season may well be one of the most over rated HC's of all time

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

GOAT HC
GOAT OL Coach.

Josh has been one of best OC for over a decade.

Charlie & RC.
Matty P
Flores... The list goes on including Nick & Ernie.

GOAT QB & TE.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

They don’t usually spend high picks or high money on offense, whereas GMs for Manning, Rodgers, etc. spend their first rounders on skill position and use lot of cap space to re-sign those guys.

Two fun facts:

• Believe it or not, the Patriots haven't spent a first-round pick on the defense since 2015.
• Ironically, given how much we talk about BB's beliefs that you win games at the LOS, the Patriots are currently third in the league in spending on the secondary.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Two fun facts:

• Believe it or not, the Patriots haven't spent a first-round pick on the defense since 2015.
• Ironically, given how much we talk about BB's beliefs that you win games at the LOS, the Patriots are currently third in the league in spending on the secondary.

They’ve only drafted one first rounder since 2015.

 

[SBLIII]

Two fun facts:

• Believe it or not, the Patriots haven't spent a first-round pick on the defense since 2015.
• Ironically, given how much we talk about BB's beliefs that you win games at the LOS, the Patriots are currently third in the league in spending on the secondary.

BB invests in OL and secondary. OL to protect QB and secondary because that's the most important part of the defense. I mean he doesn't even pay elite DEs.

 

[SBLIII]

They’ve only drafted one first rounder since 2015.

They only had 1st rounder in 2015, 2018 and 2019.

 

[Ivan]

It’s Brady. You could be the best coach with the best schemes, but you’re ineffective if your players stink.

BB was 5-13 before Brady took over and started this dynasty. Brady has always been the driving force behind their success.

Love Brady but it’s the two together that created this dynasty. Neither would have been as successful without the other.

 

[SBLIII]

Love Brady but it’s the two together that created this dynasty. Neither would have been as successful without the other.

Obviously. The better question is, how many rings does Brady win with another coach and does Belichick win a ring at all with a different QB?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Obviously. The better question is, how many rings does Brady win with another coach and does Belichick win a ring at all with a different QB?

Is that really a “better” question? I prefer questions that can be answered with some degree of reasoning.

 

[SBLIII]

Is that really a “better” question?

No, but it's the only one. The other is a logical statement. I mean there is a reason why no QB had won more than 4 before that

 

[Ivan]

Is that really a “better” question? I prefer questions that can be answered.

No, he hates Belichick and has zero credibility on this issue. Both are the respective GOATS and both are better because they work together.

 

[zoostation]

Yes but having a great Hall of Fame QB doesn't mean 6 titles ask Indy or GB.

Agreed. Love TB12 as much or more than anyone. But if BB is the coach of Indy, GB or NO over the last 19 years, and has an owner that isn't involved in football operation, that team wins at a rate the Pats have over the same span. And it's not all about the on field X's & O's (as great as that is), it's also the overall leadership and decision making 'process' (not going to use the 'S' word). Some underestimate the consistent value BB demands and maintains off field.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

BB invests in OL and secondary. OL to protect QB and secondary because that's the most important part of the defense. I mean he doesn't even pay elite DEs.

And yet the Patriots actually have one of the lowest total payrolls for the OL (around 27th, I think).

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

No, but it's the only one. The other is a logical statement. I mean there is a reason why no QB had won more than 4 before that

No quarterback has ever come close to this level of success, regardless of the coach and supporting cast.

No coach/GM has ever come close to this level of success (especially in the salary cap/parity era), regardless of his quarterback.

This is why both of their success is several standard deviations above the next best. Both are the best ever at what they do.

 

[SBLIII]

And yet the Patriots actually have one of the lowest total payrolls for the OL (around 27th, I think).

rookie contracts plus cap hit of Mason only starting to grow

 

[SBLIII]

No quarterback has ever come close to this level of success, regardless of the coach and supporting cast.

No coach/GM has ever come close to this level of success (especially in the salary cap/parity era), regardless of his quarterback.

This is why both of their success is several standard deviations above the next best. Both are the best ever at what they do.

Of course not, there never has been a QB as good as Brady especially not for 15-20 years. This just shows that 99% of coaches need elite QBs to succeed.

What Joe Gibbs did is unprecedented

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Agreed. Love TB12 as much or more than anyone. But if BB is the coach of Indy, GB or NO over the last 19 years, and has an owner that isn't involved in football operation, that team wins at a rate the Pats have over the same span. And it's not all about the on field X's & O's (as great as that is), it's also the overall leadership and decision making 'process' (not going to use the 'S' word). Some underestimate the consistent value BB demands and maintains off field.

How many of those quarterbacks are near automatic when the season is one the line
and are okay playing without big name, big talent receivers? Coaching goes so far and it comes down to execution, especially at the end of the game. There is one player in NFL history who wins (a) the Seattle Super Bowl, (b) the Atlanta Super Bowl, (c) the Jacksonville AFCCG, and (d) the Kansas City AFCCG. That’s just in the last five years.

How have Brees, Rodgers, and Manning done when they’ve met their match defensively and need to grind out clutch play after clutch play to keep the season alive? How about when they throw 50 times per game? No other QB in NFL history has more than one postseason win when trailing by 10+ in the fourth quarter. Brady has 4. You could argue that getting out coached (which happens to everyone at times) led to some of these deficits.

Belichick is great, no doubt, but it’s best to take him literally, too. Give credit to the players. There’s no sport where you have such a massive coaching advantage that the players don’t matter much. As a coach/GM he is the best ever at putting players in position to win. But there’s no way this team is just as successful with anyone other than Brady.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Of course not, there never has been a QB as good as Brady especially not for 15-20 years. This just shows that 99% of coaches need elite QBs to succeed.

What Joe Gibbs did is unprecedented

The game has changed a lot. Gibbs was a great coach but the league was far less QB-centric than it is now. See: 85 Bears. It would be impossible to come close to that defensive dominance today where your QB is basically irrelevant.

 

[Ivan]

I clearly think Brady is the GOAT, but they think what many miss is that Brady understood from day 1 that his route to the starters job was to see the game the same way Belichick sees the game, and to make the decisions on each play the same way Belichick would. They have worked together for almost 20 years and no QB makes better decisions with the ball than Brady. Juxtapose this to Bledsoe’s mantra, which was “ just Huck it, and you understand why Bledsoe was doomed in NE, and why Brady has been so successful. Both would have been successful with the proper chance, but neither may have had that chance had they not won together almost from the beginning.