Debate Brady vs Belichick?

[PatsFanInVa]

I actually think there’s a good chance they will make a run to the Super Bowl. They’re starting to peak now. Though Washington might be a matchup problem for Brady - same kind of front 7 as the Giants and Rams.

Not to mention that every game Brady has ever lost, has been against a Football Team. Seriously, you can look it up.

 

[Ring 6]

Give the full quote. It was 1 year guaranteed, not 2. Here’s Rapoports full quote. Please try to comprehend Donny.


The #Patriots and QB Tom Brady are in agreement on a 2-year deal worth $70M, source said, thru 2021. He gets $23M this year, then $30M and $32M in the following years — though both sides are amenable to adjusting it if the situations warrants. It’s essentially year-to-year.

— Ian Rapoport (@RapSheet) August 4, 2019

So? Do you think he was getting cut?
You are arguing that Brady left because he wanted a guaranteed year so he could be paid if he sustained a career ending injury. You seriously think he is hurting for money? And it’s a fact he did not negotiate with the patriots or allow them to match the offer.
He bolted.

 

[Ring 6]

True story.

Details of Lions Rob Gronkowski 2018 Trade Offer Revealed

Thankfully, Gronkowski declined to be traded to Detroit Lions

www.si.com

https://www.radio.com/971theticket/articles/news/two-years-after-spurning-lions-gronkowski-chooses-bucs

He was never trading him. It was leverage because gronk was being a goofball about whether he was coming back.

 

[Boomer B]

By the same token, after everything Bill has done for this franchise he has a right to run it his way and he deserves a pass for this year. He deserves our loyalty and trust ! He was directly responsible along with Brady and many other players and coaches to attain that level of success. You obviously think the success was only due to Brady, that is where we disagree. I will always love Brady for what he did , but it is time to move on and true fans will give Bill the benefit of the doubt. Go root for Tampa Boomer, since that is really what you want to do !

Not at all. I’m a Pats fan but I don’t have blinders on. It’s guys like you who drink Bill’s Kool Aid saying absurd things like “Brady and Gronk jumped ship” or “Its a draw if Brady doesn’t make it past the WC round”.

I was a Pats fan before Bill and will be one after Bill. He’s the best coach of his era but I’m not blind to see he made a mistake not giving Brady a guaranteed multi year deal. Brady deserved it and should have retired a Patriot.

 

[Boomer B]

So? Do you think he was getting cut?
You are arguing that Brady left because he wanted a guaranteed year so he could be paid if he sustained a career ending injury. You seriously think he is hurting for money? And it’s a fact he did not negotiate with the patriots or allow them to match the offer.
He bolted.

Are you serious? The Pats weren’t ever gonna pay him the $30m this year or $32m next year. They were dummy years for cap manoeuvring. They weren’t guaranteed. It’s really not hard to understand.

 

[Foxypats]

Not at all. I’m a Pats fan but I don’t have blinders on. It’s guys like you who drink Bill’s Kool Aid saying absurd things like “Brady and Gronk jumped ship” or “Its a draw if Brady doesn’t make it past the WC round”.

I was a Pats fan before Bill and will be one after Bill. He’s the best coach of his era but I’m not blind to see he made a mistake not giving Brady a guaranteed multi year deal. Brady deserved it and should have retired a Patriot.

I don't have blinders on, I just want to focus on what the Patriots will do next, not on the past. I rooted for the Patriots before Bill and Brady also, but it seems you have blinders on when it comes to Brady ! I stated this whole discussion by saying they were both equally important but now that we only have Bill left, we need to see what he does to get us back competing in the better conference IMO !

 

[SVN]

Every coach in this league needs a QB. a great coach makes it a dynasty. So to say arians can do the same thing with brady for 20 yrs is not true at all. BB maximized brady's potential by not spending a lot on him but making the team competivtive enough to get hits on the playoffs which resulted in multiple champiionships. Otherwise we wouldve been in Cap hell long ago. BB needed brady to execute his plan but the plan wasnt bad either. Maybe asked brady to do more perhaps. 2018 is a classic example.

