TC ROSTER TALK

[Zuma]

 

[jlu52]

3 lbs for Thornton.

The Barney Fife of WRs.

All due respect, nip it, nip it in the bud. Betcha he could kick your ass with his hands tied behind his back

 

[WinstonSmith]

I saw video of him. He was actually much bigger than ever before. What I saw was a frightful sight. It was of someone unable to move.

Put it this way. He reminded me of those 6'8" - 6'10" 450 pound Americans who aren't playing football.

Could you post the video that you've referring to? I didn't watch many OTA videos, but I did see an 8 second video of him doing a drill half assed, and going through a drill lazily can give off unable to move vibes.

On the Trent Brown BMI scale he seemed normal for what I would expect in June. His weight was just listed at 370, and the recent pictures of him training with weights as well as pictures of him training with fellow linemen shows a Trent Brown that is in pretty decent shape when compared to him during his most gluttonous years.

For me I'm more concerned about his general attitude, and hope that this being his contract year and the addition of Klemm will help him be properly motivated. We will find out in camp, as unfortunately it's not uncommon for vets to treat OTAs with disinterest.

 

[Triumph]

All due respect, nip it, nip it in the bud. Betcha he could kick your ass with his hands tied behind his back

Yeah, he's a real beast.

 

[jimnance]

Trent will be fine if the rest of the OL steps up. If they don't he'll probably be inconsistent again.

That makes no sense.
Our IOL was very good most of the year when healthy. Strange struggled early but got better as the year went on.
So the play of his fellow ol weren't tge issue. ?He was.
The problem was both ots were horrible.
By any metric you wanna use, Brown was one of the 5 or 6 worst lts in the nfl.
Was among the leaders in allowing sacks but what really drove me nuts last year was all his freaking penalties. The always seemed to come at a crucial time, negating a 1st down. After the season I checked the stats and I believe he was most penalized lt in the league or close to it. A ton of holds and that speaks to being out of shape and laziness. He was one of the worst offensive players on the team.
We can all speculate on the reason but it doesnt matter. He absolutely cant play like that this year. He doesnt need to be the stud he was a few years ago - those days are likely gone- but just be a solid lt.
Problem is we really don't have a replacement. So like everyone else,I expect BB to try different people like Sow in training camp/ preseason. Even if Brown steps up we still need a solid backup as I don't trust him to last a full season.

 

[jimnance]

All due respect, nip it, nip it in the bud. Betcha he could kick your ass with his hands tied behind his back

W/o question

 

[n1997y]

3 lbs for Thornton.

The Barney Fife of WRs.

Hey, be fair! 3 pounds for Thornton may put him near the top of the list based on percentage weight gain.

 

[WinstonSmith]

That makes no sense.
Our IOL was very good most of the year when healthy. Strange struggled early but got better as the year went on.
So the play of his fellow ol weren't tge issue. ?He was.
The problem was both ots were horrible.
By any metric you wanna use, Brown was one of the 5 or 6 worst lts in the nfl.
Was among the leaders in allowing sacks but what really drove me nuts last year was all his freaking penalties. The always seemed to come at a crucial time, negating a 1st down. After the season I checked the stats and I believe he was most penalized lt in the league or close to it. A ton of holds and that speaks to being out of shape and laziness. He was one of the worst offensive players on the team.
We can all speculate on the reason but it doesnt matter. He absolutely cant play like that this year. He doesnt need to be the stud he was a few years ago - those days are likely gone- but just be a solid lt.
Problem is we really don't have a replacement. So like everyone else,I expect BB to try different people like Sow in training camp/ preseason. Even if Brown steps up we still need a solid backup as I don't trust him to last a full season.

Wynn was worse than Brown and indeed was horrible. Maybe we are splitting hairs but I saw Brown as being below average, but not horrible. In analytical terms he sucked but didn't completely suck. I looked up PFF's grades on Brown and Wynn, and decided to post them because this time they agreed with me. They had Brown at 67.4 or a backup/almost a starter (70) with Wynn landing in Replaceable with a 54.8 score.

