Wtf happened with Brissett deal?

[Ring 6]

So based on your last sentence, you’re saying we could have gotten more compensation for Jimmy G had he been traded prior to the 2017 draft?

Do you think the patriots maximized jimmy gs value?

Part of maximizing his value was having him on the team for part of the season in the event their 40 year old QB was injured.
Having your best backup QB available on a SB team, especially when your started is 40 has value that it’s hard to equate to draft picks.

 

[Ring 6]

I’m not arguing we traded jimmy g at the wrong time. I’m arguing we could have pushed SF harder for more compensation or another team for a first rounder plus an additional pick based on incentives

How do you know we didn’t?
Are you seriously saying you know trade value better than Belichick and/or Belichick doesn’t try to get the most he can, ie that you would have been able to get more. That’s kind of a fantasy world.

 

[Bruins29]

I’m not arguing we traded jimmy g at the wrong time. I’m arguing we could have pushed SF harder for more compensation or another team for a first rounder plus an additional pick based on incentives

The real question is how long are you going to whine about it?

 

[LaterGator]

i absolutely disagree we lost the brissett deal. We got fine compensation for him

I do believe we could have gotten more compensation for Jimmy G

That's very likely true, it's also probably true BB wanted to deal him to a certain spot outside the conference. It's also true BB knew he could expand the deal to get more assets, which he's done.

Some are claiming Trent Brown was the other shoe to drop in the JG deal. Whether that's true or not Dawson, Sam, the Bears 2nd rd pick and Lions 3rd rounder are much greater value than a #40 something pick.

 

[HailHydra]

A lot of y'all are saying that Brissett's value wouldn't have been close to what it was without him starting. Sure, absolutely. However, Brissett is 24, a former 3rd round pick that we chose who was still on his rookie deal. At the time, he had played well against the Texans, but not the Bills (who were good that season). That by itself gives the player some value. On the other hand, Phillip Dorsett was a player that would've been worth a 6th or 7th round pick had we wanted it that way. Dorsett's value and Brissett's value were in no way equal - considering the value that we invested into him, and knowing the fact that Garoppolo realistically wasn't gonna be part of NE past the season, either via trade or FA. Now, would we rather have Hoyer, who sucked balls last year. Of the players we could've gotten to back up Brady last year, we got one worse than Brissett. That season, in 6 games, Hoyer had a 58% completion rate, 208 yards per game, 4 TDs, and 4 INTs. Brissett had better stats by a good bit, and he's younger, and more affordable. And going into this year, behind Brady we're still rocking Hoyer. I know that we're criss crossing deals here, but it's important to note how having Brissett as a backup would've been better. Even more so, this preseason and training camp, he would have gotten the snaps Jimmy G had the year prior, and could build value that way. The value of QBs on the market is sky high, and getting some significant draft value for Brissett wouldn't have been a stretch.

Others have been saying that a 2nd rounder wasn't offered for JB. Sure, I can't confirm. But it wouldn't be too crazy. A 3rd round pick might be JB's value. He's a QB who started all of last year and posted top tier backup numbers. That has value in the league today.

Phillip Dorsett is not going to become a 3rd or even 4th round worthy receiver in this offense. A 3rd round pick was used to trade for Martavis Bryant this offseason. Is Dorsett close to MB? No. He's a 1st round bust who oozes potential, but hasn't capitalized on it yet. At the time, the deal was a mistake. Draft capital should've been spent on trading for WR depth - but not a young QB.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

How do you know we didn’t?
Are you seriously saying you know trade value better than Belichick and/or Belichick doesn’t try to get the most he can, ie that you would have been able to get more. That’s kind of a fantasy world.

No I don’t...but there is a serious debate out there whether B.B. did jimmy a “favor” by sending him to a good situation in SF rather than seeking out the best deal from any nfl that was willing to offer compensation

 

[Ring 6]

No I don’t...but there is a serious debate out there whether B.B. did jimmy a “favor” by sending him to a good situation in SF rather than seeking out the best deal from any nfl that was willing to offer compensation

There may be a debate, but it isn’t serious.
His job is to run the patriots and do everything in their best interest. He isn’t going to take a worse deal so the traded player can be happy. Plus he traded him to a team that had 1 win at the time.