 

[SVN]

guess lot of ron borges types have emerged. Here is the original himself

 

[Boomer B]

He was never trading him. It was leverage because gronk was being a goofball about whether he was coming back.

The article you linked basically says the opposite of what you wrote. From the article:


According to ESPN NFL insider Adam Schefter, the Lions had agreed to give up their first-and-second-round picks (No. 20 and No. 51 overall) in the '18 draft in return for the Patriots legend and a second-rounder (No. 43 overall).

The deal eventually fell through, as a result of Gronk vetoing it.

He had decided that the only quarterback he was going to catch passes from in his NFL career was Brady.

And that still rings true to this day.

So how did you get “He was never trading him. It was leverage because gronk was being a goofball about whether he was coming back.” from that article? The article basically states he was trading him but it got vetoed when Gronk threatened retirement.

 

[Boomer B]

I don't have blinders on, I just want to focus on what the Patriots will do next, not on the past. I rooted for the Patriots before Bill and Brady also, but it seems you have blinders on when it comes to Brady ! I stated this whole discussion by saying they were both equally important but now that we only have Bill left, we need to see what he does to get us back competing in the better conference IMO !

I’m with you about wanting to see how we rebuild. I just disagree on who was more important. I think the QB has more impact and I’m not saying that as disrespect to Bill. I think Bill is the best coach of his era and without both together we wouldn’t sniff 6 championships.

 

[Ring 6]

Are you serious? The Pats weren’t ever gonna pay him the $30m this year or $32m next year. They were dummy years for cap manoeuvring. They weren’t guaranteed. It’s really not hard to understand.

Of course he was getting that money. They have never taken a nickel away from him. The maneuvering would be moving salary to signing bonus. Obviously they wanted him back. He chose to leave.

 

[Ring 6]

The article you linked basically says the opposite of what you wrote. From the article:


According to ESPN NFL insider Adam Schefter, the Lions had agreed to give up their first-and-second-round picks (No. 20 and No. 51 overall) in the '18 draft in return for the Patriots legend and a second-rounder (No. 43 overall).

The deal eventually fell through, as a result of Gronk vetoing it.

He had decided that the only quarterback he was going to catch passes from in his NFL career was Brady.

And that still rings true to this day.

So how did you get “He was never trading him. It was leverage because gronk was being a goofball about whether he was coming back.” from that article? The article basically states he was trading him but it got vetoed when Gronk threatened retirement.

Again they were never trading him. They knew he wouldn’t go to Detroit. The phony trade was only to get him to stop dlcking around. It was blatantly obvious.

 

[Boomer B]

Of course he was getting that money. They have never taken a nickel away from him. The maneuvering would be moving salary to signing bonus. Obviously they wanted him back. He chose to leave.

You really have no clue.

So Bill didn’t give him the non guaranteed years in the previous 2 deals (made him renegotiate in both 2018 and 2019) but all of a sudden was gonna pay him the 2020 and 2021 non-guaranteed years, at $30m and $32m? No point in discussing anything with you if you actually believe that.

 

[crawhammer]

If Brady gets trounced the 1st round of the playoffs, then he hasn't accomplished much without Bill either. That would be what he did in NE last year, and that wasn't good enough. If Brady doesn't make it pass the WC, then he will consider the year a failure as we consider this year a failure for the Pats. In that case, it is a draw, they both failed without each other !

Brady's season is already a success just as Belichick's is already a failure.

The Patroits are completely irrelevant for the first time in two decades (since 2000). Awful season for Belichick. And if they lay an egg on MNF after what Brady did yesterday, it's only going to get worse.

