Bill Belichick's coaching tree

[Ring 6]

What I remember about Kingsbury is something like, he didn't prepare for a game (didn't bother learning the gameplan) and when he went in, he didn't know what he was doing.

Anyone remember that?

No he only played in one nfl game in mop up duty throwing 2 passes.

 

[1960Pats]

So Vrabel is from the O'Brien coaching tree I guess.

I mean, I do think it's incredibly lame to give Perkins credit for Belichick when the FACT is Belichick credits mostly Parcells in his own biography.

But we shouldn't listen to the people who say who their biggest influences are I guess. Because Vrabel has named Belichick as his biggest influence in coaching, and this is even after Vrabel stopped talking to BB after the KC trade.

In an interview with Tanguay, Vrabel said that it was Belichick who gave him the guidance and advice to go immediately into coaching after he retired. Vrabel also said that they call to talk about coaching regularly, and that it's more that he calls to get advice from Belichick on aspects of coaching.

Beyond all that however, Vrabel said that in the last several years with the Patriots he actually did coach for them, by moving over to the scout team and coaching the scout team players after the regular practice. Vrabel knew even then that he was going to be a coach, and not only that, he was out there WITH the other coaches coaching.

Who do we give credit to for all this if not Belichick?

O'Brien?

Ray Perkins.

I think the coaching tree thing is highly over-rated. All coaches learn from various sources as their career moves on.

If Bill credits Parcells then he's giving Perkins his due. Perkins hired Parcells.

Vrabel was always viewed as a potential HC while he was playing. He just happened to be lucky enough to see it first hand with Belichick, who was also hired by Perkins.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

I think we should credit Bill Belichick with the long awaited diversity and inclusion reckoning his protege Brian Flores has brought to the league. I mean, while it's still February and all.

Is it just me, or do recent events sort of take the blush off the "coaching tree" rose?

 

[amfootball]

or should we say, recruiter.

Exactly.

 

[amfootball]

I think we should credit Bill Belichick with the long awaited diversity and inclusion reckoning his protege Brian Flores has brought to the league. I mean, while it's still February and all.

Is it just me, or do recent events sort of take the blush off the "coaching tree" rose?

Flores is burning Bill’s tree to the ground. Lol

 

[sb1]

As most of us know the problem with Bill's coaching tree is too many of them want to be Bill.
There's only one Bill. And he's the only Bill that has the credibility and track record that lets him be himself. Bill tried the same persona in Cleveland and it got him fired because he didn't have that credibility and track record yet.

 

[JarOfMayo51]

For all the **** he gets there's like 10-12 teams that use the same scouting system we do. I think Nagy mentioned it a while ago. I know we've had some stinkers but drafting prospects isn't easy at all. I've been recording my grades, researching, looking back on drafts for over 10 years and it's very difficult being consistently good.

Also to OP. Saban has to count for something. All time great in college, top 5 easy. Pros didn't work out but it might not have been the right time. Timing is everything. Also Saban might be the all-time go-to for secondary / coverage talk. Even over Bill. Another one on the other side is Ozzie. One of the all-time best upstairs.

Looking forward to the upcoming draft and your draft threads!

 

[borg]

What we think we know......

The Patriots OC position is still in flux because BB's Plan A (FC B.O'B===>Failed Coach Bill O'Brien)) is dependent on unwritten agreement between Friend of Bill (FoB) Nick Saban and Bill, a pact that apparently trumps team needs.
BB's Plan B AG (Adam Gase) is a bonafide Nantucket FoB and FC and just a puddlejump from Foxborough

To help BB with the OC hiring decision is Patriots' JoAT (Jack of All Trades) and FC MP (Matt Patricia) whose many Patriots responsibilities include: contracts, defensive "consultation & presentation", cafeteria food tester, post-game tailgate regular, and FoB

From the outside looking in, the Patriots DC position remains in flux as well. While universally understood HC BB is the defacto DC of the NEP, it is also understood BB prefers (Plan A) the lineage of SoB (Son of Bill) SB (Stevie Belichick) to eventually assume the formal DC title leaving FNEPC (former NEP captain) JM (Jerrod Mayo) and current DS (defensive staffer) to serve in a subordinate capacity to SoB SB while the 15 year player/coach gains more NFL experience. No indications yet of the future role of DS and SSoB (Second Son of Bill) bb (Brian Belichick).

One possible cost effective alternative to the DC SoB Plan A is looking outside the organization for FC's still on the payrolls by GTs (garbage teams). FC BF (Brian Flores) is considered a long shot candidate given his recent FoB status change.

In summary....
While SoB and FoB status trumps all other qualifications within the NEP organization, economist BB priorities minimum financial outlay within the coaching budget.

Speculation.....
Week 1 of '22: It is increasingly possible HC BB hires/retains every SoB and FC included in this conversation. (SB, bb, B.O'B, AG, BF & MP)...and with the departure of former FC JM (Josh McDaniels) to GT LVR, the NEP coaching budget is smaller than in '21.


