The NFL Hall of Fame has decided to subvert... the NFL Hall of Fame

[Betterthanmost]

The voters aren't getting to vote. Not only that, the slate is an all-or-nothing slate. The entire election process is being subverted, in order to make sure that these specific nominees get into the Hall.

It has a Hunger games theme to it. Let the games begin.

 

[Doctor DDS]

Until I see who ultimately gets in I will reserve judgement but the selections have always been questionable to me. I still cannot believe that Swann and Stallworth somehow made the HOF over Cliff Branch and Stanley Morgan and there have been numerous other recent selections that I have disagreed with (Stabler, Warner, T, Davis to name a few), While they were great players at their peak their complete bodies of work fall short in my eyes. When the defensive minded Steelers of the 70's have 5 HOFers on offense and the Patriots of the past 18 years seem destined to only have 2 offensive players inducted (Gronk and Brady) I am not sure a change was not needed.

 

[TomPatriot]

Heaven forbid anyone should take football seriously on a football forum.

Feel free to make the argument the the Hall of Fame itself is unimportant, I think there's a very solid case for that. IMO either the HOF itself is a joke, or this move is dead wrong. It has to be one or the other. (And trying to just dismiss people you disagree with ad hominem as "triggered" or "snowflakes" makes for mighty boring discussion.)

Ouch! That whip! Make it stop! Isn’t “Jets” the safe word?

 

[Nikolai]

The Hall of Fame lost its way years ago, when it went from being the Hall of Fame to Hall of Dudes Who Put Up Good Stats.

 

[Deus Irae]

I still cannot believe that Swann and Stallworth somehow made the HOF over Cliff Branch and Stanley Morgan

You're kidding, right? I mean, I love Morgan, but the reason for Swann/Stallworth over Morgan is obvious.

 

[Doctor DDS]

You're right as always Deus. Swan's 5500 yards are undeniably better than Morgan's 10,700 yards. Branch was a 3x 1st team All Pro and had more yards and catches as well. Swann is in the HOF because he played on the Steelers and had a few great catches and playoff games. If he is in then Edleman absolutely should be in and I doubt he will be.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

You're right as always Deus. Swan's 5500 yards are undeniably better than Morgan's 10,700 yards. Branch was a 3x 1st team All Pro and had more yards and catches as well. Swann is in the HOF because he played on the Steelers and had a few great catches and playoff games. If he is in then Edleman absolutely should be in and I doubt he will be.

None of those guys should be in imo. Swann got in bc of SBX & what his team was able to do.

He's one of the biggest reasons the HOF is a joke.

LOL Lynn Swann got in but guys 100% better like Calvin Johnson, Cris Carter & TO should wait their turn for w/e absurd reason the writers come up w.

All anyone has to do is look at some of his peers w comparable #'s.
Does anyone think Ray Renfro or Jerry Smith should get in lol?

 

[Deus Irae]

You're right as always Deus. Swan's 5500 yards are undeniably better than Morgan's 10,700 yards. Branch was a 3x 1st team All Pro and had more yards and catches as well. Swann is in the HOF because he played on the Steelers and had a few great catches and playoff games. If he is in then Edleman absolutely should be in and I doubt he will be.

I didn't say the numbers were better. I said the reason they're in is obvious. The fact that you were able to figure out the reason so easily should have made you aware enough that you didn't need your first three sentences.

And you can't put Edelman in ahead of Welker, because Welker was a better receiver from the same team. This is a problem with having such an open ended voting system, just as petty grudges preventing entrance is a problem with it. But neither of those problems is solved by completely subverting the process for the purposes of what is, essentially, a year long PR campaign built around "100 years!".

 

[Doctor DDS]

I fully understand the reasons why Swann and Stallworth got in - that is the issue I have. They were swept in due to the greatness of the 70's Steelers dynasty yet it does not appear that will apply with the Patriots much more impressive dynasty. That is my issue - I don't think any of those 4 should be in the HOF but since a couple of them already are I am not as outraged about the voting changes as I think the prior system was already incredibly flawed.

I prefer only truly great players to make it. Do not like seeing players get in due to a great playoff run or being part of a great team.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

I didn't say the numbers were better. I said the reason they're in is obvious. The fact that you were able to figure out the reason so easily should have made you aware enough that you didn't need your first three sentences.

And you can't put Edelman in ahead of Welker, because Welker was a better receiver from the same team. This is a problem with having such an open ended voting system, just as petty grudges preventing entrance is a problem with it. But neither of those problems is solved by completely subverting the process for the purposes of what is, essentially, a year long PR campaign built around "100 years!".

Again Im not saying this is the right idea but the HOF/Process has been a joke forever.

You allude to in your first two sentences. If something has been a joke, out of touch w reality for decades this panel isn't doing anymore damage.