Regardless, he certainly did have his issues last year including committing way to many penalties, but I think when trying to gauge his future 2023 performance a litte bit of context is needed; specifically he was asked to switch sides, which I've heard other linemen describe as being very akward, and he had Patricia coaching him. He, like Bourne, seems to react badly to adversity and having a more stable environment, better coaching, and having a second year on the left side, or being placed back on his old familiar side could elivate him to being the solid LT or RT that you are looking for, and I think he has a decent shot of reaching that threshhold.

 

[Triumph]

W/o question

Lets see if he makes it through camp first.

 

[jimnance]

Wynn was worse than Brown and indeed was horrible. Maybe we are splitting hairs but I saw Brown as being below average, but not horrible. In analytical terms he sucked but didn't completely suck. I looked up PFF's grades on Brown and Wynn, and decided to post them because this time they agreed with me. They had Brown at 67.4 or a backup/almost a starter (70) with Wynn landing in Replaceable with a 54.8 score.

Regardless, he certainly did have his issues last year including committing way to many penalties, but I think when trying to gauge his future 2023 performance a litte bit of context is needed; specifically he was asked to switch sides, which I've heard other linemen describe as being very akward, and he had Patricia coaching him. He, like Bourne, seems to react badly to adversity and having a more stable environment, better coaching, and having a second year on the left side, or being placed back on his old familiar side could elivate him to being the solid LT or RT that you are looking for, and I think he has a decent shot of reaching that threshhold.

Yes,Wynn was horrible but Brown wasn't much better. His sacks allowed + penalties rank him as one of the worst 5 lts in the nfl last year.
That's the very definition of horrible.
I'm hopeful that the combo of Klemm and BOB will help get him going.
If Mac has time to throw this year, this offense can be productive. Put it this way:
If Trent plays like a solid lt this season that would give a much bigger boost to the offense than signing DHop would
It's simply the single most crucial upgrade on the entire team.

 

[Sect140]

If Brown shows up out of shape and first few practices it looks like last year does Bill make him the first cut? I’m not sure what it would mean from a contract perspective. This way he’s not taking reps away on whoever would replace him, although others have mentioned they may not have someone to step in.

 

[yukon cornelius]

Im curious as to who decided that Trent Browns problem is that he's out of shape. I don't recall him ever looking like someone who was in great shape to begin with. I think he's still young enough and an absolute monster of a man so I still have high expectations for him. He should be able to play as good as he did in the past again if the rest of the line gets its crap together.

Brown is in a contract year........after all this hand wringing, he's going to be just fine....in fact, he's going to play his way right out of NE and into a a solid contract (then he's going to fail to live up to it)

 

[Patsfan1958]

 

[WinstonSmith]

I expected Onwenu to start on PUP. It's good to see that no other big names were listed.

 

[Toofy]

Douglas has increased from 170 to 190 and Thornton has increased by just 3 lbs. Hoping he has gotten more strong and pliable. If Thornton again gets injured this season most of us would be exploding off in WTH.

 

[yukon cornelius]

Douglas has increased from 170 to 190 and Thornton has increased by just 3 lbs. Hoping he has gotten more strong and pliable. If Thornton again gets injured this season most of us would be exploding off in WTH.

He has a body type that's just not going to add mass....

 

[TheBeers]

DeVonta Smith is 6' 170 and looks every bit as scrawny as TT. There's no reason he can't be successful in the NFL with his body type. He just needs to be used correctly for his skillset and be smart about getting lit up by tacklers.

 

[State]

f this team is firing on all cylinders and can capture lightning in a bottle, they'll surprise a lot of people, including me.

Very true. This team has a high floor, limited ceiling. Unless the offense starts cooking with a dominant running game, get the TEs involved and, deep strikes open up for WRs. Esp Thornton.

