VectorPrime
Pro Bowl Player
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CLICK HERE to Register for a free account and login for a smoother ad-free experience. It's easy, and only takes a few moments.People were accusing LeBron of this years ago. Stars matter but it's a team game, and the West remains magnitudes better than the East.
Im not doubting Fultz as a surpreme basketball talent, i'm just always hesitant when theres a lack of winning pedigree with a player. It's the same reason I wanted nothing to do with Kevin Love during all the years people were hoping we would trade for him.
There have been lots of talented players in college and in the NBA that have all the tools to be great, but for some reason dont produce results. There is elite alpha talent (Lebron, Kawhi, Westbrook, IT) and elite beta talent (Harden, Irving, AD, Cousins). My biggest fear with Fultz is he's the latter, whereas I think Ball could possible be an alpha but his off court distractions are potentially too much
Theres no way of knowing for sure until these guys get 3-5 years in to their NBA careers and thats what makes it a fascinating decision coming up.
Both, I still don't understand why Deron wanted that. I really like Crash when he was good but...that was nuts. I doubt they take Lilliard but ****. They should have been given assets to take on Joe Johnson's (who is a legit good player, but that money was nuts) inflated contract not giving anything up...Oh, I thought you were referring to the trade that brought Wallace to the Nets, rather than Wallace going to the Celtics with Humphries, some cap dumps, and the picks for KG, Pierce, and Terry. Yeah, it was way too much to give up and everyone knew it at the time. Then again, there was a feeling that the Nets would stick around as a 4-6 seed in the East for longer than they did so maybe the draft picks would be in the 20s rather than high lottery, and the pick swap may not have made a difference. I mean, that was the optimist of optimist's view. The rest of us thought it was utterly nuts.
He was also in a conference with Oregon, UCLA, Arizona, Utah and a very young and talented USC team.trade the pick! The baggage with Ball is too much and Fultz won like 9 total games against garbage teams last year which i think is an extremely underrated red flag. Not to mention all we do is draft guards and we need to get bigger
I say trade for a legit rim protector, sign hayward and try to keep bradley, call it an offseason
Oh yeah things can change, Lebron wasn't an alpha until he was. Sometimes stars progress and sometimes they dont
I dont think that was when he became an alpha, i think it was when he went back to Cleveland and had one of the greatest finals performances of all time despite no Kyrie or Love. And then the following year when he dethroned the mighty 73-9 warriors on the road in another historic finals performance as the underdogs. And of course his insane performance in these playoffs as wellCertainly helped that he had Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh instead of Zydrunas Ilgauskas and Delonte West as his supporting cast when he made that 'progression.'
You seem to know a lot more about Fultz than me as I admittedly have very little interest in college basketball, and I usually go by gut when researching prospects come draft time, as I do with football as well. For the sake of the Celtics frachise I hope you are right that Fultz is a no brainer should they pick him. Like I said I dont doubt his natural basketball talent one bit, I just hope that a guy that didnt win in college can then become a consumant winner in the pros after the current talent that will be supporting him early (IT, Horford, possible FA signing) is gone and the franchise is left in his hands.
Both, I still don't understand why Deron wanted that. I really like Crash when he was good but...that was nuts. I doubt they take Lilliard but ****. They should have been given assets to take on Joe Johnson's (who is a legit good player, but that money was nuts) inflated contract not giving anything up...
What happened to Deron anyways? Why did he fall apart so quickly? He was fun to watch back when he was still good. Been a solid piece for Cleveland.
Who does fultz compare to?
I'd rather have the guy who will actually be able to shoot without having his shot put back in his face.I think it's personal preference. Would you rather have Jason Kidd or Russell Westbrook. I take Kidd
What do you make of the Fultz / Westbrook comparison? Better shooter, less athletic (obviously)?I've said it a few times, but I will say it again (unless someone wants to disagree with me -- I am a huge NBA and college hoops fan, but certainly no expert): James Harden or pre-injury Brandon Roy.
That's great and all, and possibly even true. I dispute, however, that you can possibly read the mind of an 18 year kid and come to a definitive conclusion about it. He hasn't been tested enough to prove it one way or the other. His one year in a ****ty program run by a ****ty staff prove nothing other than he can excel under trying circumstances.Its not about the natural talents as ive tried to explain in other posts, its about the thing in your heart, that dog in your mind that drives you to succeed past even the longest odds. IT has that dog in him, Harden and guys like lowry dont. Thats what i meant, i guess it wasnt as clear as it seemed in my head
The celtics do not have an overly talented roster, hes at an incredible disadvantage size wise, and despite everything IT has dealt with in this last month he's still carried this team to a top seed and the ECF. Thats as alpha as it gets IMO
Meanwhile you have guys lke John Wall that are more gifted and talented physically going 0-11 down the stretch of a do or die game or James Harden just completely unravelling altogether at home against a super short handed team and getting blown out, that aint alpha
You consider Butler to be both young and a big? Curious.Another guard? It seems with the exception of last year Ainge has picked guards almost exclusively. This team needs a power forward from what ive seen. Trade the overall number one for a young big man like butler.
That's great and all, and possibly even true. I dispute, however, that you can possibly read the mind of an 18 year kid and come to a definitive conclusion about it. He hasn't been tested enough to prove it one way or the other. His one year in a ****ty program run by a ****ty staff prove nothing other than he can excel under trying circumstances.
this is kind of how i feel as well. I dont know how they would do it because i dont necessarily think he's worth the top overall pick, but id love to see them go after andre drummond and move horford to power forward.Another guard? It seems with the exception of last year Ainge has picked guards almost exclusively. This team needs a power forward from what ive seen. Trade the overall number one for a young big man like butler.
What do you make of the Fultz / Westbrook comparison? Better shooter, less athletic (obviously)?
Another guard? It seems with the exception of last year Ainge has picked guards almost exclusively. This team needs a power forward from what ive seen. Trade the overall number one for a young big man like butler.
Andre '30 percent FT shooter' Drummond? Thanks but no thanks.this is kind of how i feel as well. I dont know how they would do it because i dont necessarily think he's worth the top overall pick, but id love to see them go after andre drummond and move horford to power forward.
We need an elite rim protector and more size on this team, and drummond would provide both. I just dont know how you aquire him without using the top pick and/or multiple other valuable assets, unless you can get something else in return as well