LoMo poll

[danny88]

Actually, it's the perfect example, which is why I used it. Brown is considered the greatest running back of all times by almost everyone involved in football. This is not because he has the most yards of all time. This simple fact points out the problem with your argument. I'm sorry that you feel the need to lie about my post in order to avoid having to admit your argument fails, but that's really not my problem. Emmitt Smith has 18355 career rushing yards. That's the most in NFL history. He's not considered the best RB of all time, Jim Brown is. It's that simple.

And, again, when you quote NSA as an ally, you make yourself look like an idiot. I have a Bates 640 stapler here on my desk that knows more about football than NSA seems to.

Ok so if stats do not have to be used to prove who is the best ever. Why cant the people who dont like Maroney form the opinion watching Maroney run? You guys seem to think your stats prove your argument but when used in a different context they dont matter.

Tenative tap dancer comes to mind when watching Lo Mo run.

 

[National Sports Advisors]

Actually, it's the perfect example, which is why I used it. Brown is considered the greatest running back of all times by almost everyone involved in football. This is not because he has the most yards of all time. This simple fact points out the problem with your argument. I'm sorry that you feel the need to lie about my post in order to avoid having to admit your argument fails, but that's really not my problem. Emmitt Smith has 18355 career rushing yards. That's the most in NFL history. He's not considered the best RB of all time, Jim Brown is. It's that simple.

And, again, when you quote NSA as an ally, you make yourself look like an idiot. I have a Bates 640 stapler here on my desk that knows more about football than NSA seems to.

LOL! Ya, ok buddy. I just left more production in the toilet than LoMo has given the Pats in almost 2 years.

 

[A.C Vegas]

When is somebody going to answer WHY it is ok to assume Maroney would maintain his 4.3 YPC

Cause they they tried Faulk as the primary back before they went to Smith the fisrt superbowl year. As Good as Faulk is he is a Third down abck and need open space and draw plays to evern get started most of the time.

As for this Maroney "apologist" I never once said he was great I was against drafting him when they did. But he has had lfashes of brillance
despite what you have said. I have never cheery picked stats to supposrt my arguement. I just know what I know from watching the game and what I see is that when he has a hole he get 5-7 yards. usually when he doesn't and the line doesn't get blown up and in the backfield he gets 2-3 yards and I'll take that from my running back anytime in this offense. Last year when we could barely pass he almost broke a 1000 yards while splitting time and missing games. Maroney's stats this year are low because they don't need to be high.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Why can't you ANSWER my question?
When is somebody going to answer WHY it is ok to assume Maroney would maintain his 4.3 YPC if he got the ball 18-20 times a game and Kevin Faulk would not???? Somebody tell me why this is? Is it because Maroney is bigger, tougher, what? Maroney is NOT a tough runner so why the hell are we to believe he is better than McGahee who only has a 3.8 on way more carries, but also is the #1 option on the entire offense? Answer me that Maroney apologists. I want to know.

Because, as has been pointed out numerous times before, in the two seasons in which Kevin Faulk got over 160 carries, his YPC were 3.5 and 3.6 respectively.

Maroney carried the ball 175 times in 2006 with the oft-mentioned 4.6 YPC.

Faulk maintains a nice YPC when he is used in the 50-55 carries per season range. It is fact.

You really need to think about the concept of fact. It would be useful for your arguments. A lot of clever debaters have learned to work fact into their arguments from time to time, in order to substantiate their opinions. Staggeringly effective by comparison.

PFnV

 

[Deus Irae]

Ok so if stats do not have to be used to prove who is the best ever. Why cant the people who dont like Maroney form the opinion watching Maroney run? You guys seem to think your stats prove your argument but when used in a different context they dont matter.

Tenative tap dancer comes to mind when watching Lo Mo run.

I think that I can speak for a lot of the people who are defending Maroney when I say that we don't really care what your opinion about him is, but we care that you're posting it every chance you get. Your opinion is your own, and you're entitled to it. We don't need you, VJCpatriot and NSA pulling the NEM trick of hijacking thread after thread and making thread after thread to beat the same dead horse over and over. We get it. You don't like Maroney.

 

[danny88]

I think that I can speak for a lot of the people who are defending Maroney when I say that we don't really care what your opinion about him is, but we care that you're posting it every chance you get. Your opinion is your own, and you're entitled to it. We don't need you, VJCpatriot and NSA pulling the NEM trick of hijacking thread after thread and making thread after thread to beat the same dead horse over and over. We get it. You don't like Maroney.

