The Patriots played better defensively in the 4th quarter than it seemed

[EddardSnow67]

I changed the title of the thread because it definitely mischaracterized my point.

 

[Bonzo]

In support of the OP's thesis: that three-and-out after the turnover on downs felt really huge in the moment.

But in the larger picture: I think that overcoming a -3 turnover differential to score basically the exact same number of points as the Chiefs in regulation, on the road, reflects well on both the O and the D.

 

[Ring 6]

Ok, I said I wasn't going to do this, but here we go. If a defensive player pressures a quarterback into an incompletion but roughs him, does that or does it not bode well for the chances of pressuring the QB in the near future?

Was it the penalty that caused the incompletion? How likely is that player to commit that penalty again after having already been called for it once?

Also, the chance really was never zero, that's just what some people have been saying. The point is that I feel the chances were better than they may have seemed.

If you disagree, so be it. That's how it goes. But I felt people might be interested in my perspective. Maybe I was being arrogant to think that, I don't know.

Many of the penalties were because we were beaten in coverage.

It’s fine if you think that people may be interested in your opinion, but you should be open to the other side of the argument.

If your point was the chance wasn’t zero % and you weren’t trying to argue the chances looked good based upon the 4th quarter defense (that allowed 24 points btw) I wouldn’t have said anything because it’s never zero.
My contention was you putting a positive spin on the last 3 drives which were actual very bad defense.

 

[Ring 6]

They were torched in the 4th quarter on defense. Unfortunately that doesn't bode well for the SB. Rams are lethal too.

Can you go away for the next 2 weeks and leave the forum to pats fans as their team prepares for the SB? Surely your team has a message board you can go post on.

 

[EddardSnow67]

Many of the penalties were because we were beaten in coverage.

It’s fine if you think that people may be interested in your opinion, but you should be open to the other side of the argument.

If your point was the chance wasn’t zero % and you weren’t trying to argue the chances looked good based upon the 4th quarter defense (that allowed 24 points btw) I wouldn’t have said anything because it’s never zero.
My contention was you putting a positive spin on the last 3 drives which were actual very bad defense.

I'm very open to it! Seriously, that's why I'm here. I understand where you're coming from, I just felt like it looked better upon review than it appeared in the moment. I'm not trying to say that it was acceptable or that the ultimate results weren't bad.

 

[ALP]

go look at the game log and stat sheet

we destroyed KC in every facet of the game execept for:

1. penalties
2. big plays
3. turnovers (edit)

plenty of the big plays were lucky/hail marys or directly allowed b/c they were uncalled for penalties

the score was a lot closer than the game was, if we play KC again w/ same rosters its a 2 score win for Pats

 

[Patriot Missile]

Please stop trying to sell the blind boy a parakeet with its head missing.

They gave up 24 points in the 4th quarter! Don’t care if it was penalties or long plays. Just be thankful they beat the living crap out of them in the first half to secure the win.

 

[EddardSnow67]

Please stop trying to sell the blind boy a parakeet with its head missing.

They gave up 24 points in the 4th quarter! Don’t care if it was penalties or long plays. Just be thankful they beat the living crap out of them in the first half to secure the win.

I'm definitely not trying to do that.

 

[Ring 6]

Please stop trying to sell the blind boy a parakeet with its head missing.

They gave up 24 points in the 4th quarter! Don’t care if it was penalties or long plays. Just be thankful they beat the living crap out of them in the first half to secure the win.

Be thankful the GOAT is in our side.
Baddest motherf_cker on the planet.

 

[EddardSnow67]

Be thankful the GOAT is in our side.
Baddest motherf_cker on the planet.

We'll forever be in agreement on this!

 

[Patriot Missile]

Be thankful the GOAT is in our side.
Baddest motherf_cker on the planet.

Oh, you know I am. And yes he is.

 

[PatsWSB47]

They were torched in the 4th quarter on defense. Unfortunately that doesn't bode well for the SB. Rams are lethal too.

......and you just couldn't get the Pats road record out of your head before the Chiefs game...is this another gut feeling??????LMAO troll and just about everything you say is going to happen is wrong

 

[Biffins]

I've seen a lot of people in the media and here state that the Patriots couldn't stop the Chiefs in the 4th quarter and so, had the Chiefs won the toss, they would have easily gone down the field and scored.

In reality - and trust me, I felt at the time that we couldn't stop them, either - the Patriots played well defensively in the quarter. Once you look at the drive logs, you can see what I'm saying.

