Lifelong Panthers fan AMA (ask me anything) Cam Edition

[DropKickFlutie]

Wait are you arguing Cam Newton is a better qb them Steve Young? Seriously?

Comparing their careers before they became the 31 year old Pats starter or 30 year old 49ers starter. It's not even a debate that Cam Newton has had a way better career than Young did before age 30.

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[1960Pats]

Come on dude, as a Pats fan you have to know your facts about these BS scandals.
In summary, the real name of the scandal should be CAMERAINTHEWRONGLOCATIONGATE.

Can you squeeze a memoviolationonly in there somewhere? Maybe a teamsdoitallthetime too?

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Which people here are making a big deal out of his hair? I think most fans here don't care about anything but his football.

I can say this about Cam. He has certainly gotten the word on keeping quiet. That must be difficult for him.

Has he kept quiet? I feel like he's already released like 4 different hype videos ? This guy puts something out like once a week. I personally don't care but fully expect Boston media and fans to go after him because they're not used to a starting QB being like this (and also being black)

 

[Ring 6]

Comparing their careers before they became the 31 year old Pats starter or 30 year old 49ers starter. It's not even a debate that Cam Newton has had a way better career than Young did before age 30.

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That’s not the question.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

That’s not the question.

You're inventing a fake question nobody is saying. And ignoring the point being made. There is every reason to be more excited about Cam joining now than compared to when 30 yr old Steve Young got the job in 1991.

 

[Ring 6]

You're inventing a fake question nobody is saying. And ignoring the point being made. There is every reason to be more excited about Cam joining now than compared to when 30 yr old Steve Young got the job in 1991.

There also every reason to belief the teams choosing Brady 6 that were picked before him should be more excited.
You are conflating impression with an actual result that is there to see. Steve Young proved when given that opportunity that he was a much better QB, more skill, more ability than newton.
But let’s just put it this way.
Do you expect newton from here on to be a better QB than Steve Young was from 1991 on? I should say do you think there is any possible chance in the world.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

There also every reason to belief the teams choosing Brady 6 that were picked before him should be more excited.
You are conflating impression with an actual result that is there to see. Steve Young proved when given that opportunity that he was a much better QB, more skill, more ability than newton.
But let’s just put it this way.
Do you expect newton from here on to be a better QB than Steve Young was from 1991 on? I should say do you think there is any possible chance in the world.

It's a nonsensical question because Young had a loaded team his entire career. Jerry Rice was arguably the greatest football player of all time (not just greatest receiver).

Compared to Stidham it is not even close. A total no brainer to go with Newton. And Stidham is no Brady.

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[Ring 6]

It's a nonsensical question because Young had a loaded team his entire career. Jerry Rice was arguably the greatest football player of all time (not just greatest receiver).

no it’s a legitimate question when you are comparing the players. At least you admit there is no chance in hell.

Compared to Stidham it is not even close. A total no brainer to go with Newton. And Stidham is no Brady.

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That is your opinion.
If Newton continues to be a dual threat qb and is willing and able to run I would tend to agree.
If Newton attempts to be a pocket passer, I doubt Stidham could be much worse.
Newton is an acceptable option if he is a dual threat, who can win if surrounded by a good team. We don’t know yet what Stidham is.
Aren’t you the guy who argued Stidham is a running QB?

 

[JackBauer187]

no it’s a legitimate question when you are comparing the players. At least you admit there is no chance in hell.



That is your opinion.
If Newton continues to be a dual threat qb and is willing and able to run I would tend to agree.
If Newton attempts to be a pocket passer, I doubt Stidham could be much worse.
Newton is an acceptable option if he is a dual threat, who can win if surrounded by a good team. We don’t know yet what Stidham is.
Aren’t you the guy who argued Stidham is a running QB?

How is it fair to compare Cam vs Young and use Young’s entire career, but only part of Cams. All you can compare is what they did up to that same point in their careers.

Since Young was considered a run-first QB who people weren’t sure had enough accuracy to run a WCO, it’s a very similar comparison.

And Cam has been a pocket passer(who can run) his entire career. Please explain when he wasn’t? I’m curious

 

[Ring 6]

How is it fair to compare Cam vs Young and use Young’s entire career, but only part of Cams. All you can compare is what they did up to that same point in their careers.

Since Young was considered a run-first QB who people weren’t sure had enough accuracy to run a WCO, it’s a very similar comparison.

And Cam has been a pocket passer(who can run) his entire career. Please explain when he wasn’t? I’m curious

Because we know what young did when he played and it was hall of fame level.