Brady has been on a tear since the bye. He finally has a full compliment of healthy receivers, Gronk has rediscovered his groove, and Brady's built a solid connection with Brate. When Jones gets back, they will be even more formidable as he makes the pass-action more effective. Don't forget too, Brown arrived midway through the season so there was a significant adjustment there. If the OL holds up and gives Brady adequate protection, their offense is going to be a very difficult matchup for any defense.

The Bucs' defensive front seven is very good, extremely versatile and disruptive. Their secondary and pass coverage is a bit shaky.

That the Bucs will likely be on the road throughout the postseason is not going to be an issue. Firstly, no opposing crowd noise to deal with. Secondly, Brady has been phenomenal in away games (TD / INT ratio of 21 to 2). Their wildcard matchup will be against the NFC East "champ" so in other words, a win. From there we'll see depending on the matchup. I think the Bucs can beat anybody though, there's no opponent where I would say they're doomed. Rodgers and Brees have both had their problems in the postseason. And Brees looks like he's operating on fumes right now; he's practically reduced to only check downs. Seattle is a favorable matchup for the Bucs since they're run first and Brady will light up that secondary.

It would not surprise me if the Bucs are facing KC in the Super Bowl (I'll say 40% chance of it). KC is going to obliterate the AFC.

 

[Tony2046]

This is a stupid debate ! Neither of them is more important than the other. Together they won 6 SB's. Without Bill, Brady would never have won those many, he might not have even got a starting position in the NFL. considering every team passed on him for 6 rounds ! Without Brady, Bill would have not won 6 SB's, I still think he would have won about 2 but that's it.
If Brady gets trounced the 1st round of the playoffs, then he hasn't accomplished much without Bill either. That would be what he did in NE last year, and that wasn't good enough. If Brady doesn't make it pass the WC, then he will consider the year a failure as we consider this year a failure for the Pats. In that case, it is a draw, they both failed without each other !
As of now, I am interesting in seeing this team's re build and excited about what the future might hold. I am not concerned about what Tampa does. Both Brady and Gronk jumped ship, why are some fans so obsessed with what they are doing ? The fans who want to blame Bill for everything may as well start rooting for another team, they don't have an allegiance to the Patriots at all, they were more Brady fans then fans of the team . My focus is on seeing the Pats build a team that can compete again for the AFC East crown and the AFC in general .

I agree for the most part but I will always root for Brady unless it's versus the Patriots. So I'll respectfully disagree on that part.

I know BB will have this team back in contention in a couple of years or so. He did it with the Browns, he did here and he'll do it here again.

 

[patfanken]

guess lot of ron borges types have emerged. Here is the original himself

After years of making a fool of himself covering any sport outside of boxing, a bitter old Ron Borges FINALLY gets his "revenge" on BB after 20 years. That's a REALLY long time to carry a grudge. Only shows just how twisted Borges always was.

 

[Ring 6]

You really have no clue.

So Bill didn’t give him the non guaranteed years in the previous 2 deals (made him renegotiate in both 2018 and 2019) but all of a sudden was gonna pay him the 2020 and 2021 non-guaranteed years, at $30m and $32m? No point in discussing anything with you if you actually believe that.

What do you think he was going to do cut him?

 

[Boomer B]

What do you think he was going to do cut him?

No point in discussing this with you. You clearly don’t understand how NFL contracts work. It’s up to the Pats to guarantee that 2nd year. They didn’t.

 

[Ring 6]

No point in discussing this with you. You clearly don’t understand how NFL contracts work. It’s up to the Pats to guarantee that 2nd year. They didn’t.

So your argument is that Brady left because he wanted to make sure he would get paid an extra year if he had a season ending injury. Gotcha. Yes there is no point discussing with me because you’re opinion is inane.

 

[Tony2046]

So your argument is that Brady left because he wanted to make sure he would get paid an extra year if he had a season ending injury. Gotcha. Yes there is no point discussing with me because you’re opinion is inane.

What?? His point makes perfect sense. What are you doing?