Game Day Thread Official Post Game Thread- Bucs beat the Pats

[catent]

To my eye it appears Sherman extends his arms and gets two hands on Henry's shoulders before Henry initiates any contact.

 

[catent]

Sherman definitely initiated that contact. Not OPI, IMO.

If Sherman had attempted to go underneath Henry (ala Butler against the Seahawks), and Henry had extended his arms to grab him, absolutely OPI. But in this case Sherman initiated the contact and didn't attempt to go underneath. After getting his hands on Henry, he didn't slow him down or disrupt him, instead he got worked downfield and effectively took himself out of the play, at which point he threw his hands up asking for an OPI.

David made a massive play to win them that game. Such a good LB.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Sherman definitely initiated that contact. Not OPI, IMO.

If Sherman had attempted to go underneath Henry (ala Butler against the Seahawks), and Henry had extended his arms to grab him, absolutely OPI. But in this case Sherman initiated the contact and didn't attempt to go underneath. After getting his hands on Henry, he didn't slow him down or disrupt him, instead he got worked downfield and effectively took himself out of the play, at which point he threw his hands up asking for an OPI.

David made a massive play to win them that game. Such a good LB.

The reason Sherman is now separated from Meyers is Meyers initially cut right before, and after Henry blocked Sherman, he cut back towards the middle of the field. There’s no way this isn’t a designed screen. There’s no way it’s incidental contact.

As @Fuzz states, it’s a rub route or a pick. And yes, running rub routes and picks are often judgment calls and they are common plays. By rule you can’t set a pick beyond 1 yard of the LOS. Sherman holds his position as the Bucs can see the pick coming. Henry, though, runs out to Sherman, well off the LOS to set the pick. It’s the same missed call as in the 2018 AFCCG against the Chiefs that we were pissed about. If Henry had kind of lifted his arms after contact to make it appear as though it was incidental, it might be a 50/50 call, but he drives Sherman backwards another seven yards.

But if we agree to disagree, that‘s fine.

 

[Joker]

 

[catent]

The reason Sherman is now separated from Meyers is Meyers initially cut right before, and after Henry blocked Sherman, he cut back towards the middle of the field. There’s no way this isn’t a designed screen. There’s no way it’s incidental contact.

As @Fuzz states, it’s a rub route or a pick. And yes, running rub routes and picks are often judgment calls and they are common plays. By rule you can’t set a pick beyond 1 yard of the LOS. Sherman holds his position as the Bucs can see the pick coming. Henry, though, runs out to Sherman, well off the LOS to set the pick. It’s the same missed call as in the 2018 AFCCG against the Chiefs that we were pissed about. If Henry had kind of lifted his arms after contact to make it appear as though it was incidental, it might be a 50/50 call, but he drives Sherman backwards another seven yards.

But if we agree to disagree, that‘s fine.

View attachment 36294

From what I saw Sherman extended his arms and got his hands on Henry before Henry began to lift his arms. Sherman initiated the contact.

I watched an almost identical play from earlier in the game an I'm not entirely convinced that Sherman was actually responsible for Meyers based on how they defended this earlier in the game. From the exact same look (6-man rush, man coverage) with the Pats in a similar formation and route concept (Henry on the LOS, Meyers stacked behind him breaking inside), the Bucs had the defender nearest the LOS engage and carry Henry (the receiver on the LOS), and the DB down the field sat on Meyers break.

Sherman has no choice but to bump Henry - if he gives him a free release and bails on him to jump Meyers, they'd just hit Henry in the flat. He basically has to carry him (which is why Sherman initiated contact first), which makes this play-call so darn good against this defense. It doesn't look like a designed screen to me, but rather a slot option that probably has a built-in hot against a 6-man blitz like this. I suspect Meyers can break either way on this play, and since Sherman gets outside leverage when he engages Henry, Meyers breaks inside. If the defense sat in zone, Henry carries up the seam and the ball may go to him.

Who knows, I could be wrong, but that's my read on the play.

 

[catent]

Watching the highlights, and my god was this a monumentally stupid play by Van Noy. The 3rd down & 6 early in the 4th quarter that Brady scrambled for ... Van Noy was in perfect position to tackle Brady about 3-5 yards short of the line to gain, had a good angle on him, and basically just had to wrap-up Brady and bring him to the ground, with Godchaux right there as well to finish the deal.

