Boutte available for trade?

[upstater1]

I read exactly what you wrote. You touted Boutte’s success rate and then said it was comparable to Pickens’ success rate. So you were comparing the two WRs.

No that's absolutely NOT what I wrote. This is your problem. You read things incorrectly.

 

[Real fan 02]

It also seems like his team has over-played their hand.

It seems like the rest of the league just isn't buying what they are selling.

And, if we're being honest, the fact we didn't extend him ourselves kind of says a lot.

That's what it's looking like. Not sure who his representatives are.. but as I've said it's gotta be coming from his side letting NFL people know he's seeking a trade.. I believe Vrabel will do him a solid and trey to move him to a team with a QB in the NFC.. because if he doesn't go anywhere that doesn't have a QB he won't be in the league long.

 

[Rob0729]

And he produced in the first 2 playoff games when no one else did.

He went out early against Atlanta, by the way. His lack of production there was a natural consequence of not even playing 3/4s of the game. He also got a concussion against the Ravens. He returned in 2 weeks from the hamstring injury and missed only one game because of the concussion. Given the injuries, he played 13 games overall this year.

He was our downfield threat and if you project his numbers out to a full 17 games from 13, his numbers compare with downfield threat guys like Alec Pierce.

Pierce averages 42 receptions, 18.7 YPC, 50% success rate.

I'll say it again even though I've said it a bazillion times, the downfield guys are targeted less AND they also have a lower success rate.

Alec Pierce just signed a huge contract. His numbers are similar to Boutte's.

Then you should be excited. The Pats are going to get a first or second rounder for Boutte if they trade him.

Again, Giardi said people around the league see Boutte as a fourth WR on a good team with little upside.

And Pierce's numbers are not similar to Boutte. Pierce averaged 21.3 YPC. And had 22.3 YPC the year before. He had almost twice as many yards as Boutte.

Again, if you are right, the Pats are going to get a first or second day pick for Boutte. You are going to be disappointed when they get a conditional sixth though.

 

[Real fan 02]

Agreed. it’s a common thread at every position group.

That's the type of player style that wins in the postseason and Vrabel knows this first hand.. I equate this offseason to that of 2004.. when we reinforced the trenches with clock killin Dillon.. although he was a very accomplished back in Cincinnati he was a bull dozer.. with a real FB now and a blocking TE with an upgraded offensive line the running game should see significant improvements.. those rankings being 4th running the ball last season was a bit deceptive...

 

[PatsFan2]

And he produced in the first 2 playoff games when no one else did.

He went out early against Atlanta, by the way. His lack of production there was a natural consequence of not even playing 3/4s of the game. He also got a concussion against the Ravens. He returned in 2 weeks from the hamstring injury and missed only one game because of the concussion. Given the injuries, he played 13 games overall this year.

He was our downfield threat and if you project his numbers out to a full 17 games from 13, his numbers compare with downfield threat guys like Alec Pierce.

Pierce averages 42 receptions, 18.7 YPC, 50% success rate.

I'll say it again even though I've said it a bazillion times, the downfield guys are targeted less AND they also have a lower success rate.

Alec Pierce just signed a huge contract. His numbers are similar to Boutte's.

Minus that concussion Boutte would have had close to 1000yds last year. People are selling him short aroud here.

 

[Rob0729]

No that's absolutely NOT what I wrote. This is your problem. You read things incorrectly.

Let's look at Boutte's stats last year.

70% success rate with 16 YPC. See anyone else remotely like Boutte in the NFL? Only one other player, Pickens. That's it.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2025/receiving.htm#receiving::rec

I don't know why you'd respond like that.

I wrote that only Pickens has a similar success rate with high YPC. I provided the link that showed it.

I didn't say Boutte is Pickens.

Doubs better be better than Boutte or Eliot Wolf should be out of a job if he isn't.

As for Diggs, his YPC is 12!

That's a far cry from 16.7

I did not compare Pickens to Boutte.

I don't know how many times I have to say it.

I said the only guy in the NFL who has a similar ratio is Pickens.