If big chunks plays open up for speedy guys on the outside, then this would be a tough offense to defend. Go, Tyquan. We’re all rooting for you!

 

[DaBruinz]

I'm curious what the Patriots are going to do with the two remaining roster spots.

 

[DaBruinz]

I don't see an official thread for pure roster discussion and debate. So here it is.

Let's talk OL -
Can Brown return to form and lock down LT?
Will Stueber emerge and make the team as the LT in waiting?
Can Reiff hold off McDermott at RT as the old vets compete with young unknowns like Sow?

Steuber has never played LT. He started at RT next to Onwenu at Michigan for several games.
It's going to be very interesting at the Tackle positions.

WR is every years enigma -
Thornton might be the most important piece this summer.
The 3 top guys are who we know they are.
What about Boutte or Douglas?
Who could be a surprise vet WR signing by the end of camp?

Smith-Shuster, Parker, Thornton.
I've very surprised with the rumor mill saying that Bourne would have been the odd man out. They may have held onto him until everyone cleared the Conditioning run.
Unless Boutte gets his act together, he may not see a Pre-Season game if Mills reaction to O'Brien's tirade was any indication.

RB seems locked -
Keep Rham healthy, he could emerge as one of the leagues top all-around backs.
Let Strong play.
Ty could be the missing piece on O, more in the James White role.

I think only Rham, Strong, and Harris are guaranteed. Montgomery has to show he can recover from his injury. I think McKissic would be a good addition as the 4th RB if Montgomery isn't ready to go.

TE should be improved -
It's all about what Gesicki brings.
Do we carry 3? Firkser or Sokol as the journeyman?

I was a bit surprised we really didn't hear anything about Lumpkin or Firsker from the mini-camps.

DL is probably the strength of this team -
Can Barmore become a dominant 3 down DT we need?
Will Godchaux/Davis/Ekuale be enough as the other "Guy" (pun intended)
We need White to add production immediately in spelling Wise Jr.

I love Lawrence Guy. I loved it when the Pats signed him. That being said, Lawrence didn't play well to start last season. It will be interesting to see if he shows up for the start of camp or if he askes the Pats for his release because of the contract impasse.

LB is a dying position -
Bentley & Tavai are the only true ILB's, our whole front may ride on Bentley playing every down.
Mapu, Wilson, Board may qualify here.
DE/OLB is in good hands with Judon, Uche, White, Jennings?

It's going to be interesting to see if White lines up with the DEs or with the LBs. Perkins is on a make or break year. It would be nice if he steppd up and allowed White to be behind Wise.

I'd like to see Jennings progress so that he can spell Bentley or even Replace Tavai.

DBs provide the most intrigue -
All rides on Gonzalez being a star in year one.
Will Mills play strictly FS, or NB?
Can M. Jones save us from Bryant at Slot Corner?
J. Jones, Peppers, Bledsoe provide high potential questions.

Mills is likely only playing FS, though I'm sure they'll use his versatility to throw changes at opposing offenses.
Marcus Jones should see his role grow.

If I might suggest. If you're talking about Jack Jones, write it as Ja. Jones since J. Jones could refer to Jon Jones as well.

ST is as unknown as we've had -
Does BB gamble with the rookies?
Cutting Folk for Ryland might be the biggest decision of the season.

Notice I left off QB - there's nothing to discuss here.

Special teams will be built around Slater, Board, Co. Davis, and Schooler.

On Punt coverage, you'll have Cardona (in all likelihood) as the Snapper and Cody Davis as your Personal Protector and Baringer as the Punter (barring injury or a complete collapse). Slater and Schooler would be your Gunners. I don't know where Board has played on the line, but I would think it was one of the wing.

With the new Kick-off rules, it's going to be interesting to see if they just go for Touchbacks all the time or they try Squibs or they pull a "Waterboy" action and kick it right at someone's head on a line drive at someone's head (only partially joking).