Young was not at all a run first qb.
Newton has never been a pocket passer.

 

[JackBauer187]

Because you are comparing a “known” to a yet to be determined outcome. No one has said Cam will be that good. Just that there are similarities in this situation.

And how was Cam a run-first QB who threw 4-5X as many passes as runs, but Young wasn’t even though Walsh brought him in for that very purpose many times. Are you just sticking with because I said so?

 

[TheRainMaker]

You have any examples of those people? I don't recall them.

There were a few discussions early in the offseason that Stidum would be the starter and the team doesn't need to sign Newton. Then when the unthinkable happened, it switched to "Newton won't beat Stidum". There were threads with a poll with more people picking Stidum to still be the starter.

I've joked about this many times because of those threads. I'm actually quite surprised you haven't noticed as there's many threads discussing they'd rather go with Stidum for no reason over Newton.

 

[Ring 6]

Because you are comparing a “known” to a yet to be determined outcome. No one has said Cam will be that good. Just that there are similarities in this situation.

And how was Cam a run-first QB who threw 4-5X as many passes as runs, but Young wasn’t even though Walsh brought him in for that very purpose many times. Are you just sticking with because I said so?

Newton is a dual threat qb. It is vital to his game. If he must abandon his running game and be a pocket passer he will struggle. If newton ran like Brady he would be out if the league. A big part of Newton’s game is designed runs and moving around to create passing opportunities. He has never been a pocket passer in a prototypical “pro offense”.
A little while back I posted passing stats from Newton’s rookie year to today of all QBs who had thrown 3500 passes, ie started for most of that time. Newton was near the bottom in most or all of them and only ahead of guys like Fitzpatrick and Flacco in most. I’ll find it and repost it for you here.


Young was a pocket passer who could also run. When he stayed in the pocket he was as good as any an in the league.

Young ran 722 times vs 4149 pass attempts.
Newton has run 934 times vs 3980 pass attempts.
In fact both have passed or thrown almost the identical amount of combined times. 4871 vs 4914. So in essence Newton has already played youngs career playing time.

in those pass attempts
Young with 4149 (just 4% more attempts)
Completed 64.7% for 33124 yards 232 tds and 107 ints
Newton completed 59.6% for 29021 yards 182 td and 108 Ints

Even having 19 starts with the disaster bucs you had a career record of 94-49, newton is 68-56-1

So can we now stop this ridiculous comparison?

 

[Ring 6]

How is it fair to compare Cam vs Young and use Young’s entire career, but only part of Cams. All you can compare is what they did up to that same point in their careers.

Since Young was considered a run-first QB who people weren’t sure had enough accuracy to run a WCO, it’s a very similar comparison.

And Cam has been a pocket passer(who can run) his entire career. Please explain when he wasn’t? I’m curious

Here is the other post I referred to in my response to you



Here are some numbers on Newton. From 2011 to now newton has thrown 3980 passes.
The following is a list of the other 12 QBs who have thrown 3500 or more.
Brady
Brees
Ryan
Ben
Rivers
Rogers
Wilson
Stafford
Dalton
Eli
Flacco
Fitz

here is where newton ranks among them.
completion %. Last of 13
Pass yards 12 of 13 (only ahead of fitz)
Ypa 9 of 13 (Eli, fitz, Dalton, Flacco)
Td passes. 11 of 13 (fitz and Flacco)
Td % 9 of 13 (fitz dalton Flacco Eli)
Int. 7 of 13 (
Int % 10 of 13 (rivers, Eli, fitz)
Rating 11 of 13 ( fitz and Flacco )

That is where he stacks up as a passer against QBs who have started or mostly started since he came into the league.

 

[Ring 6]

We can also look at a different time period. Let’s use last 5 years for all qbs throwing 2000 or more passes

the list includes in addition to newton
Brees
Wilson
Brady
Cousins
Ryan
Rodgers
Prescott
Stafford
Ben
Rivers
Carr
Wentz
Dalton
Manning, Eli
Winston
Bottles
Flacco


Newton is 16/18 on qb rating (bortles, Flacco) meaning QBs such as Winston, Carr, Eli and dalton we’re higher

newton is 17/18 in completion % beating out bortles 59.65 to 59.38

newton is 14 in td passes 8 in td pass %
He is 12th best in ints (I.e 11 threw fewer and 6 threw more) and 15th in int % (Ben bortles Winston)
He is 16th in passing yards out of 18 (Flacco wentz) and 13th in ypa
These are his prime years. I purposely started with his mvp season to make it look better.

