Passing Game - Dorsett and Hogan

[mosslost]

I feel like I’m having a conversation with myself “Gollum style” from Lord of the Rings, but yeah—run that sh!t and throw when you can’t run.

if we score and score and score, and then run, we can win these games or no?

 

[Ring 6]

NE wins game by a landslide
TB passes for 400+ yards/ 4TDs, 0INTs
NE rushes for 150+ yards
ST dominates

...but BB isn’t wearing a sleeveless hoodie this week?!?!?

Some posters here:
“IDK...Something’s just OFF with this team...”

It was almost a one score game at halftime.

 

[Ring 6]

Hogan did a nice job blocking on the 40 running plays he was in for.

 

[maineman209]

Sure, but that becomes much more of a challenge with teams who can stop the run like Baltimore, Tennessee, etc.

TEN has been middle of the pack in run-D. They stopped the Pats ground game in wk-10 when Mason was out, Gronk was out, Allen left with a knee injury after Q3, Michel was in his first game back from his (2nd) knee injury.

The Ravens have a legit top-4 run-D, though, as well as a top-4 pass-D. Their offense is just good enough that they aren't likely to be an easy out for anybody.

 

[TinhWoodhead]

I hope we play teams who have bad defenses and bad offenses. Crossing my fingers for a postseason visit from Foxborough High.

Lets hope they play themselves

 

[Ring 6]

By this logic if Brady had thrown for 400+ yards to eight different receivers, then we should have a thread lamenting the run game being substandard, dooming the team in January.

The Patriots just rushed for 273 yards, 5.8 yards per carry.

My question is why they bothered to pass the ball 25 times?

There was no need to throw the ball downfield; therefore no need for Dorsett or Hogan.

279, 358, 311, 283, 254, 294, 324, 277, 340,341

Those are Tom Brady’s passing yards on his last 10 games prior to yesterday.
For the record it adds up to 3061 which would extrapolate to 4897 over a 16 game schedule but OMGZZZZZZ we cant pass the ball.
This fan base doesn’t deserve this team.

 

[supafly]

Not sure they enjoy it but are accustomed to an experience and they take it for granted

It's like heat, electricity or high speed internet. When it isn't instantaneous or performing normally 99.999%, people *****.

IOW- they are entitled, spoiled babies who have no clue how hard winning football games is let alone winning at the absurd clip this team has over the last 18 years

Yeah, except it became an actual issue when Gordon left the team this week and we were down to seeds and stems at the position. It was pretty obvious that the passing game failed miserably, that really shouldn’t be up for debate. Brady was visibly pissed the entire day. Out of 25 pass attempts, the only players who played a TE/WR position who caught an actual football ball were Edelman and Patterson’s one catch for three yards.

Pretending that they didn’t even try to pass or whatever you’re doing seems faulty. That aspect of our game has been suspect for a little while now, and recently produced 10 points last week. There were questions about how they’d move forward without Gordon and the initial results were not pretty. No one should be considered a “baby” for pointing that out, especially if they’re having a reasonable, level-headed discussion.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Yeah, except it became an actual issue when Gordon left the team this week and we were down to seeds and stems at the position. It was pretty obvious that the passing game failed miserably, that really shouldn’t be up for debate. Brady was visibly pissed the entire day. Out of 25 pass attempts, the only players who played a TE/WR position who caught an actual football ball were Edelman and Patterson’s one catch for three yards.

Pretending that they didn’t even try to pass or whatever you’re doing seems faulty. That aspect of our game has been suspect for a little while now, and recently produced 10 points last week. There were questions about how they’d move forward without Gordon and the initial results were not pretty. No one should be considered a “baby” for pointing that out, especially if they’re having a reasonable, level-headed discussion.

My theory is with yesterday, Bill and Josh protected Gronk, White and Tom. Buffalo has an outstanding pass D and they felt they could get by with the running game and D vs the pathetic BUF O.

I expect the same vs the NYJ next week.

I do think Tom is dealing with something and hopefully the bye does the trick. Same for the other walking wounded.

 

[Wax Frog]

I hope we play teams who have bad defenses and bad offenses. Crossing my fingers for a postseason visit from Foxborough High.