Firstly, about 60 of the Chiefs around 140 yards came on penalties.

They had 5 total first downs, 3 on penalties.

They ran 16 total plays and only 6 of them actually gained yardage that wasn't penalty yardage.

Obviously there was the fumble recovery that was negated due to, again, a penalty.

Their longest play - the 38 yard pass to Watkins to set up their last touchdown - was an illegal pick play that wasn't called.

Patrick Mahomes was 4 for 14 including incompletions negated due to penalties.

I don't see - after rewatching the game and checking the numbers - how it's reasonable to conclude that the Patriots couldn't stop the Chiefs in the 4th quarter. Oh, they also forced a 3 and out on one of the Chiefs possessions.

The Patriots dominated the game and in reality - not because I'm a homer, as I'm extremely objective - the Chiefs were fortunate to be in the game. Especially considering the two turnovers by the Patriots.

So as long a they marched down the field on penalties we were committing it still means defense played great, since defense should only be judged on plays it didn't commit penalties on.


WAIT WHAT?!?!

 

[WaterfallJumper]

I'm a little more sympathetic to the OP than others. The way I understood the post was that the defense wasn't necessarily gassed, or that Mahomes had cracked the code on their scheme, but that they'd remained competitive apart from ill timed penalties, so they had a shot at a stop in overtime. This seemed directed at Chiefs fans who claimed that if they won the coin toss, it's game over in their favor.

Where I diverge is that we can't possibly call it good defense, since they didn't do their job (even if that pick play was egregious). To their credit, however, they weren't outmanned, and I think Flores would have come up with a decent playcall to get a stop if they stopped the sloppy penalties. But that's pure conjuncture.

Thankfully, none of this matters. SB bound, baby!

 

[PatsWSB47]

No I couldn't get it out of my head. And rightfully so. Them winning on Sunday doesn't change the fact they were poor on the road up to that point. Now you are using hindsight. Based on everything up to that point, there was zero reason to feel confident in them on the road.

And if a Defense gets credit for the 1st half, they need to get blame for the 2nd half. Defense needs to put together a full 60 minute showing. Especially if the Pats want a realistic chance to win the SB.

I read your crap 2 or 3 times but all I see is blah, blah, blah. All you've done since you joined patsfans is spew negativity about what will happen or what would have happened "if" Jesus, do you think we're stupid?

 

[SHOWTIME15]

I love all these newbies starting threads....

 

[SHOWTIME15]

I don't think everyone is stupid. I definitely think you are stupid. Now try and argue that the D wasn't piss poor in the 2nd half. Hmm...you can't. They stink on the road. Snd technically SB 53 is on the road.

This is why you are not a Pats fan and we will never consider you to be one...

 

[PatsWSB47]

I don't think everyone is stupid. I definitely think you are stupid. Now try and argue that the D wasn't piss poor in the 2nd half. Hmm...you can't. They stink on the road. Snd technically SB 53 is on the road.

When did I ever say the defense was good in the second half? I'm just letting you know we're wise to your troll ways. Pregames you're here with all your doom and gloom, then you disappear after a win when everyone else is celebrating....and when you finally crawl out from under your bridge you're right back at it. You can't even celebrate the victory without diminishing it however you can. Look it. We all have concerns but we dont make it our mission to broadcast them 24/7[/QUOTE]

 

[Simpelton]

When you've got a legitimately great quarterback throwing seeds, I'm not gonna hold the weakness of the defense in the 4th quarter against them. Mahomes is good. Not good for a kid, not good for a first shot at the playoffs, he is a legitimately excellent quarterback who can pick apart much better defenses than ours.

End of the day, we all knew that it was eventually going to come down to a shootout between Mahomes and Brady, and we had to have confidence that Brady and Belichick would find a game winning advantage from that.

Ultimately if you look at time of possession Brady was our best defensive player, Mahomes could simply march down the field at will once he got a rhythm going, Belichick's and Brady's gameplan kept the ball out of his hands for 3/4 of the game and that was the difference.

 

[Simpelton]

Your point is correct on Mahomes. So this begs the question: Does that defensive performance give cause for great concern headed to Atlanta? Or, just chalk it up to playing an elite level QB in his house?

Bit of both. We sure can't win against the Rams the same way we did against the Chiefs, we had a huge advantage exploiting their lack of a running game, we'll have to plan it entirely differently in Atlanta so KC doesn't set much of a precedent.