Hijacking thread after thread? The last thread I posted in about Maroney was the thread that brought up criticism and rumors from the Media about Maroney. I didnt start the thread. I didnt "diss" anyone.

There is no thread hijacking going on in a thread about Maroney.Get off your high horse.


I had a mod start a thread about how much of an idiot I am. Not once have I ever insulted someone for no reason. Don't tell me about how to post. You don't want to hear how some are not happy about Maroney in threads dedicated to him? A dead horse eh?

Its ok when people rave about how great we are, or how great Tommy or Moss is over and over and over. Thats ok though. Exactly , hypocritical.

 

[Deus Irae]

Hijacking thread after thread? The last thread I posted in abot LoMo was the one in which the thread topic was critasism about Maroney.

There is no thread hijacking going on in a thread about Maroney.


Get off your high horse.


I had a mod start a thread about how much of an idiot I am. Not once have I ever insulted someone for no reason. Dont tell me about how to post.

I'm not on a high horse. I was responding to your post. And let's not get to lying now. I didn't mention just you, I mentioned you as one of 3 people. You 3 have started the threads and you have hijacked others, and that 3 does include you. You've done it, so don't act as if you haven't.

 

[danny88]

I'm not on a high horse. I was responding to your post. And let's not get to lying now. I didn't mention just you, I mentioned you as one of 3 people. You 3 have started the threads and you have hijacked others, and that 3 does include you. You've done it, so don't act as if you have.

Please show me ALL the Maroney threads I have started.

Also , give me examples of all the threads I hijacked.


Lets see it.

 

[Deus Irae]

Please show me ALL the Maroney threads I have started.

Also , give me examples of all the threads I hijacked.


Lets see it.

Why would I bother going back over all your posts just to show you what you already know? However, just so you can't pull the "See? None..." sort of nonsense, I'll use one of your own posts for an example:

Bro thats the issue. I have not started a maroney thread since my hof glass thread.


I started a pole yesterday but that is about it.


All the posing I was doing was in other peoples threads about Maroney. Why can't I talk about Maroney in threads where everyone else it. I only get flack because I think he is a avg back who was not worth his draft position......

Without even looking for anything, that's two Maroney threads right there. And, yes, a poll is still a thread.

 

[National Sports Advisors]

Addai has had a reception in 25 of his 27 career games, has accounted for 100 all purpose yards or more in 12 out his 27 games, and has scored 19 touchdowns in his 27 games. Addai had a 4.8 YPC on 226 carries last year and has a 4.2 YPC on 223 carries this year.

Maroney has only had a reception in 11 of his 22 games, has accounted for 100 all purposes yards or more in just 5 of his 22 games, and has scored just 9 TD's in 22 games. Maroney had a 4.3 YPC last year on 175 carries and has a 4.3 YPC this year on 118 carries.

Those are your stats. When the Colts offense was HEALTHY, Addai showed why he is a STUD with a great 4.8 YPC. That's what STUDS do when they run behind GREAT pasing games. Robert Smith, Marshall Faulk, and Edgerrin James all had great YPC numbers when they played on 3 of the best offenses of all time. What Maroney is doing running behind a GREAT PASING GAME that is 100% healthy is put up the type of numbers that any AVERAGE back could do. I guess the Maroney PR team is going to tell us next that the Colts have a better run blocking o-line than ours? Puhleaze.

 

[danny88]

Why would I bother going back over all your posts just to show you what you already know? However, just so you can't pull the "See? None..." sort of nonsense, I'll use one of your own posts for an example:



Without even looking for anything, that's two Maroney threads right there. And, yes, a poll is still a thread.

You wont look because what you said is a bold faced lie.

The glass thread was 2 months ago. This is a pole you and other's like yourself spun into the ground. I asked for people to keep it clean. I was respectful. I asked for people to post without the "crap".

Guess what happens? Posters like dabruinz run in spewing verbal diarrhea in a rage and spin the thread out of control. Again get off the high horse, you guys are for more "inflammatory" then us.

Btw as for the numerous threads and hijacks by me , FALSE. You are just making things up now.



Maroney would have a 3.4 ypc in a system other then ours. KK Keith is just as much a product of his system as Maroney is. Only thing is, Keith was not a first round choice. He was a jag.

 

[VJCPatriot]

And, again, when you quote NSA as an ally,

Ally? How dense can you get? I was talking specifically about how your Jim Brown example made me fall on the floor laughing. Borrow a sense of humor dude... or should I say CLOWN SHOES? LOL.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Addai has had a reception in 25 of his 27 career games, has accounted for 100 all purpose yards or more in 12 out his 27 games, and has scored 19 touchdowns in his 27 games. Addai had a 4.8 YPC on 226 carries last year and has a 4.2 YPC on 223 carries this year.

