Belichick criticism mega-thread

[mariomega]

If you want to gravitate to Bills years in Cleveland and years here minus TB to trash him as a coach that’s fine. But I am curious, if not Bill which coach(s) would you rather have these last 20 years?

Anyone. Brady would take us to the promised land.

 

[upstater1]

Just so I know, which Superbowl did Brady cost us?

2007? Can't be that. he got us the go-ahead TD in 4th quarter with 2 min left. Defense failed.
20011? Can't be that. he got us the go-ahead TD in 4th quarter with 2 min left. Defense failed.
20017? Can't be that. he got us the go-ahead TD in 4th quarter with 2 min left. Defense Plus he was like 500+ yards and 3 TDs with no picks. Defense uber-mega failed.

2007. Brady had a bit of the deer in the headlights. Way too overconfident going in. Sneered at the idea they could be held to 17 points. ****iness got to him. But it's ok.

For what it's worth, Belichick blew that Super Bowl too! So there's 2 on Belichick.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Do you think Bill would’ve realized at some point in 2001 that Drew was holding the team back and made the switch and that Mo Lewis just accelerated the move?

I'm leaning towards no because he just signed a $100M contract.

 

[mariomega]

2007. Brady had a bit of the deer in the headlights. Way too overconfident going in. Sneered at the idea they could be held to 17 points. ****iness got to him. But it's ok.

For what it's worth, Belichick blew that Super Bowl too! So there's 2 on Belichick.

Giants front four ate Brady alive that game.
And he still managed to pull a TD with 2 min left.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Yes, I do want. And you too, ****roach.

You are a great Patriots fan.

 

[venecol]

Full game: 2002 Patriots @ Bears - YouTube

2:25:35 - what a heads up defensive play by Tom Brady himself. Saved the game. Sure doesn't look like a game manager thing to do.

Compare that with what Cam Newton did on the Super Bowl fumble. Yikes.

Rob Parker: all that proves is that I'm right; Brady is the LOAT, luckiest of all time.

LMAO

 

[upstater1]

I had to step away for a bit, now I'm back to the Team Bill vs Team Tom battle:

I'd say after 2002 if they had another losing season.

There's video of Bob for one of those documentaries saying Bill was not ready to be a HC in '97.

The difference between the 96 team and the 2001 team was night and day for Drew. Drew was uncomfortable as heck in the 2001 offense being under center as much as he was because Woody couldn't snap the damn ball. They had to go out and get Mike Compton for crying out loud. Smith was not Martin, the line wasn't good enough for Drew to take deep shots, there was no TE and I can't remember why Glenn was MIA. Drew was just not a fit in NE anymore.

They got rid of old-overpaid players.

See above regarding Drew. The D was trending in the right direction to be good enough to keep them in games, but the O could've move the ball worth a damn with Drew.

They had a solid roster, but they weren't loaded. Aside from 2007, 2003 was their best roster.

That's sure a long time for a team that was just 2 years removed from the playoffs and with a soon to be $100M QB.

Was not ready to be a HC. Of the Patriots. Yes, because it would have meant crossing his mentor who was in a big fight with Kraft. That's what I alluded to in my post.

With the 2001 defense, we actually didn't need the QBs to do a whole lot. That's the point. All those additions to the D needed at least 2 games to gel, and some of them were our main pieces (Seymour, Phifer, Vrabel).

I don't know if that team even gets to the AFCCG with Drew but they make the playoffs.

 

[upstater1]

The loser here is you, pathetic prick.
Since your first post here today, you are calling people idiots.

So GFY POS. You are a bastard who wants to bully everyone, not here your imbecile, go to hell and stop replying me.

Yes, I hate BB for what he did with Brady. And he is a ****in loser without Brady, 62-72 record, can you dispute that POS?

Kiss my ass

Holy cow. ROFL!! This is like some lame message board for old bored guys. Not worth all this.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Was not ready to be a HC. Of the Patriots. Yes, because it would have meant crossing his mentor who was in a big fight with Kraft. That's what I alluded to in my post.

No, Bob meant he felt Bill wasn't capable of being a HC again only a few years removed from Cleveland. It had nothing to do with Parcells.

With the 2001 defense, we actually didn't need the QBs to do a whole lot. That's the point. All those additions to the D needed at least 2 games to gel, and some of them were our main pieces (Seymour, Phifer, Vrabel).

No, they needed the offense to move the ball which Drew couldn't do. Even the 2000 Ravens and 2002 Bucs D needed the O to at least move the ball. The Pats D were nowhere close to those D's. If they didn't need the O to move the ball, they lose to the Chargers, @ Jets, @ Bills and you could make a case for maybe one or two more.

