Two Major Issues Have Been Solved

[Deus Irae]

Dion was the smallest guy in the NFL, he started 19 games in five seasons, he started 16 games once last season, he had 180 carries.

It is definitely an issue as to who returns kickoffs but we have at least a few good RB's who can take his snaps. We can find guys in the draft or vets looking to win. We still have a roster spot to fill, it's not an emergency.

Nothing you just posted has any relevance to the issue in this thread, beyond the admission of a spot to fill. They have a RB problem. It's not fixed. That's just reality.

 

[Wozzy]

Nothing you just posted has any relevance to the issue in this thread.

You're talking out both sides of your mouth then accusing me of creating straw men.

Shelton and Rex were the topic. I'd say we've covered it thoroughly.

You can't seem to agree to disagree, sounds like a "you" problem.

 

[Deus Irae]

You're talking out both sides of your mouth then accusing me of creating straw men.

Shelton and Rex were the topic. I'd say we've covered it thoroughly.

No

Whether or not the team fixed the 2 problems mentioned by the OP was the topic.

You can't seem to agree to disagree, sounds like a "you" problem.

You keep responding to my posts by posting straw men, false/misleading comments, and irrelevant claims. I keep responding to your posts, by noting that you're posting straw men, false/misleading comments, and irrelevant claims. If you want to "agree to disagree", just stop responding to my posts by bringing in more straw men, false/misleading comments, and irrelevant claims. Your seeming inability to do that is not a "me" problem, it's a "you" problem.

 

[Wozzy]

burp

 

[supafly]

They have a RB problem. It's not fixed. That's just reality.

Personally, I don’t really see how either of these issues are “fixed,” although I do think the DL is in better shape for next year than they were at the end of the season, and that’s only because Branch took a year long vacation.

There are still players that will be added at both positions, and not just for depth/competition. RB is still very much an issue. You can’t count Devlin or Bolden, and Gileslee may not even make the team.

Also, there are rumors that the team is very interested in Clayborn and likely less credible rumors that they may be interested in Suh. It would appear as though they are still trying to solve their issues.

 

[TheFlyingWedge]

I can't wrap my head around the fact that folks keep putting Gillislie on any kind of depth chart. The guy was inactive from 11/12 thru 12/17, missing six games. He played against Buffalo on 12/24 and then he was done. I'll be surprised if he's on the opening day roster.

Gilleslie is only a marginal upgrade from Brandon Bolden with the 4th down duties at RB.

 

[Wozzy]

Personally, I don’t really see how either of these issues are “fixed,” although I do think the DL is in better shape for next year than they were at the end of the season, and that’s only because Branch took a year long vacation.

There are still players that will be added at both positions, and not just for depth/competition. RB is still very much an issue. You can’t count Devlin or Bolden, and Gileslee may not even make the team.

Also, there are rumors that the team is very interested in Clayborn and likely less credible rumors that they may be interested in Suh. It would appear as though they are still trying to solve their issues.

I don't deal in absolutes and you can always increase competition and get better. I'd love to see Demarco Murray get a shot here.

If it doesn't happen we always had a rotation last season, a stable of RB's. When healthy Burkhead was as good as Dion, not as shifty but bigger. Dion got 405 offensive snaps, White got 383, his snaps only increased when Rex got hurt.

Dion only played 35% of the offensive RB snaps, like I said kick returner is a bigger question.

 

[Deus Irae]

When healthy Burkhead was as good as Dion

 

[supafly]

I don't deal in absolutes and you can always increase competition and get better. I'd love to see Demarco Murray get a shot here.

If it doesn't happen we always had a rotation last season, a stable of RB's. When healthy Burkhead was as good as Dion, not as shifty but bigger. Dion got 405 offensive snaps, White got 383, his snaps only increased when Rex got hurt.

Dion only played 35% of the offensive RB snaps, like I said kick returner is a bigger question.

While I’m disappointed that we weren’t able to control the rights to Lewis, I don’t think many here expected him to stay for around 6m dollars a year. His absence will be missed.

None of that, however, has anything to do with proving that our team somehow “solved” any issues at the position. As I mentioned, we basically have 2.5 RBs, not counting the FB and ST only player. Gilleslee may not even make the team, leaving us White and Burkhead. The only thing that happened yesterday was that the team prevented the prospect of losing both major free agent RBs. That’s it. Nothing was solved by any means.

 

[Wozzy]

While I’m disappointed that we weren’t able to control the rights to Lewis, I don’t think many here expected him to stay for around 6m dollars a year. His absence will be missed.

None of that, however, has anything to do with proving that our team somehow “solved” any issues at the position. As I mentioned, we basically have 2.5 RBs, not counting the FB and ST only player. Gilleslee may not even make the team, leaving us White and Burkhead. The only thing that happened yesterday was that the team prevented the prospect of losing both major free agent RBs. That’s it. Nothing was solved by any means.

Older FA running backs are cheap, rookie RB's are plentiful. The position on the whole undervalued. We have a lot of team building to do, but Rex gives us a solid starter when healthy.

 

[Deus Irae]

You're the biggest fan of Rex's except when you aren't... got it.

And there you go with the false argument again. Noting that Lewis was the team's best RB is not diminishing my appreciation for Burkhead. I didn't like Burkhead because I thought he was the team's best RB. I liked him because I liked his versatility, which included the ability to work as a slot receiver.