I dunno, that Johnny kid looks like the real deal

 

[supafly]

Hogan: 66% catch rate .. 16.1 ypc .. 3 TDs
Patterson: 77% catch rate .. 12.2 ypc .. 3 TDs
Dorsett: 84% catch rate .. 9.5 ypc .. 2 TDs

Collectively: 76/102 .. 968 yards .. 8 TDs

"Incapable"? Or simply not being used? Honestly, those three may comprise the most productive "2nd-tier target group" the Pats have had in a while.

"First tier" target group:
- White: 71% catch rate .. 699 yards .. 8.6 ypc .. 6 TDs*
- Edelman: 69% catch rate .. 711 yards .. 11.3 ypc .. 4 TDs
- Gronk: 67% catch rate .. 658 yards .. 14.6 ypc .. 3 TDs
- Gordon: 59% catch rate .. 720 yards .. 18.0 ypc .. 3 TDs

*(stats don't include the Bills game yet)

I don’t know if you can necessarily look at it that way, though. For instance, we already know that Hogan has trouble getting separation even with a stronger cast around him, let alone without one. I’m not sure that he’s going to be able to beat his man quickly and often enough for Brady to look his way.

Patterson is a great gadget guy, but are defenses really going to respect him enough as a WR to dedicate resources so that our other guys are freed up? Is he truly going to have a breakout game where he catches 5-6 balls for 75 yards or something? It’s probably not likely. In terms of WR production, he’s a JAG. They’ll have to get creative with him and Dorsett. This will be Josh McDaniels’ biggest challenge in awhile.

Dorsett is something of an issue because Tom and staff obviously don’t trust him very much or he’d be seeing more reps and more targets. He’ll get more looks now since there aren’t really any other options, but Philip Dorsett hasn’t really proven himself to be very reliable, at least thus far—catch percentage be damned.

Gronkowski is certainly a concern because he has little burst, isn’t getting any separation, isn’t lining up outside to draw favorable matchups, and looks like a totally different player this year. His blocking looks fine, but we are discussing Brady’s receiving options.

They haven’t been using White as often as they could be, although I’m assuming that will change in the coming weeks out of pure necessity. The bottom line is that this isn’t a promising group of receiving options, and we’ve been seeing issues lately. How they can adapt moving forward without Gordon will likely determine our postseason fate. Running the ball is our best bet, and it’s good to see that going, but they’ve got lots of work to do in the air.

 

[Deus Irae]

Yeah, except it became an actual issue when Gordon left the team this week and we were down to seeds and stems at the position. It was pretty obvious that the passing game failed miserably, that really shouldn’t be up for debate. Brady was visibly pissed the entire day. Out of 25 pass attempts, the only players who played a TE/WR position who caught an actual football ball were Edelman and Patterson’s one catch for three yards.

Pretending that they didn’t even try to pass or whatever you’re doing seems faulty. That aspect of our game has been suspect for a little while now, and recently produced 10 points last week. There were questions about how they’d move forward without Gordon and the initial results were not pretty. No one should be considered a “baby” for pointing that out, especially if they’re having a reasonable, level-headed discussion.

They had lost a key WR after they would already have had their game plan made and given to the players, so they'd have been working on a hastily re-done plan. They had 2 INTs that receivers screwed up on, and the run game was killing the Bills. It actually makes sense for the team to have decided that passing . In the previous 7 weeks, the passing game had produced

311
310
244
283
311
344
272

yards. So, while the passing game hasn't been quite what people thought it might be with the Edelman/Gordon/Gronk trio, it was still putting up some pretty good numbers.

 

[Deus Irae]

Dorsett is something of an issue because Tom and staff obviously don’t trust him very much or he’d be seeing more reps and more targets. He’ll get more looks now since there aren’t really any other options, but Philip Dorsett hasn’t really proven himself to be very reliable, at least thus far—catch percentage be damned.

We don't know that, because there's been no real explanation as to the way the Patriots (and Brady) have used Dorsett. We can speculate (not getting open? Bad routes? Pissed off Brady?), but that's what we're stuck with right now.