 

[Ring 6]

A lot of y'all are saying that Brissett's value wouldn't have been close to what it was without him starting. Sure, absolutely. However, Brissett is 24, a former 3rd round pick that we chose who was still on his rookie deal. At the time, he had played well against the Texans, but not the Bills (who were good that season). That by itself gives the player some value. On the other hand, Phillip Dorsett was a player that would've been worth a 6th or 7th round pick had we wanted it that way. Dorsett's value and Brissett's value were in no way equal - considering the value that we invested into him, and knowing the fact that Garoppolo realistically wasn't gonna be part of NE past the season, either via trade or FA. Now, would we rather have Hoyer, who sucked balls last year. Of the players we could've gotten to back up Brady last year, we got one worse than Brissett. That season, in 6 games, Hoyer had a 58% completion rate, 208 yards per game, 4 TDs, and 4 INTs. Brissett had better stats by a good bit, and he's younger, and more affordable. And going into this year, behind Brady we're still rocking Hoyer. I know that we're criss crossing deals here, but it's important to note how having Brissett as a backup would've been better. Even more so, this preseason and training camp, he would have gotten the snaps Jimmy G had the year prior, and could build value that way. The value of QBs on the market is sky high, and getting some significant draft value for Brissett wouldn't have been a stretch.

Others have been saying that a 2nd rounder wasn't offered for JB. Sure, I can't confirm. But it wouldn't be too crazy. A 3rd round pick might be JB's value. He's a QB who started all of last year and posted top tier backup numbers. That has value in the league today.

Phillip Dorsett is not going to become a 3rd or even 4th round worthy receiver in this offense. A 3rd round pick was used to trade for Martavis Bryant this offseason. Is Dorsett close to MB? No. He's a 1st round bust who oozes potential, but hasn't capitalized on it yet. At the time, the deal was a mistake. Draft capital should've been spent on trading for WR depth - but not a young QB.

How were his stats better than Hoyer’s?

How were his stats top tier backup?
His stats were terrible and got worse as the season wore on.
He was a 54% passer leading his team to 14 ppg in the last month and a half of the season.

 

[Tunescribe]

How this trade grades out largely depends on whether Dorsett becomes a legit NFL caliber WR this season or not.

But at the time it occurred the Brissett deal made good sense. That's really the only way it can be judged.

 

[BlueThunder]

If you unubderstand the issue then how do you have a problem. It was literally impossible to keep Garoppolo without hurting the team on the field by franchising him then having to keep doing it. 24 mill for a backup QB just can’t happen, and he probably wouldn’t have signed the tag and forced a trade anyway.

Thanks for that insight.....I was just expressing an opinion that I didn't like seeing Garopollo go......

 

[Oswlek]

Instead they kept Jimmy, so Brissett was actually on the bubble to get cut,

NE could have easily kept 3QBs if they wanted to, so keeping Jimmy played no part in their assessment of Btissett. Right or wrong, they decided he wasn't a fit. It's really as simple as that.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

The last few years, the front office has not lived up to its “best in the NFL” billing when it comes to personnel decisions, including the draft, free agency, and trades. They’re probably closer to the bottom than the top.

When I heard they were trading Brissett for Dorsett, I thought at the time it didn’t seem like a big deal. I didn’t know at the time the Colts viewed Brisett as their STARTING quarterback at the time (unbeknownst the Patriots?) while Dorsett may have been a bubble roster player. Then of course I expected a grand plan with Brady and Garoppolo, but it turned into a Christmas gift to the 49ers.

Does it matter how Brissett was viewed by the Colts versus the Patriots internal grade? A year earlier, the Eagles traded Sam Bradford to the Vikings for a FIRST AND FOURTH (FOURTH COULD BECOME A THIRD OR SECOND), though Bradford was already going to be a backup for Wentz, or at best a starter for a very short time. The Patriots were in a similar situation with the Colts, as the Colts desperately sought a starting QB due to an injury/injury recovery situation with no QB market. Even if Brissett doesn’t stack up to Sam Bradford (lol), their return was a draft bust who was likely to either get cut or see 2-3 snaps a game with the Colts?

Typically, even an average backup quarterback is traded for something like a 2nd or 3rd pick. For Garoppolo and Brissett, two starters, one widely viewed as a potential perennial pro bowl QB, the grand total return was a second round pick and Philip Dorsett. WTF? These were two badly misplayed hands. The Colts turned down a second round pick for Brissett, so his trade value is now a first. Garopollo’s trade value is probably 3 firsts (theoretically, though he’s more in the “untradeable category.”). One year later, the combined value it would take to trade to get Garoppolo and Brissett back: four first round picks. One year earlier the Patriots traded them away for a second round pick and Dorsett. Sure, you couldn’t get that value last year because they were less proven, but the Patriots had an up close view of both players. For the value gap to be that huge, there’s something very wrong.