The fact of the matter is that it is much harder having a huge success rate 20+ yards downfield than on short passes either WR screens or 10 yard dinks from the slot.

This is why normally you'd see a much higher success rate for players like Welker (60%) than Randy Moss (50%)

You repeatedly compare Boutte's success rate to Pickens and then deny it. I don't know if I can help you.

The success rate of Pickens who was targeted 137 times last year. Boutte was 47 times. On no planet was their success rate remotely the same no matter what your stat says.

 

[PatsFan2]

Then you should be excited. The Pats are going to get a first or second rounder for Boutte if they trade him.

Again, Giardi said people around the league see Boutte as a fourth WR on a good team with little upside.

And Pierce's numbers are not similar to Boutte. Pierce averaged 21.3 YPC. And had 22.3 YPC the year before. He had almost twice as many yards as Boutte.

Again, if you are right, the Pats are going to get a first or second day pick for Boutte. You are going to be disappointed when they get a conditional sixth though.

Rob: Boutte played in some $hitty Offenses also had Mac Jones for a QB. Clueless BB shut him down his Rookie year; like we couldn't use him. BB was trying to justify the can't separate Parker Trade.

 

[rkarp1]

Minus that concussion Boutte would have had close to 1000yds last year. People are selling him short aroud here.

there were 20 WR's that reached 1000 yards last season
1 of those 20, had less than 100 targets
that 1 WR, still had twice as many targets as Boutte saw

 

[Rob0729]

Minus that concussion Boutte would have had close to 1000yds last year. People are selling him short aroud here.

Are you sure about that? He had half those yards and only missed three games. No one knows if the concussion affected his performance post concussion. People are just speculating that.

 

[Rob0729]

there were 20 WR's that reached 1000 yards last season
1 of those 20, had less than 100 targets
that 1 WR, still had twice as many targets as Boutte saw

Again, those lack of targets could very well have been because Boutte couldn't get open.

 

[Rob0729]

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Boutte could beat out Doubs if he doesn't get traded, but I tend to doubt it. If the Patriots, who know Boutte better than any of us, thought it was more important to pay Doubs than Boutte, there is very little chance Boutte makes his way into the starting line up other than if Doubs is moved to the slot and Boutte is moved to the Z.

What Doubs did in Green Bay isn't a fair comparison. The Packers' offense is designed to not have primary WRs even though Doubs led the team in almost every stat.

Again, Boutte is a good player, but I think he is another one of those players that people think we need to keep at all cost (or at least make a strong effort to keep) that will be all but forgotten by midseason after he leaves.

It’s not “keep at all costs.” It’s “keep at little to no cost.”

In 2027, that’s a different story. Certainly we should keep him until we know we don’t need him re: trades etc.

 

[upstater1]

Then you should be excited. The Pats are going to get a first or second rounder for Boutte if they trade him.

Again, Giardi said people around the league see Boutte as a fourth WR on a good team with little upside.

And Pierce's numbers are not similar to Boutte. Pierce averaged 21.3 YPC. And had 22.3 YPC the year before. He had almost twice as many yards as Boutte.

Again, if you are right, the Pats are going to get a first or second day pick for Boutte. You are going to be disappointed when they get a conditional sixth though.

You consistently ignore the target #. Pierce is a 50% target rate over his career.

Boutte's numbers are similar especially if you look at targets and the number of passes he was on track for.

It's great to have 22 YPC but how many plays end with a drop to the ground?

WHY is this crucial.

Because you run the #s like this:

Yards per target: 12 YPC for both of them.

I'd also say that if you subscribe to the idea that "matriculating" the ball downfield and staying on schedule has more value than chunk plays, then the 70% target rate is better for the team, even though the net result is that both players produce 12 YPA. Why? Because on the 2 of the 10 plays when the ball DOESN'T hit the ground when you're targeting Boutte (as opposed to Boutte) you are gaining more than the 5 YPC that Pierce is giving you per catch over Boutte. Patriots average yards per play last year was 5.8!

This means you get more value from Boutte than you do from Pierce.

 

[upstater1]

You repeatedly compare Boutte's success rate to Pickens and then deny it. I don't know if I can help you.

