Randy Moss, Richard Seymour, Ty Law Among HOF semi-finalists

[SammyBlueCat]

Remember when we had a starting "3-4" defensive line of Seymour, Wilfork, and Warren? Remember all 3 in their prime?

 

[Deus Irae]

You know how we feel about having Tom at qb?.....like we're fortunate to have unquestionably the very best at the position?

That's how I felt about our dline when we had Seymour/Wilfork/Warren.

Seymour's departure has caused a lot of people around here to go about underrating him. He was one of the elite DLs of his era, and probably the best the Patriots have ever had.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Well, apparently TO doesn’t think Moss is a first ballot HOFer...

 

[PatriotsNumero1Fan]

Well, apparently TO doesn’t think Moss is a first ballot HOFer...

He's mad that Randy Moss likely will get in on the first ballot. He should have been as well but all sour grapes from Terrell Owens.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Significantly better than Bruschi, adjusted for postiton. Better then law, but close. Haynes is a tough one for me but I lean to Seymour. Same with Tippett bit Tippett wasn’t as complete.
Bruschi is fan favorite not in the best argument imo but Law, Haynes, Tippett and Seymour is an impossible argument.

Bru made so many big plays in big moments I put him in there. Agree he is not at the other four's talent level.

I can't choose between the other 3 and Sey. Way too hair splitting.

 

[yukon cornelius]

hahaha at brian urlacher as a semi-finalist

jerry kramer should be a no-brainer as a senior semi finalist

wonder if this is the year coryell finally makes it?


unfortunately it's going to be the white suit ray ****show of a year

 

[yukon cornelius]

hahaha at brian urlacher as a semi-finalist

jerry kramer should be a no-brainer as a senior semi finalist

wonder if this is the year coryell finally makes it?


unfortunately it's going to be the white suit ray ****show of a year

 

[RobertWeathers]

Remember when we had a starting "3-4" defensive line of Seymour, Wilfork, and Warren? Remember all 3 in their prime?

Warren was pretty damn good for a few years as well.

 

[lancerman]

He's mad that Randy Moss likely will get in on the first ballot. He should have been as well but all sour grapes from Terrell Owens.

Sucks to say but he was a point. For most of their careers TO and Moss were considered the best WR's after Jerry Rice and their numbers are very close. Moss is generally considered better. But TO should have been an easy first ballot and he's not apparently due to character issues and Moss also had character issues.

It's a joke that we even have to consider that Moss might not be first ballot and it devalues the Hall more than it would him. But you could say the same for TO.

 

[goheels22002]

Seymour's departure has caused a lot of people around here to go about underrating him. He was one of the elite DLs of his era, and probably the best the Patriots have ever had.

Other than Vince Wilfork, Seymour was the best DL who played more than five or six years for the Patriots that I can remember. Willie McGinest was right there with those guys dating back to the impact he had on the 1996 SB team. But McGinest was more of a hybrid DE/LB than a pure DL.

I didn't blame either side for the separation when Seymour left for the Raiders. His back was causing him serious problems and missed games already, and he was due a max contract for his ability and that stage of his career. It was too bad that it got acrimonious and he couldn't work out a contract like Logan Mankins did when he took on the front office. Mankins wasn't looking at a career-ending injury the way Seymour was at that time.

While we're on the topic of best ever, Mankins is right there as best ever with John Hannah for me due to his leadership and ability to bring along an incredible line of first-rate linemen at all the positions. And among coaches, Dante Scarnecchia should get into the NFL Hall of Fame when the time comes. What he's doing this year, with this line is just amazing.

 

[RayClay]

It was a laugh hearing Felger say that Moss shouldn't be in the HOF. Moss is the 2nd greatest receiver in the history of the league and certainly the most gifted.

He should be first ballot no doubt.

I disagree. Moss is the best receiver in history. "Sticky gloves" might have piled up numbers, but HOF should be more than that. Was Rice anywhere near the threat to defenses Moss was at any time in his career? I think not. He was consistent.

It's why some mediocre pitchers who played long and amassed numbers are in the HOF and Luis Tiant isn't.

 

[Ring 6]

I disagree. Moss is the best receiver in history. "Sticky gloves" might have piled up numbers, but HOF should be more than that. Was Rice anywhere near the threat to defenses Moss was at any time in his career? I think not. He was consistent.

It's why some mediocre pitchers who played long and amassed numbers are in the HOF and Luis Tiant isn't.