Again the whole process is a joke. From the writers to the cookie cutter requirements of only allowing a certain # to get in. Some years you might not have any players or very few. Some years you might have more then the spots afforded. That alone makes it very tough to take seriously.

 

[Deus Irae]

Again Im not saying this is the right idea but the HOF/Process has been a joke forever.

You allude to in your first two sentences. If something has been a joke, out of touch w reality for decades this panel isn't doing anymore damage.

Again the whole process is a joke. From the writers to the cookie cutter requirements of only allowing a certain # to get in. Some years you might not have any players or very few. Some years you might have more then the spots afforded. That alone makes it very tough to take seriously.

Yes, the panel is doing more damage. Our current U.S. voting system is a joke. That doesn't mean we should choose a small panel, selected by the current powers that be, to have all the decision making authority.

And only allowing a certain number of players to get in each year is an excellent idea. It's too bad all the sports don't do that, with a very tiny number. The HOFs are already too bloated.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Yes, the panel is doing more damage. Our current U.S. voting system is a joke. That doesn't mean we should choose a small panel, selected by the current powers that be, to have all the decision making authority.

And only allowing a certain number of players to get in each year is an excellent idea. It's too bad all the sports don't do that, with a very tiny number. The HOFs are already too bloated.

You'd be naive to think we wouldn't get the same ****ty results. Or just make it one person/one vote instead of something terrible? Neither here nor there since its a foolish example. We're not going to nuclear war if we send the wrong guy to the HOF.

As for the 2nd part it's absolutely insane to have a certain amount every year lol. Its Sesame St & you're making my point for me.

The HOF is supposed to abt the absolute best of the best. Some years you're NOT going to have 5 guys or w/e but every year we know we're getting players in.

Its also a putrid excuse to make guys wait. I'm no fan of TO but he's a walk in HOF WR. You literally can't name 10 better from a statistical standpoint or someone who impacted the game on game day even if he didnt put up #'s in the stat sheet.

That rule alone is enough for many, not just myself to question the process. And its not just a few guys. It's a ton that goes back decades.
There is no magical # that should be in every year.

 

[woolster22]

Sal Palaontonio gets a seat at the table? John Clayton?

That wouldn't be an attempt to sway the coverage from "the world wide leader in sports," could it?

Why NFL Leadership is Clueless, 2019 issue 4,957.

 

[shmessy]

The committee members:

“The blue-ribbon panel consists of Ernie Accorsi, Bill Belichick, Jarrett Bell, Joel Bussert, John Clayton, Frank Cooney, John Czarnecki, Rick Gosselin, Elliott Harrison (an employee of the league, which usually is forbidden for Hall of Fame selection purposes), Joe Horrigan, Ira Kaufman, **** LeBeau, Jeff Legwold, John Madden, John McClain, Gary Myers, Ozzie Newsome, Sal Paolantonio, Carl Peterson, Bill Polian, Dan Pompei, Charean Williams, Chris Willis, Barry Wilner, and Ron Wolf.”

Wait!!! No Ben Volin?????????????????????

.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

BB looking at the 1st clown to speak in Modell's favor...

Gino Cappelletti?
Stanley Morgan?
Alex Karras?
Tommy Nobis?

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Wait!!! No Ben Volin?????????????????????

.

My eyes are playing tricks on me.

I thought I saw Bill Polian's name there. LOL


So Madden has to nominate Ben Dreith, right?

I mean, he kind of has to.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Swann, Chris Hanburger, Fred Dean, Bob Griese, Dan Hampton... I could list another 20 off the top of my head w/out google but please go look these guys on pro football reference. All very good players but some weren't even the best at their position on their own team.

Griese handed the ball off to a bunch of good RBs, behind a good OL & the no name defense.

Again vg players but not even close to elite, best of the best. Tons of guys get in simply bc we have to select players.

And it's not like their having Rob Parker, Skip, Felger & Mazz decide who gets in. Some of the guys on that panel are as good as it gets in terms of football knowledge.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Swann, Chris Hanburger, Fred Dean, Bob Griese, Dan Hampton... I could list another 20 off the top of my head w/out google but please go look these guys on pro football reference. All very good players but some weren't even the best at their position on their own team.

Terrell Davis. Who?

Floyd Little, okay. I mean, I know Otis Armstrong better. Sammy Winder?

Griese handed the ball off to a bunch of good RBs, behind a good OL & the no name defense.

Again vg players but not even close to elite, best of the best.

Thank you. Griese? Give me a break.

Tons of guys get in simply bc we have to select players.

No, they get in because the voters are stupid, while worthy & deserving athletes are ignored forever.

Some of the guys on that panel are as good as it gets in terms of football knowledge.

Obviously not a majority, though.