Maroney has only had a reception in 11 of his 22 games, has accounted for 100 all purposes yards or more in just 5 of his 22 games, and has scored just 9 TD's in 22 games. Maroney had a 4.3 YPC last year on 175 carries and has a 4.3 YPC this year on 118 carries.

Those are your stats. When the Colts offense was HEALTHY, Addai showed why he is a STUD with a great 4.8 YPC. That's what STUDS do when they run behind GREAT pasing games. Robert Smith, Marshall Faulk, and Edgerrin James all had great YPC numbers when they played on 3 of the best offenses of all time. What Maroney is doing running behind a GREAT PASING GAME that is 100% healthy is put up the type of numbers that any AVERAGE back could do. I guess the Maroney PR team is going to tell us next that the Colts have a better run blocking o-line than ours? Puhleaze.

So you are saying that Addai should not be dumped from the Colts. I agree.

I do not see how this shores up your argument that Maroney should be dumped from the Pats, or his role reduced.

I gave you a list of backs with 175+ carries (actually I think I snuck one in for you in the 160s) and at least 4.3 yards per carry.

These are Maroney's peers. Yes, Addai is in there. Travis Henry too. And Ladell Betts, and Tatum Bell. These are not superstars. They are okay running backs, to good running backs.

As to the alternatives:

- At 22, barring injury, there seems little to no risk that Maroney's production will spontaneously collapse
- There is, however, a sizeable risk in replacing a running back with a rookie, that the rookie is unable to carry the load in the pros. Maroney > any prospect in the category of "risk of underperformance"
- There is a cost, both in draft pick/trade bait, and in salary cap, if we attempt to replace Maroney through FA
- There is no other current Patriots player who could replace those 175 carries.
- At the range of carries (175) we gave him his rookie year, he succeeded in carrying the load (4.3 YPC). Faulk has failed to do so twice out of two tries, dropping to 3.5 and 3.6 yards per carry respectively in those two seasons.

Your admiration of Addai and Peterson demonstrates exactly one thing: That you admire Addai and Peterson.

Given that neither of these individuals are playing for the Pats, this means precisely d i c k.

Given that the Pats are getting a decent ROI from Maroney, it looks like a bad idea to replace him.

And finally, the Pats' offense is a powerhouse this year. We'll be doing the cap dance this offseason, trying to keep the best parts of this team together, while shoring up points on the D that are showing signs of wear. It's considered almost a pipe dream, for example, that we would be able to retain Asante Samuel (which is another argument entirely.)

Why would we add cap pressures to our team's situation in the offseason, by trying to "fix" one of the phases of the game that work the best?

NSA/DannyBoy, you and your few supporters are all wet. I do thank you, however, for continuing your howls of agony over the Pats only having a very good running game, rather than a single "stud" running back.

It caused me to look into a few things: How Maroney compared among running backs (quite well, but not elite; ) How the Pats' running game this year compares in the league (great; ) and why the Pats feel good about Maroney (it simply makes sense.)

You've shown yourselves to be lousy readers in the past, and likely won't read this post either.

You don't display any desire to learn about football, which is sad, because you seem to have a good deal to learn.

"I can name somebody with better numbers" is a poor excuse for an analysis of personnel resources... thank God you guys don't work for the Pats. I do wonder, however, whether either of you are in the employ of the Washington Redskins. Your approach seems to be a popular one in that team's front office.

PFnV

 

[DaBruinz]

Mommy, NSA stole my ball and I'm going home!!! Wah Wah Wah!! Buddy, grow up. I have not ONCE called you a moron, idiot, or ****** like you have called me. It's not because you are not one, but it's because I don't get all worked up over message boards. The fact is I think your boy Maroney sucks. I'm not alone. I thought Drew Bozo sucked when he was here. And, trust me pal, you wouldn't have the balls to call me a moron at a bar. Strap a pair on and grow up son. And while your at it, tell Maroney to strap a pair on too.

WOW. Your reading comprehension is pathetic.

1) You're right. You've never called me a moron or idiot. But, I never claimed you did so why are you claiming I have?

2) I've never called you a ******. I called you an imbecile. Sp, there is another thing that you have made up.

3) You are one of the very few people who think that Maroney sucks. And please don't claim that this poll shows that he does because that isn't what was said.