But no - instead of making the smart play, Van Noy lowers his shoulder and tries to light Brady up. Not only did he completely fail in his goal to deck Brady, but Van Noy's momentum then carried him into Godchaux as Godchaux was tackling Brady. If Van Noy doesn't knock Godchaux off his spot as he's making the tackle, Brady may end up a couple yards short.

I was happy when we brought Van Noy back but this crap (along with all that boogeymen garbage) will sour me on him quickly. These are the details that lose teams games.

And still, despite this really dumb play, it actually looked like Brady was short of the line to gain. This is something I'd hope the coaches catch in the future. The Bucs likely would've gone for it and converted, but you gotta think they would've won the challenge and made the Bucs earn it on 4th down.

 

[Reubski23]

Brady suggested that he didn’t really enjoy beating the Pats in his podcast with Jim Gray this week:

Tom Brady likes beating the Giants the most, the Patriots the least

Now that Tom Brady has beaten every NFL team, the latest edition of the Let's [Expletive Deleted] Go!

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

very clear that Brady just wanted to get out of that game with a win. He wanted to throw a TD at the end that was clear but he just wanted to win in any shape or form it came. I thought it was going to be FG game - BB can still scheme up like anything - he still is the greatest coach ever; but even when he is just average - Brady nearly always does just enough and that’s why he is the GOAT.

definitely think this is a turning point of the season for us - I dont think Mac has an incredibly high ceiling like Herbert for instance - but I think MCD will start opening the playbook for him. We make playoffs IMO.

bucs will be interesting - the offense has been quietly slowed down the last two weeks - a very emotional week for Brady - but will be interesting to see if they can put their foot on the gas for the next few weeks with weaker opponents. And hopefully for them they start to get their secondary back

 

[SHOWTIME15]

He needed to hold them to 3 field goals.

ohhhh right…Bill sucks.

 

[amfootball]

Watching the highlights, and my god was this a monumentally stupid play by Van Noy. The 3rd down & 6 early in the 4th quarter that Brady scrambled for ... Van Noy was in perfect position to tackle Brady about 3-5 yards short of the line to gain, had a good angle on him, and basically just had to wrap-up Brady and bring him to the ground, with Godchaux right there as well to finish the deal.

But no - instead of making the smart play, Van Noy lowers his shoulder and tries to light Brady up. Not only did he completely fail in his goal to deck Brady, but Van Noy's momentum then carried him into Godchaux as Godchaux was tackling Brady. If Van Noy doesn't knock Godchaux off his spot as he's making the tackle, Brady may end up a couple yards short.

I was happy when we brought Van Noy back but this crap (along with all that boogeymen garbage) will sour me on him quickly. These are the details that lose teams games.

And still, despite this really dumb play, it actually looked like Brady was short of the line to gain. This is something I'd hope the coaches catch in the future. The Bucs likely would've gone for it and converted, but you gotta think they would've won the challenge and made the Bucs earn it on 4th down.

Great stuff. Thanks for posting. I didn't realize Van Noy did that as when they showed the replay, I was so focused on Brady, I did not even noticed what happened. I thought in real time Brady may have been short because he twisted backwards over the line. Not sure if it would have gotten reversed as it is close but you right, probably worth a challenge.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Watching the highlights, and my god was this a monumentally stupid play by Van Noy. The 3rd down & 6 early in the 4th quarter that Brady scrambled for ... Van Noy was in perfect position to tackle Brady about 3-5 yards short of the line to gain, had a good angle on him, and basically just had to wrap-up Brady and bring him to the ground, with Godchaux right there as well to finish the deal.

But no - instead of making the smart play, Van Noy lowers his shoulder and tries to light Brady up. Not only did he completely fail in his goal to deck Brady, but Van Noy's momentum then carried him into Godchaux as Godchaux was tackling Brady. If Van Noy doesn't knock Godchaux off his spot as he's making the tackle, Brady may end up a couple yards short.

I was happy when we brought Van Noy back but this crap (along with all that boogeymen garbage) will sour me on him quickly. These are the details that lose teams games.

And still, despite this really dumb play, it actually looked like Brady was short of the line to gain. This is something I'd hope the coaches catch in the future. The Bucs likely would've gone for it and converted, but you gotta think they would've won the challenge and made the Bucs earn it on 4th down.

It was a bad spot by the officials. We got screwed on that play and the Jordan Whitehead trip...