The success rate of Pickens who was targeted 137 times last year. Boutte was 47 times. On no planet was their success rate remotely the same no matter what your stat says.

You can't read. You have great difficulty reading.

I was NOT comparing Boutte's success rate to Pickens's success rate.

EVERYONE who is reading this thread except for you knows that I was comparing success rate AND YPC (BOTH OF THEM TOGETHER) to the rest of the league, and in doing so, I wrote that the only one who comes close to Boutte's numbers is Pickens.

This is just a statement of absolute fact based on the numbers.

 

[Rob0729]

It’s not “keep at all costs.” It’s “keep at little to no cost.”

In 2027, that’s a different story. Certainly we should keep him until we know we don’t need him re: trades etc.

And when he goes to McDaniels and demands that they give him the ball or walks out of practice and calls Wolf from his car again and tells him that he is done with football, you will be ok with it.

Again, there is a chance Boutte is not going to show up without a new contract or a guarantee of a starting job.

 

[Rob0729]

You consistently ignore the target #. Pierce is a 50% target rate over his career.

Boutte's numbers are similar especially if you look at targets and the number of passes he was on track for.

It's great to have 22 YPC but how many plays end with a drop to the ground?

WHY is this crucial.

Because you run the #s like this:

Yards per target: 12 YPC for both of them.

I'd also say that if you subscribe to the idea that "matriculating" the ball downfield and staying on schedule has more value than chunk plays, then the 70% target rate is better for the team, even though the net result is that both players produce 12 YPA. Why? Because on the 2 of the 10 plays when the ball DOESN'T hit the ground when you're targeting Boutte (as opposed to Boutte) you are gaining more than the 5 YPC that Pierce is giving you per catch over Boutte. Patriots average yards per play last year was 5.8!

This means you get more value from Boutte than you do from Pierce.

I am not missing anything. You are just trying to manipulate the numbers to fit your argument. Pierce can get open. Boutte cannot consistently. Boutte had lesser QBs.

Pierce is overpayed. Boutte is on a rookie contract. Yes, you get more value from Boutte. You get a back up WR in Boutte on a rookie fifth round contract. He is getting paid like a #3 or #4 WR which is what he is.

 

[rkarp1]

I am not missing anything. You are just trying to manipulate the numbers to fit your argument. Pierce can get open. Boutte cannot consistently. Boutte had lesser QBs.

Pierce is overpayed. Boutte is on a rookie contract. Yes, you get more value from Boutte. You get a back up WR in Boutte on a rookie fifth round contract. He is getting paid like a #3 or #4 WR which is what he is.

you continue to put situational usage stats and a nothing numeric label on a player.
both are meaningless
Boutte has been exceptional when thrown to
he is a tremendous value on his given contract

thats not to say he must be retained. its not to say he is better or worse than other players
it is to say trading him for a 5th is a very poor decision for the team, especially now, or anytime before the the other WR's finish preseason healthy.
if the team wraps preseason game 2 with everyone in the WR room healthy, trading Boutte for a 5th will still be on the table, if thats the direction the team wants to take (still a poor decision)

 

[mgteich]

I think that we need to come to terms with the fact that the team has chosen Brown-Doubs over Diggs-Boutte as our top 2. Apparently, the team believes that this is a major improvement or they wouldn't be pay the high prices.

If Boutte stays (doubtful, but reasonable), he would be competing with Williams for reps.

 

[rkarp1]

I think that we need to come to terms with the fact that the team has chosen Brown-Doubs over Diggs-Boutte as our top 2. Apparently, the team believes that this is a major improvement or they wouldn't be pay the high prices.

If Boutte stays (doubtful, but reasonable), he would be competing with Williams for reps.

I still think it questionable that Brown is a done deal
or
if the Pats do offer a 1st, it's a foolish deal by the Pats, given Boutte and Diggs are still available to them

 

[PatsFan2]

I still think it questionable that Brown is a done deal
or
if the Pats do offer a 1st, it's a foolish deal by the Pats, given Boutte and Diggs are still available to them

Neither are better than A.J. Brown though.