4) Trust me, Moron, I WOULD call you a MORON to your face if we were in a bar. I'm not some PANSY like yourself who makes threats. Imbeciles like yourself don't scare me because I know, at the end of the day, if it results to physical violence, I've already won.

 

[DaBruinz]

So then you must admit Manning is better then Brady right? Just look at the stats! The people who think Brady is better are just shouting opinions with no facts!

( I dont think that)

The Stats include WINS and LOSSES in meaningful games.

Brady has more come from behind victories since he became a starter than Manning has is that time frame.

Brady has guided the Pats to more WINS in that time frame than Manning has guided the Colts.

Brady has 3 SBs to Manning's 1.

Those are the stats that matter.

 

[DaBruinz]

Yep. Kenton Keith is every bit as good as Maroney by the stats. Didnt they get that guy from the CFL?

You are such a moron. YOU ignore the valid arguments that are made regarding the experience of the O-line in the particular system, yet you USE it as a point AGAINST Maroney by using Kenton Keith.

You are truly pathetic.

 

[DaBruinz]

Here you go:

Somebody asked me, what do you expect of the #21 pick in the NFL draft?
And I respond how about a RB like McGahee (#23) or Addai (#30).
Is that so much to ask? When you watch those guys go against the Patriots head to head, you begin to realize, those teams have got runningbacks that can carry their teams on their shoulders and that Maroney has a LONG way to go before he can be mentioned in the same breath as those guys.

McGahee #23 overall
Year 1 1128 yards
Year 2 1247 yards

2375 yards in 32 games
Normalized for 23 games 1707 yards

Your numbers for McGahee are wrong. year 1 - DNP

Also, Buffalo was a running team in 2004 483 RUSHS to 461 Passes. In 2005, they were only marginally a passing team with 459 passes to 428 runs.

Addai #30 overall
Year 1 1081 yards
Year 2 943 yards (through 11 games)

2024 in 27 games
Normalized for 23 games 1724 yards

Maroney #21 overall
Year 1 745 yards (14 games)
Year 2 511 yards (through 9 games)

23 game total 1256 yards

So even after you normalize the other players stats to account for the games Maroney has missed due to him being injury prone, they still significantly outproduce Maroney in the same span of games. I'll take Addai or McGahee, who were both taken later, over Maroney any time.

You keep claiming Maroney is injury prone, yet you ignore reality. He had a SHOULDER/RIB injury that there is NO WAY to prevent short of NOT playing the game. The hamstring injury, however, is preventable.

But that doesn't make the guy injury prone. And its just plain ignorance to say he is,.

Now, there are problems with what you offer up.
You "NORMALIZE" those players stats instead of having the balls to go out and get them.

Also, you do not take into consideration that the Buffalo O-line, while its been poor in pass protection for YEARS, its been very good in run blocking. Also, you ignore that the COLTS O-line has been running the same scheme for years. The pats SWITCHED schemes. If you don't think that is hampering their blocking, I have some land in New Mexico that is located on the gulf.

 

[danny88]

The Stats include WINS and LOSSES in meaningful games.

Brady has more come from behind victories since he became a starter than Manning has is that time frame.

Brady has guided the Pats to more WINS in that time frame than Manning has guided the Colts.

Brady has 3 SBs to Manning's 1.

Those are the stats that matter.

This post contradics everything you have said to this point. You said we ignore the stats. So now you are avoiding the stats that kill your argument. I guess trent Dilfer is a better qb then Marino since Dilfer a sb.


So now only certain stats like wins and sb's matter? Guess Barry Sanders sucked. Ok dabruinz

 

[DaBruinz]

BTW, the same people who believe that Maroney's YPC stat would translate to 1200 plus yards if he got 300 carries are the same people who believe the part-time outfielder's of the world would put up 50 HR's just because they hit 15 HR's in limited action. It gets to the point of diminishing returns, my friends. Does ANYONE think Kevin Faulk would get 1200 plus yards if he got 300 carries just because he has a 4.4 YPC??????? Hell no!! He's not tough enough to withstand the pounding nor is he good enough to overcome the increased scrutiny and design by oppossing defenses to stop him. The same applies with Maroney.

No they aren't. You just say that because you are clueless and can't actually focus on reality and the other arguments that have been presented.

 

[danny88]

You are such a moron. YOU ignore the valid arguments that are made regarding the experience of the O-line in the particular system, yet you USE it as a point AGAINST Maroney by using Kenton Keith.

You are truly pathetic.

Oh look Dabruinz melting down all over the place again