He is in the bottom 1/4 of all QBs who were primary starters for most of that time period in virtually every passing stat.


Let’s hope he can still run because those that think he is going to come here and be an effective pocket passer are going to be very disappointed.

 

[RASTAN99]

How is it fair to compare Cam vs Young and use Young’s entire career, but only part of Cams.

All you can compare is what they did up to that same point in their careers.

That seems reasonable.

Cam has started 125 regular season NFL games. Accolades are as follows:
1st Team All-Pro (1)
2nd Team All-Pro (0)
NFL MVP (1)
Pro Bowl (3)
NFL OPY (1)
Bert Bell Award (1)
Super Bowl appearances (1)
Super Bowl MVP (0)
Super Bowl rings (0)
NFL Passer Rating Leader (0)
NFL Passing Touchdowns Leader (0)
NFL Completion % Leader (0)


In his first 125 regular season NFL starts Steve Young accomplished:
1st Team All-Pro (3)
2nd Team All-Pro (2)
NFL MVP (2)
Pro Bowl (6)
NFL OPY (2)
Bert Bell Award (2)
Super Bowl appearances* (1)
Super Bowl MVP (1)
Super Bowl rings* (1)
NFL Passer Rating Leader (6)
NFL Passing Touchdowns Leader (3)
NFL Completion % Leader (5)

One of the most notable things about these stats is that 5-times in a 6-year span Young was either 1st-Team or 2nd-Team All-Pro...a testament to his incredible consistency. He tacked on another 2nd-Team All-Pro selection in 1998 but I didn't count that one because it was after his 125th start and that's where the line is drawn for an apples-to-apples comparison. In 1998 he again led the league in passing-TD's and was selected to the Pro Bowl (neither included above).

*Young has played in 2 Super Bowl games and has 3 Super Bowl rings but obviously for this comparison only his results as the starter were counted.

 

[neuronet]

I think the comparison to young is derailing the thread a bit guys. Newton is great we are lucky to have him and I think we all hope he is and remains healthy.

 

[Conflicted Panthers fan]

Lofl at looking at Steve Young’s stats vs Cam’s when Young was playing catch and run with Jerry freaking Rice while Cam was throwing to Kelvin Benjamin and Devin Funchess.

 

[Joker]

LOL knowing YOU saw the blatant NON CALLED pass interference on Gronk after it was called....worst fix call of that season. You need to stop laughing at members here. You've already proven you're just trolling.

 

[JackBauer187]

Newton is a dual threat qb. It is vital to his game. If he must abandon his running game and be a pocket passer he will struggle. If newton ran like Brady he would be out if the league. A big part of Newton’s game is designed runs and moving around to create passing opportunities. He has never been a pocket passer in a prototypical “pro offense”.
A little while back I posted passing stats from Newton’s rookie year to today of all QBs who had thrown 3500 passes, ie started for most of that time. Newton was near the bottom in most or all of them and only ahead of guys like Fitzpatrick and Flacco in most. I’ll find it and repost it for you here.


Young was a pocket passer who could also run. When he stayed in the pocket he was as good as any an in the league.

Young ran 722 times vs 4149 pass attempts.
Newton has run 934 times vs 3980 pass attempts.
In fact both have passed or thrown almost the identical amount of combined times. 4871 vs 4914. So in essence Newton has already played youngs career playing time.

in those pass attempts
Young with 4149 (just 4% more attempts)
Completed 64.7% for 33124 yards 232 tds and 107 ints
Newton completed 59.6% for 29021 yards 182 td and 108 Ints

Even having 19 starts with the disaster bucs you had a career record of 94-49, newton is 68-56-1

So can we now stop this ridiculous comparison?

Why would he be “out” of the league? Was Eli Manning not a QB in this league? What is different between them? Without Cam carrying one time. He still wins the MVP in 2015 if he didn’t run at all. With the worst WR group any MVP QB has ever had. As for Cam, he has around 4-5 called run options a game. And rolled out so little that every Panther fan complained he wasn’t doing it enough. So your “box score and highlight” scouting is flawed to say the least.

And once again, comparing entire careers to partial ones. And ones with a severe need for context. Show me how Young was an accurate pocket passer at TB. Using the same standards as Cam. How come when they handed a team that should have been on a Three-peat to Young, he struggled to 5-5 while Steve Bono went 5-1. Hmmm. Where are those stats. Or any stats from before 1992. Why was Young’s CMP % below 54 his first four years? Or does that not count?

And why is him not running even a discussion? Does anyone think he’s not going to run. The only thing ridiculous is discussing something that ain’t going to happen.