I don't know if that team even gets to the AFCCG with Drew but they make the playoffs.

Playoffs would be a stretch with Drew as he was extremely uncomfortable. 6-8 wins would be their ceiling if they couldn't move the ball. See above.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

I'm leaning towards no because he just signed a $100M contract.

Should be noted that everyone believed Drew was our best QB the day he signed that contract. They didn’t expect Brady to improve so much in the offseason. Would’ve never signed Huard as Drew’s backup if that were the case.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Should be noted that everyone believed Drew was our best QB the day he signed that contract. They didn’t expect Brady to improve so much in the offseason. Would’ve never signed Huard as Drew’s backup if that were the case.

Yep, I've read from reporters and I believe it was @PatsWickedPissah that had said Brady was outplaying Drew in camp. But how do you bench a newly signed $100M QB for a 2nd year player that was a 6th round pick? Unfortunately, the injury was the only way.

 

[mariomega]

Man, it is so funny to remember Brady facing hell here because BB didn't want to give him a 2-year contract, banned Guerrero and all that crap.

Look at Jason Licht now:

“Well, I talk to Tom often, but I’ll probably keep that under wraps right now,” Licht noted. “Like I said, I know it appears that he really had a good time this year winning the Super Bowl and likes our organization, likes our coaches, likes our head coach and ownership. And we certainly love him, so usually when you have those two things going for each other, it’s a match made in heaven. So, we’d like to keep this going.”

“It’s more than just ‘does this allow the Bucs to bring back another player,'” Wright explained on FS1’s First Things First. “It’s the messaging to Tom: We’re all in with you. You now have the Bucs saying, ‘We want to entrust you beyond age 45.'”

What a difference. It's a shame Brady cannot end his career here.

 

[skinnydog]

AFC championship? jeez. Let's win the division first.

Well, yes. with BB the team‘s first concentration was winning the division. The bar is higher now for BB, I think.

 

[skinnydog]

2007 - did nothing because of poor offensive line play. got go ahead touchdown in 4th quarter because Giants D got tired and Corey Webster slipped on Randy Moss TD

2011 - not his best game. Safety in the endzone was a huge mistake. Go ahead touchdown occurred with 11 mins left in the 3rd quarter. Brady did nothing after that point.

2017 - played a great game but missed a wide open James White on the Brandon Graham strip sack. Go ahead touchdown was scored with 8 mins left in the 4th.

At least get your facts right.

Geez. All defenses get tired. Fact is in 07 Brady put the team ahead in Q4. Defense couldn’t hold the lead. In 2007, Brady threw for over 500 yards in regulation and they never, punted in the entire game. It was by far the most prolific Super Bowl passing performance to date. The D at the end let the Eagles March down field an score yet again against a defense BBhad inexplicably handcuffed by keeping Malcolm on the bench the entire game. Sorry that was on BB.

 

[upstater1]

No, Bob meant he felt Bill wasn't capable of being a HC again only a few years removed from Cleveland. It had nothing to do with Parcells.

No, they needed the offense to move the ball which Drew couldn't do. Even the 2000 Ravens and 2002 Bucs D needed the O to at least move the ball. The Pats D were nowhere close to those D's. If they didn't need the O to move the ball, they lose to the Chargers, @ Jets, @ Bills and you could make a case for maybe one or two more.

Playoffs would be a stretch with Drew as he was extremely uncomfortable. 6-8 wins would be their ceiling if they couldn't move the ball. See above.

Do you have a link to this?

Because McDonough wrote the opposite. And in fact, the very next year Belichick almost took the Raiders job but was then lured back to the Jets when Parcells told him he'd be leaving soon and that the Jets job was a better one.

We disagree on the rest.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Do you have a link to this?

Because McDonough wrote the opposite. And in fact, the very next year Belichick almost took the Raiders job but was then lured back to the Jets when Parcells told him he'd be leaving soon and that the Jets job was a better one.

It was the "Two Bills" documentary. Maybe I got Bob's words mixed up, but I know he talked more about why he didn't hire him. Quote from Reiss's article.:

"Kraft almost hired Belichick as head coach in 1997. But Kraft said in the documentary that he needed a clean break from anyone connected to Parcells. He came back to Belichick in 2000."

Credit to Robert Kraft for keeping Bill Belichick and Tom Brady together

Robert Kraft hasn't joined the Patriots' documentary tour at this point, but New England's owner has a story that should be told in the future.

www.espn.com

 

[crawhammer]

It was absolutely Bill's decision not to call a timeout that forced Carroll to throw the ball there.