 

[patsinthesnow]

Watching the highlights, and my god was this a monumentally stupid play by Van Noy. The 3rd down & 6 early in the 4th quarter that Brady scrambled for ... Van Noy was in perfect position to tackle Brady about 3-5 yards short of the line to gain, had a good angle on him, and basically just had to wrap-up Brady and bring him to the ground, with Godchaux right there as well to finish the deal.

But no - instead of making the smart play, Van Noy lowers his shoulder and tries to light Brady up. Not only did he completely fail in his goal to deck Brady, but Van Noy's momentum then carried him into Godchaux as Godchaux was tackling Brady. If Van Noy doesn't knock Godchaux off his spot as he's making the tackle, Brady may end up a couple yards short.

I was happy when we brought Van Noy back but this crap (along with all that boogeymen garbage) will sour me on him quickly. These are the details that lose teams games.

And still, despite this really dumb play, it actually looked like Brady was short of the line to gain. This is something I'd hope the coaches catch in the future. The Bucs likely would've gone for it and converted, but you gotta think they would've won the challenge and made the Bucs earn it on 4th down.

View attachment 36296

Wow. What a dumb play. Kudos for the find.

Van Noy has been underwhelming to say the least. Only four pressures & 1 sack. Let’s Kamara score rather than attempting to cover him because bracket coverage wasn’t there. Commits a DPI on a RB not known for his receiving skills. Throw in this play & he hasn’t been playing disciplined.

Hard to keep Uche off the field for Van Noy if this continues IMO.

 

[BradytoMosstoGronk]

It was a bad spot by the officials. We got screwed on that play and the Jordan Whitehead trip...

What? The spot was fine. That last pic pretty much nails him falling on the line to gain. The issue with the play, as Dreighver points out, was Van Noy trying to shoulder tackle Brady when he had a perfect angle to wrap him up.

 

[Uptown]

I admit I was wrong about Mills. I said he was best utilized as a spot nickel, safety or strictly RZ boundary CB due to his physicality. Either he’s significantly improved his technique, he’s being coached/put in more favorable positions or both. He’s really been a bright spot. Btw…this crow tastes marvelous

 

[SHOWTIME15]

What? The spot was fine. That last pic pretty much nails him falling on the line to gain. The issue with the play, as Dreighver points out, was Van Noy trying to shoulder tackle Brady when he had a perfect angle to wrap him up.

I assumed that his left elbow was down in this frame. Really tough to tell whether it's down or whether Brady's still in the air from this shot. If you compare Brady's elbow to Van Noy's Helmet, which is clearly on the ground, it looks like the elbow hadn't touched the ground yet.

 

[BradytoMosstoGronk]

I assumed that his left elbow was down in this frame, but I could be wrong. Really tough to tell whether it's down or whether Brady's still in the air from this shot.

You'd need a different angle, as I interpreted that one his arm was still off the ground. You'd have a point if his thigh was down though. If we had an angle from the other side of the field then he could be down short.

This play still comes back to Van Noy for me. I noticed this play live and I wondered why you'd shoulder check Brady, he's not exactly fast but he's also not small.

 

[italian pat patriot]

I am so proud of this team....we really played competitively when nobody gave us a shot..... this one hurts, but Mac is our future...and he played really well..

Tough loss, but our future is bright with Mac.......

let's discuss...

Pity and sad...we could be easily 3-1 instead 1-3...
Fans at stadium were great !!!

Ol ugly...run defense too...
Judon is a top player

 

[ashley]

Pity and sad...we could be easily 3-1 instead 1-3...
Fans at stadium were great !!!

Very true IPP.....we are so close, a bounce of the ball here and there.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

This play still comes back to Van Noy for me. I noticed this play live and I wondered why you'd shoulder check Brady, he's not exactly fast but he's also not small.

All the reason I think Bill should go and get Collins. His speed would help a lot because right now our LBs are slow overall.

 

[50-yard-line]

All the reason I think Bill should go and get Collins. His speed would help a lot because right now our LBs are slow overall.

Is Collins still fast? He's 32. Just wondering - haven't watched him since he left.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Is Collins still fast? He's 32. Just wondering - haven't watched him since he left.

Not sure, but Judon (who's been great), Hightower, and Van Noy don't have great speed. Drafting a guy like Patrick Queen would have been great, as I believe he's a good sideline to sideline tackler with 4.5 speed, but we traded down for Dugger.