Draft picks have been among the worst in the league since 2015.

Huge, overlooked gaffe is this offseason: they WANTED Michael Bennett and even offered the Seahawks more for him, but their bid someone came in too late?? That almost never happens. Was someone just asleep at the wheel? This isn’t something where they passed due to the value...it could almost be classified as a clerical error or lack of understanding of the timeframe. Ripple effect is no Michael Bennet and the subsequent retirement of Martellus Bennett, who probably would have restructured his contract to play with his brother for another year or two.

 

[Triumph]

Yeah, yeah we all talk about the Garoppolo deal, but how did we lose so poorly on the Brissett deal? Based on reports of the Seahawks offering a 2nd rder for the kid, and the Colts turning it down, makes me think that trading Brissett for Phillip freaking Dorsett is one of the worst trades that we have ever done.

The Homers said it was a great trade.

Dorsett has been dropping the chalupa just like in Indy.

 

[Oswlek]

Others have been saying that a 2nd rounder wasn't offered for JB. Sure, I can't confirm. But it wouldn't be too crazy.

Yes, it would be. It was completely absurd, which is why I dismissed it immediately and follow up reports indicate the original claim was false.

I didn’t know at the time the Colts viewed Brisett as their STARTING quarterback at the time (unbeknownst the Patriots?)

Huh? Of course NE knew Brissett would start, why do you think they made the offer in the first place? It's not like Luck's health issues were a secret.

 

[Ring 6]

Thanks for that insight.....I was just expressing an opinion that I didn't like seeing Garopollo go......

Sure and I was just replying that there wasn’t really any alternative.

 

[Ring 6]

NE could have easily kept 3QBs if they wanted to, so keeping Jimmy played no part in their assessment of Btissett. Right or wrong, they decided he wasn't a fit. It's really as simple as that.

And everything he did in Indy last year proved the pats were right that Brissett isn’t a good nfl qb

 

[Ring 6]

But at the time it occurred the Brissett deal made good sense. That's really the only way it can be judged.

And it still does

 

[NG Pats Fan]

Yeah I agree with Andy.

Brissett is not a good nfl QB, we over drafted him in round 3 and I’m glad we got something in return from him

 

[ralmat55]

What happened with the Jacoby Brissett trade? Well, you see Bill Belichick had 3 good QBs but only wanted one. The apple of his eye and favorite texting buddy Jimmy G.

Brissett had to be moved to set the groundwork for what Belichick hoped would be a convincing argument to Bob Kraft to allow him to discard Brady and hand the job to Garappolo. As long as Brissett was around as a talented backup and possible successor, Belichick would not be able to convince Kraft to double cross his GOAT QB (again) and allow him to trade Brady rather than Garappolo.

The argument still didn’t work. So, we now have Philip Dorsett who’s yet to prove he’s capable of running anything other than a go route and a backup QB whose only attribute is knowing the offense and the Colts have a QB who saved them from being a complete embarrassment last season and whose owner (albeit drug addled) says they wouldn’t trade for a 1st rounder.

 

[Simpelton]

The Jacoby Brissett we had is not the same player as the Jacoby Brissett of today.

We traded a guy with a whopping 2 games to his name.

The Colts have a Jacoby Brissett who just logged a full season of football and didn't suck. His rating was 81.9, which is above replacement level, even if it isn't by a lot. He is the average quarterback we thought he could be -- the difference is that now, he's proven it.

Combine that with the fact that he's still quite young and may still have a bit of upside if he can improve his accuracy and timing, and you've got a player who gained a lot of value last season. He's tough, he's smart, he's game, he's both capable and willing to pay the physical price of playing QB for a bad team, all these qualities make him actually quite a nice roster filler for the quarterback position. You can get some value for a guy like that, especially if a team is rebuilding, or has injury issues in the #1 QB slot.

As for the trade -- what can I say, we traded a guy we'd never trust to start for us as a long term thing, for some depth in a position that had experienced serious attrition. At the time of the trade, all of Hogan, Edelman and Amendola were out or banged up. I can't criticize BB for trading a spare part to shore up his depth at receiver, even if Dorsett doesn't work out, it was worth trying..