Jerry Rice was better then Moss

 

[RayClay]

Jerry Rice was better then Moss

I disagree. Rice was a great receiver and consistent, but defenses did not have to adjust like they did for Moss. Moss was bigger, much more athletic and much faster than Rice. Rice had the advantage of playing with a great QB, system/coaching and varied offense {Craig]. He might have had better hands without the glue, but there's no way of knowing.

Moss had the advantage of a great system, quarterback and offense one year and I think the results speak for themselves.

 

[borg]

The NE defense was transformed from middling to elite the day Seymour was finally given the starters job....week 4 (?) of 2001. With Seymour on the field, the experienced NE LBs were freed up to do incredible things and NE's D became dominant. In my mind, Seymour was the undeniable key to the 2001 success...ahead of Brady who was a competent game manager early in his career
Law was elite....and the reality that NE's secondary woes and lack of trophies coincided with Law's aging/departure....says everything.
Moss.......his impact on the game should not be overshadowed by his hot/cold attitude. A true NFL star.

 

[PatriotsNumero1Fan]

Jerry Rice was the greatest wr to play the game and it would asinine to not think otherwise. It was his ability to run routes and show up in the biggest games. He had over 1000 yards at age 40.

 

[Deus Irae]

Other than Vince Wilfork, Seymour was the best DL who played more than five or six years for the Patriots that I can remember. Willie McGinest was right there with those guys dating back to the impact he had on the 1996 SB team. But McGinest was more of a hybrid DE/LB than a pure DL.

I didn't blame either side for the separation when Seymour left for the Raiders. His back was causing him serious problems and missed games already, and he was due a max contract for his ability and that stage of his career. It was too bad that it got acrimonious and he couldn't work out a contract like Logan Mankins did when he took on the front office. Mankins wasn't looking at a career-ending injury the way Seymour was at that time.

While we're on the topic of best ever, Mankins is right there as best ever with John Hannah for me due to his leadership and ability to bring along an incredible line of first-rate linemen at all the positions. And among coaches, Dante Scarnecchia should get into the NFL Hall of Fame when the time comes. What he's doing this year, with this line is just amazing.

Patriots best, by position, IMO:

Coach - BB
QB - Brady
RB - Cunningham (?). Martin (?), Nance (?)
TE - Gronk
WR - Welker
OL - Hannah
DL - Seymour
LB - Tippett
CB - Haynes
S - McCourty (?), Harrison (?)
K - Gostkowski
P - Camarillo

Honorable mentions: Morgan, Moss, Vinatieri, Armstrong, Coates, Wilfork, Nelson, Law

 

[borg]

Patriots best, by position, IMO:

Coach - BB
QB - Brady
RB - Cunningham (?). Martin (?), Nance (?)
TE - Gronk
WR - Welker
OL - Hannah
DL - Seymour
LB - Tippett
CB - Haynes
S - McCourty (?), Harrison (?)
K - Gostkowski
P - Camarillo

Honorable mentions: Morgan, Moss, Vinatieri, Armstrong, Coates, Wilfork, Nelson, Law

What duration is required to earn "best" ?
How about a positional list based on Greatest Single Year by a Patriot?

 

[ALP]

Richard Seymour! Where have you been?!?

For all you super yungins...Seymour was a beast! Don't look at the stats, look at the amount of plays he was double teamed.....and then look at his stats

there was a poster few years back that had a signature from a journalist that was killing Seymour pick and how he would amount to nothing, and talkinga bout some other guy that was drafted instead who will be awesome...and turned out to be a bust

good times

 

[RayClay]

there was a poster few years back that had a signature from a journalist that was killing Seymour pick and how he would amount to nothing, and talkinga bout some other guy that was drafted instead who will be awesome...and turned out to be a bust

good times

That was the classic Borges arrogant, stupid quote of all time...

"On a day when they could have had impact players David Terrell or Koren Robinson or the second-best tackle in the draft in Kenyatta Walker, they took Georgia defensive tackle Richard Seymour, who had 1 sack last season in the pass-happy SEC and is too tall to play tackle at 6-6 and too slow to play defensive end. This genius move was followed by trading out of a spot where they could have gotten the last decent receiver in Robert Ferguson and settled for tackle Matt Light, who will not help any time soon."

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

I need to think about that one. He's top 5 at a minimum.

Finalists:
Law
Tippett
Haynes
Bru

Rodney

I loved Bru, but Rodney Harrison also excelled in big moments, is widely underrated, and I'd have to give him a slight edge.