What is Rex Burkhead’s role going to be?

...Burkhead looks fine. He's not here to be a bell cow RB. He's here to be a Swiss Army RB....

Gillislee is the runner who's not much of a receiver
White is the receiver who's not much of a runner
Lewis is the runner/receiver who's not much of a blocker
Burkhead is the Swiss Army knife who does it all

I'm still looking for Burkhead to get more work out of the slot.

...
Gillislee - Blount replacement
White - 3dRB
Lewis - Best overall RB
Burkhead - Swiss Army RB, should be getting more slot WR work...

etc...

 

[Jercules]

Anyone else worried about losing Solder?

 

[supafly]

Older FA running backs are cheap, rookie RB's are plentiful. The position on the whole undervalued. We have a lot of team building to do, but Rex gives us a solid starter when healthy.

Fine points, but with all due respect, the title of the thread is that “two major issues have been solved.”
I’m sure that you can forgive those who may look at the thread, and the fact that we currently have 2-3 real RBs, and wonder how exactly, it has been solved as of mid-March.

As you mention, I am expecting someone added in the draft, as well as another free agent signing of some sorts. Then, and only then, can we look upon the depth chart and debate as to whether or not there’s an issue or whether or not it’s an upgrade/downgrade from last season.

At this point in time though, nothing has been done to address the loss of our lead RB, and there isn’t enough competition or depth to adequately field a positional grouping.

 

[supafly]

Anyone else worried about losing Solder?

I think people would be lying if they said otherwise. Unfortunately, there was no way the Pats were going to be players for the (now) highest paid OL in the NFL.

Hopefully, we can retain one of Waddle/Fleming, as well as add a high round draft pick. I suppose we’ll likely see some experimentation with Cannon at LT over the summer again, as well.

 

[RayClay]

Don't see hpw losing your best running back solves anything. I like Burkhead, but have seen years of backup running backs on this team not rising to the occasion when given more time. Wishing doesn't make it so. They have a net loss at RB as it stands, unless proven otherwise.

 

[supafly]

Don't see hpw losing your best running back solves anything. I like Burkhead, but have seen years of backup running backs on this team not rising to the occasion when given more time. Wishing doesn't make it so. They have a net loss at RB as it stands, unless proven otherwise.

Morale is down. I understand the thinking behind the creation of the thread.

Unfortunately, some are going to question how losing your best RB with no replacement (even if we’re just looking at it numerically) equates to the issue somehow being solved.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

Solved is a pretty strong word.

Interior DL looks improved. If DS plays a step or two better with the Patriots then I'd lean toward solved-ish.
2017: Panda Express and RJF
2018 Change: Valentine (misses a year. Can he come back better than year one?) and DS added.

RB Solved?:
2017: Lewis (primary running plays but could catch passes especially when injuries or situational football required it),
2018 change: Lewis gone, no one new added.
Gill can take a better pounding than Lewis (more handoffs average) but that's about where the comparison ends. Yet IF Gill can repeat his 2016 season YPC in 2018? We aren't in a lurch but we still are in a position of less flexible skillsets (Gill can run while Lewis could run, ST, catch some). Bottom line: I just can't see RB position put anywhere near the solved category when we lost Lewis' production types yet gained no added alternate similar production types except for, maybe/big maybe, Gill seeing a 2016 YPC (but again we still have a less flexible production skill set).

 

[Tunescribe]

From the perspective of someone that's new to this particular forum I'd play devil's advocate on at least part of the thought process there. Some posts/posters are so manifestly douchey no explanation should be needed. Did Stevenson at his most Stevensonian really merit extended engagement? Are you really advocating feeding a troll? Or indulging someone that's spoiling for an argument just because they are ill bred or mannered? Understanding it's the nature of being on a sports forum to engage in discussion doesn't mean every douche needs or merits engaging. Sometimes a simple dislike/disagree is certainly preferable to a bunch of no/u posts.

Yours is an argument for the rating system being done away with altogether. Most of the time when someone gives me a disagree or dislike I don't know them, haven't a clue where they're coming from and would like to understand why they oppose my viewpoint. It's supposed to be a FORUM, where ideas are exchanged. Otherwise, it's like someone entering a real conversation, saying "I don't like what you said," and then leaving. That's rude, counterproductive and cowardly. Icy is right on about this.

 

[Tony2046]

Because he did play poorly compared to what was asked and expected, and he has not shown that he can be a great player, which is why he was available in the first place.



And you minimize the importance of thinking beyond "Team did it, it must be freakin' brilliant!". No team in the NFL is going to make my dead grandmother an NFL level cornerback.

I disagree. He played well. He's a 3-4 NT which is perfect for this defense. I'm not sure what the Browns are doing on defense but if they're going to a 4-3 base then Shelton wasn't a fit for them because he's too slow imo.

Anyway I'm excited about the Shelton trade and think he will have an impact this season. I consider the issue solved.

The RB issue I consider addressed but I agree with you that it's not solved unless downgrading was the goal.

Hopefully this weekend I'll be able to put some Shelton footage together. I'll try to show the good, the bad and the ugly. haha

 

[Tony2046]

A good rule of thumb when posting on the internet is to not say anything that you would not say in person.

***

And yes I would have said "asterisk asterisk asterisk" to you in person.