Oh please. Bill forced Pete to call a pass play? The desperation to deify Belichick has no humility... he's puppeteering opposing coaches from the sideline. Seattle called a pass play because they trusted their franchise quarterback to not f*ck it up. They were wrong.

That being said, Bledsoe was the starting QB 6x for winning teams. So not sure what you're basing this on, the idea that he couldn't lead the Patriots to a winning season in '01. Not to mention he twice has held aloft the AFCCG trophy.

Bledsoe was a big lummox. A total disaster in the postseason. Not a championship quarterback... it was a miracle Parcells even got him to a Super Bowl.

I'm on record here saying Belichick deserves credit for 2 Super Bowls and Brady for 4. But both needed each other anyway. Brady with Arians wins 1. Brady with Licht and, say, Rivera wins 2 or 3. Brady with Shanahan wins 5. Belichick with Manning wins 4. Belichick with, say, David Carr wins 2. Belichick with Jake Delhomme 1.

What kind of hypothetical gibberish is this? Peyton Manning played on some great football teams that didn't win sh*t because he f*cked it up. He barely won a second Super Bowl with his frail arm and choking pedigree.

David Carr?! This is a moment when you think to yourself too much crank.

2007. Brady had a bit of the deer in the headlights. Way too overconfident going in. Sneered at the idea they could be held to 17 points. ****iness got to him. But it's ok.

"Deer in the highlights"... "Way too overconfident"... he couldn't have been both. Make up your mind on which ridiculous insult you're going to use.

They averaged 38 P/G so 17 points was laughable. The OL got completely destroyed from start to finish. Despite that Brady led a go-ahead TD drive and handed it over to Belichick and the defense with 2:30 left to stop Eli Manning. Belichick choked... he stood there with his thumb up his ass as 5'8" Hobbs was in isolation coverage with 6'5" Burress. The game was over before the snap. Had Eli underthrown the ball for a pick then the IBWT crowd would be carrying on to this very moment about how Bill coached up the players and had the scout team run that same play 200 times leading up to the Super Bowl.

On that play the coaching staff had confidence Malcolm would do his job.

You talking out of both sides of your mouth AGAIN. In Super Bowl 49 the coaching staff had confidence Malcolm could make a difference on one play but in Super Bowl 52 the coaching staff didn't think he could make a difference for 60 minutes. LOL! that's half-witted IBWT logic at it's finest.

 

[Deus Irae]

Haha, I move the goalposts. Hilarious coming from you. Every single one of your posts is deflecting. Never ever admitted one single mistake in decades on these boards. EVER. If wrong, move goalposts.

I admit errors all the time. And I'm certainly not the one deflecting in his posts here. However, even if I'd never admitted a single error in my entire life, and had never answered even a single question directly, that wouldn't change the fact that you're moving the goalposts all over the place.

I don't even know what you're referring to here anyway. I only pointed out that plenty of coaches had 1 winning season out of 4 in their first 4. Your contribution was basically null.

So you decided to make a completely wrong, and silly, personal attack just because you didn't understand why I'd noted that Noll's coaching success tracked with the infusion/development of Hall of Fame talent on his team? That's your defense here?


Bless your heart.

 

[RobertWeathers]

You talking out of both sides of your mouth AGAIN. In Super Bowl 49 the coaching staff had confidence Malcolm could make a difference on one play but in Super Bowl 52 the coaching staff didn't think he could make a difference for 60 minutes. LOL! that's half-witted IBWT logic at it's finest..

You have a complete inability to comprehend how those two situations are drastically different when it's actually quite simple.

I'll let you take some time to think about it.

 

[aluminum seats]

2011 - not his best game. Safety in the endzone was a huge mistake. Go ahead touchdown occurred with 11 mins left in the 3rd quarter. Brady did nothing after that point.

Glad you pointed this out. There’s a really weird Mandela effect with this game, where people say Brady scored with a couple of minutes left ALL the time. It’s really strange.

As you said, the Pats scored a touchdown on the opening drive of the second half… and that’s all she wrote. They went punt, interception, punt, downs the rest of the way. There were no last minute heroics from Brady in that game.

(That’s also, by the way, the least painful loss by far for the Pats to me. In fact if it wasn’t stupid Eli and the Giants, I really wouldn’t care at all. They weren’t that good, you can’t win them all, and they had a murderer on the team that I just as well not see old clips of him celebrating a Super Bowl.)