PostGame Thread 2023 Week 2: Patriots Lose to Dolphins 24-17

[borg]

Mac Jones has had 5 4th quarter drives in the past 2 weeks with the opportunity to tie the game or take the lead.

He has 0 points on those 5 drives.

The kid does not possess tools to elevate an offense.
It's been a constant and never more clear than now.

The minute before NE drafted Mac at #15, BB sought out input from his minions in the war room in a very public manner by going around the room....
"You good with this choice?"
"You comfortable choosing Jones?"
Kraft wanted more collaboration and input from the college evaluation group after so many lackluster drafts and BB made damn sure he was not gonna die alone on the Mac Jones hill.

Note regarding the 2021 draft: NE had removed Micah Parsons from their draft board

 

[Ian]

*sigh*

I hate the final 4th and 4 decision by Mac to take the out to Gesicki. He doesn't get enough on the ball and Gesicki has to step up one step inside the sticks, and then makes an inside move, kind of, which cost him more ground. I really want to see the all 22 on this play, because it looks like Parker has his guy beat when he gets out of frame. My whole point is Mac needed to throw the ball to a better, deeper spot of he is going to go to Gesicki, which it looks like he's locked on for whatever reason. He's gotta throw it past the sticks, and he's short. Maybe it's on Gesicki to get deeper, but it looks like Mac didn't give him enough to work with.

I thought that too but @PP2 had a video of the play in the X's and O's and there was a guy flying in right up the middle, and it's actually surprising Jones both got it off and had enough on it for Gesicki to have it be that close.

 

[Grogan14]

*sigh*

I hate the final 4th and 4 decision by Mac to take the out to Gesicki. He doesn't get enough on the ball and Gesicki has to step up one step inside the sticks, and then makes an inside move, kind of, which cost him more ground. I really want to see the all 22 on this play, because it looks like Parker has his guy beat when he gets out of frame. My whole point is Mac needed to throw the ball to a better, deeper spot of he is going to go to Gesicki, which it looks like he's locked on for whatever reason. He's gotta throw it past the sticks, and he's short. Maybe it's on Gesicki to get deeper, but it looks like Mac didn't give him enough to work with.



This is what folks are referring to, IMO, when they talk about signature wins. Mac's QB is likely described as "fine" or "adequate". Neither of those things are good enough without dynamic playmakers to help take the pressure off. Either way, taking the safe throw short of the sticks doesn't help them win. Mac's gotta be better.

Curmudgeon old Bill benches his most dynamic guy after a turn over. Didn't bench Zeke last week, however. Back to sending messages instead of winning football games. Shades of footgate. Not saying that if Douglas plays the whole game they'd win, but he's not helping redeem himself by sitting the pine.

As a rookie he has to prove he can reliably hold on to the ball. Its the most important thing rookies are taught. If you lose the ball you wont play. I support BB on this one.
DD was not going to win the game for them.
One of the veteran receivers needs to step up FFS

 

[bobbutts]

This is what it's like to be a fan of typical NFL team. I almost forgot after the last couple decades.

 

[Grogan14]

Nah, they're not in full rebuild. Not even close. They're trying to rebuild and compete and not succeeding at either.

Their offense needs a full rebuild

 

[Ian]

This year is not the year to make that kind of trade. We are in full rebuild mode and should be sellers

LOL, gotta take a deep breath there. They're not in full rebuild mode. They've got a solid defense, and they're a couple of players away on offense and need help at tackle. It's not as dire as it seems. It's not ideal, but they're not horrible. They're just frustrating.

 

[Guts]

The kid does not possess tools to elevate an offense.
It's been a constant and never more clear than now.

The minute before NE drafted Mac at #15, BB sought out input from his minions in the war room in a very public manner by going around the room....
"You good with this choice?"
"You comfortable choosing Jones?"
Kraft wanted more collaboration and input from the college evaluation group after so many lackluster drafts and BB made damn sure he was not gonna die alone on the Mac Jones hill.

Note regarding the 2021 draft: NE had removed Micah Parsons from their draft board

Mac's just mid.
He won't lose you games, but he won't will the team to win either. Obviously not all his fault and I actually think he played pretty well yesterday.
I think he could be like a Cousins/Carr if he ever gets some decent weapons/respectable Oline play

 

[archstanton543]

Their offense needs a full rebuild

Agree. Too many B and C-listers making a whole lot of money.

 

[Grogan14]

LOL, gotta take a deep breath there. They're not in full rebuild mode. They've got a solid defense, and they're a couple of players away on offense and need help at tackle. It's not as dire as it seems. It's not ideal, but they're not horrible. They're just frustrating.

Disagree. Their offense needs a full rebuild

 

[FCB02062]

Disagree. Their offense needs a full rebuild

but I thought Bill O'Brien was going to fix that? Juju Smith Schuster was going to provide tons of YAC that they didn't have last year, Stevenson was going to have a breakout 1300 yard season, Gesicki and Henry would reinvent the two TE offense.....oops

 

[ScottishPatriots]

but I thought Bill O'Brien was going to fix that? Juju Smith Schuster was going to provide tons of YAC that they didn't have last year, Stevenson was going to have a breakout 1300 yard season, Gesicki and Henry would reinvent the two TE offense.....oops

JuJu Sanu looks like an old man out there

 

[Ian]

Disagree. Their offense needs a full rebuild

Then I guess I don't know what to tell you there. It breaks down like this, at least in terms of vets off the top of my head:

M.Jones
T.Brown LT ?
V.Lowe ?
C.Strange
D.Andrews
M.Onwenu
C.Anderson ?
H.Henry
M.Gesicki
D.Parker ?
J.Smith-Schuster?
K.Bourne
R.Stevenson
E.Elliott

Those are the biggest question marks and were the areas of concern last night. But it's not as dire as it seems where all of it needs to be blown up, albeit receiver is probably the most worrisome.