BB, RK and JK.....

Edit:
A surprise development now reportedly near completion....
FC Joe Judge is marked to return to NE with the new title of OAC (Offensive Assistant Coordinator), a title created to subvert Rooney Rule requirements.
Speculation is rampant Judge will be assume all OC responsibilities but without official title.... and the NY Giants will continue to pay the bulk of Judge's future salaries while in NE
FoB....check
FC......check
Value......check

 

[‘Mondre]

Maybe coaching trees don’t matter as much as we think?

Edit: I’m seeing they do matter.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Looking forward to the upcoming draft and your draft threads!


View attachment 40964

Going to start one in a few hours with my PTP Board. Been meaning to but falling asleep early lately like an old man.

 

[venecol]

The reason Vrabel has been succesful is because he's been able to adopt and adapt his coaching skills from all of his previous and current playing and coaching experiences. He's said so himself.

Unlike Fat Matt or any of the others that tried to mimic Bill's philosophy and failed, Vrabel's been able to try his own based on his life's experience with several teams and philosophies.

This means that he had influences from Belichick, Meyer, BOB, Crennel, and even his current positional coaches and coordinators. He's a smart coach. Wouldn't mind him taking over as HC once Bill retires.

 

[amfootball]

The reason Vrabel has been succesful is because he's been able to adopt and adapt his coaching skills from all of his previous and current playing and coaching experiences. He's said so himself.

Unlike Fat Matt or any of the others that tried to mimic Bill's philosophy and failed, Vrabel's been able to try his own based on his life's experience with several teams and philosophies.

This means that he had influences from Belichick, Meyer, BOB, Crennel, and even his current positional coaches and coordinators. He's a smart coach. Wouldn't mind him taking over as HC once Bill retires.

If I was hiring a HC right now I would take McVay #1 because of his offensive innovation and Vrable second. It's a shame he is stuck with Tanny.

 

[upstater1]

The reason Vrabel has been succesful is because he's been able to adopt and adapt his coaching skills from all of his previous and current playing and coaching experiences. He's said so himself.

Unlike Fat Matt or any of the others that tried to mimic Bill's philosophy and failed, Vrabel's been able to try his own based on his life's experience with several teams and philosophies.

This means that he had influences from Belichick, Meyer, BOB, Crennel, and even his current positional coaches and coordinators. He's a smart coach. Wouldn't mind him taking over as HC once Bill retires.

Just as an FYI, the first 6 coaches that Parcells trained in the NFL failed in their first tries a HCs.

The next two to be hired were Belichick and Coughlin.

Ya never know

 

[upstater1]

If I was hiring a HC right now I would take McVay #1 because of his offensive innovation and Vrable second. It's a shame he is stuck with Tanny.

Huh--I have little respect for McVay. He's in over his head.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Bill’s tree is the worst. Not many guys have had success. BOB and Mangini had the most success (which is not saying much), the rest were major duds.

 

[Love The Drake]

Huh--I have little respect for McVay. He's in over his head.

Vrabel 1
Shanny 2

 

[sean10mm]

I think the truth is simply that Belichick is a coaching anomaly. He probably CAN'T teach what makes him great to "normal" coaching candidates. He can groom them to be coordinators in a system where he's the dictator at its center, but he can't make them be like him. He doesn't have a "system" that you can neatly package in a playbook and pass around like Reid or McVeigh or whomever. And trying to act like him just makes his coordinators come off as jumped-up punks and lose the locker room in 0-2 years.

Bill Walsh was a great coach, but his coordinators all got a head start by taking copies of the playbook he invented and then gradually evolving them over time. Belichick doesn't have a relatively concise "package" that he builds his success around, he's pulling stuff from 100 years ago one day and the Air Raid the next.

 

[captain stone]

Whichever branch of Bill's tree sprouted ManJudas, Phatt Matt & Joey Judge should have like a fuc-king gallon of DDT poured on it.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Flores is burning Bill’s tree to the ground. Lol

"In America, tree chops down YOU!"

Where's Yakov Smirnoff when you need him

 

[‘Mondre]

Read this article on Patricia and yikes.

“Imagine coming off three winning seasons in four years, the best four-year stretch in the modern history of your franchise, and doing so while playing for a coach you loved -- Jim Caldwell was absolutely adored by his players -- then hearing a first-time coach walk through the door and tell you to your face that you suck and have no idea what the bleep you’re doing.”

“He was viewed as having a smartest-guy-in-the-room complex who thought players would follow him because he had come from New England or whatever.”

“But this is exactly the problem with Matt Patricia. He inherited an All-Pro cornerback, then was forced to play two guys who are worse in his win-now season because he wanted to embarrass Slay over an Instagram post. You don’t usually get better by playing worse players, and that’s especially true when you already suck.”