I would love for one of the beat writers to actually do his job and get us the 411 on what's been going on with this.

 

[Chevy]

Fact - this years Patriots are flawed. There is no denying it, there's no avoiding it.

Guess what? So is every other team out there, some more than others. And at the end of the day, I'll take the brain-trust that is BB and Ernie Adams and their ability to identify and exploit those flaws while managing their own.

 

[Coolade2]

Question is if team shows A. dominant run game in a win, or shows B. dominant passing game in a win.... Which gives fans or analysts more confidence going forward..???

IMO , It should be A. since it is easier to create success passing after solid run game, plus pass happy offense is more taxing on a team and qb... So last week they get a break.

 

[Bruins29]

This fan base doesn’t deserve this team.

This fan base dosent deserve (nor should have for that matter) access to the internet.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Question is if team shows A. dominant run game in a win, or shows B. dominant passing game in a win.... Which gives fans or analysts more confidence going forward..???

IMO , It should be A. since it is easier to create success passing after solid run game, plus pass happy offense is more taxing on a team and qb... So last week they get a break.

For me personally, I will always take the running game 7 days a week and twice on Sunday.

I think what was bothersome was the passing offense was a bit erratic. It doesn't need to be prolific, but effective.

 

[RobertWeathers]

This fan base dosent deserve (nor should have for that matter) access to the internet.

Give them dial up and a Hayes compatible modem. That way if they really love the team they'll willing to wait 2 minutes to respond to a post and give them time to be thoughtful.

 

[maineman209]

I don’t know if you can necessarily look at it that way, though. For instance, we already know that Hogan has trouble getting separation even with a stronger cast around him, let alone without one. I’m not sure that he’s going to be able to beat his man quickly and often enough for Brady to look his way.

Patterson is a great gadget guy, but are defenses really going to respect him enough as a WR to dedicate resources so that our other guys are freed up? Is he truly going to have a breakout game where he catches 5-6 balls for 75 yards or something? It’s probably not likely. In terms of WR production, he’s a JAG. They’ll have to get creative with him and Dorsett. This will be Josh McDaniels’ biggest challenge in awhile.

Dorsett is something of an issue because Tom and staff obviously don’t trust him very much or he’d be seeing more reps and more targets. He’ll get more looks now since there aren’t really any other options, but Philip Dorsett hasn’t really proven himself to be very reliable, at least thus far—catch percentage be damned.

Gronkowski is certainly a concern because he has little burst, isn’t getting any separation, isn’t lining up outside to draw favorable matchups, and looks like a totally different player this year. His blocking looks fine, but we are discussing Brady’s receiving options.

They haven’t been using White as often as they could be, although I’m assuming that will change in the coming weeks out of pure necessity. The bottom line is that this isn’t a promising group of receiving options, and we’ve been seeing issues lately. How they can adapt moving forward without Gordon will likely determine our postseason fate. Running the ball is our best bet, and it’s good to see that going, but they’ve got lots of work to do in the air.

I really don't know what to tell ya.

I've seen Hogan, Dorsett and Patterson get open in a timely fashion without being thrown to. It's not as if they're being continually shutdown by opposing defenders. When they are thrown to, apparently they've been catching the ball a decent percentage of the time.

While I agree that Gronk hasn't looked good at all recently, he looked "normal" to me earlier in the season, before he got hurt.

I don't rely exclusively on stats to judge performance, but neither do I rely exclusively on my "eyeball test". I don't reject either one. When they're at odds, I generally hypothesize that maybe things aren't quite as bad as they look to me, so I start watching more closely.

 

[Bruins29]

Give them dial up and a Hayes compatible modem. That way if they really love the team they'll willing to wait 2 minutes to respond to a post and give them time to be thoughtful.

Agreed but you are combining two things that dont go together.

Misrable idiots on this forum - and - Thoughts.

If they had maybe "thought" once in their life, they wouldn't be the miserable idiots that they are. Add to the fact that they are gutless ****ies, and you see the problem very clearly.

 

[scout]

I don’t know that he threw over 10 yards, let alone 20.

Rope a dope?