 

[Steve102]

Then I guess I don't know what to tell you there. It breaks down like this, at least in terms of vets off the top of my head:

M.Jones
T.Brown LT ?
V.Lowe ?
C.Strange
D.Andrews
M.Onwenu
C.Anderson ?
H.Henry
M.Gesicki
D.Parker ?
J.Smith-Schuster?
K.Bourne
R.Stevenson
E.Elliott

Those are the biggest question marks and were the areas of concern last night. But it's not as dire as it seems where all of it needs to be blown up, albeit receiver is probably the most worrisome.

The WR thing is going to be a problem until Bill retires.

 

[PP2]

I thought that too but @PP2 had a video of the play in the X's and O's and there was a guy flying in right up the middle, and it's actually surprising Jones both got it off and had enough on it for Gesicki to have it be that close.

100% on Strange who had a terrible game. He missed what looks like a combo block call. You can see Andrews was not blocking straight up but was going in for a leveraged block which he quickly loses because Strange is just standing there, confused.

 

[jdlboot14]

Story of the last few years - the Patriots are too far behind the curve in these areas:
- waiting too long to make any scheme, personnel adjustments both in offseason and during games (including coaching/nepotism)
- still operating with 1960's discipline ideas - benching your best players for 1 mistake.
- sticking with 1990's football gameplans through 3 quarters, until its too late.
- leaving glaring holes in the roster, and picking the wrong big-$ FA's.

It's sad to say, it feels sacrilegious, but this streak of the last few years would get ANY OTHER coach fired by now.
Can anyone say that the SAME issues plaguing this team can't be pinned on the HC/GM? It's so obvious now, you can't ignore it.
Can BB really inspire, manage, design, re-ignite this team in this age of the NFL? We'll see.

 

[RobertWeathers]

JuJu Sanu looks like an old man out there

JuJu Sanu....lol

 

[patsfanfromoversea]

Story of the last few years - the Patriots are too far behind the curve in these areas:
- waiting too long to make any scheme, personnel adjustments both in offseason and during games (including coaching/nepotism)
- still operating with 1960's discipline ideas - benching your best players for 1 mistake.
- sticking with 1990's football gameplans through 3 quarters, until its too late.
- leaving glaring holes in the roster, and picking the wrong big-$ FA's.

It's sad to say, it feels sacrilegious, but this streak of the last few years would get ANY OTHER coach fired by now.
Can anyone say that the SAME issues plaguing this team can't be pinned on the HC/GM? It's so obvious now, you can't ignore it.
Can BB really inspire, manage, design, re-ignite this team in this age of the NFL? We'll see.

I really don’t get it
If a rookie makes a mistake like a fumble they get benched

If a vet makes the same mistake they keep playing

Normally veterans should now better and for a rookie you can expect mistakes , this strategy makes no sense

 

[Kdo5]

The WR thing is going to be a problem until Bill retires.

Next years draft and off-season it’s pretty simple. Line and receiver. If there’s no one in free agency it’s time to take another stab at a receiver mid first round or even earlier. Going for a consensus type of guy.

Of course if there are lineman and actual good receivers available in free agency we need to break the bank open. I’m not talking the type of decent little #3 receivers either.

 

[Thelonious]

1) The officiating was sloppy and amateurish at times, but that's not why we lost the game.

2) There is something physically wrong with Stephenson. He has the tentative look of a guy who is hurt. Maybe it'll get better; maybe it won't. We will likely never get enough information to know. Unlike all my old aunts, Bill definitely does not love talking about medical issues. Some of Rhamondre's tentativeness may well be due to the stumblebums "opening holes" for him, but he looks physically compromised to me.

3) The GM's slovenliness in dealing with the O-line will be a season-long drag on the team, and will result in injuries to other players. The team's major personnel problem is at GM.

4) Whoever has been managing the acquisition of WR's over the past several years is failing to understand what is required in a WR as the game has evolved. See 3).

5) Given what he had to deal with, I thought Mac played really quite well. At least half of Mac's struggles to get "over the hump" so that he may be regarded as a "franchise qb" is due to inferior personnel at OL and WR. The entire (limited) character of the offense - even under the care of an excellent OC - is due not so much to Mac's arm (serviceable, methinks, though nothing more) nor to other of his alleged limitations as to the need to compensate for weak OL play and a WR room loaded with slowpokes. While the jury may still be out on Mac, I feel better about him after the game. If you take into account how ill-treated and mishandled he has been over the past two years, it is certainly not reasonable to write him off. It is hard to think of a recent young QB who has been less well-served by the team drafting him than Mac.

6) The defense, I think, is good verging on excellent, staffed with quality players with a decent admixture of speed. A little squishy and inert in the middle of the D-line, but serviceable even there. The whole situation reminds of of a guy who has a world-class collection of bamboo fly rods (the defense), but lives in a hovel and drives a Yugo (the offense). The guy's hobby, his love in life, is fly rods, if you get my drift. He used to have a guy who helped him keep the hovel in order, but that guy's gone.

7) We've heard all this before, of course - "already been discussed" - but some stuff bears repeating.

 

[Steve102]

Next years draft and off-season it’s pretty simple. Line and receiver. If there’s no one in free agency it’s time to take another stab at a receiver mid first round or even earlier. Going for a consensus type of guy.

Of course if there are lineman and actual good receivers available in free agency we need to break the bank open. I’m not talking the type of decent little #3 receivers either.

A leopard doesn't change his spots simply because we wish it.