2017 Training Camp - Day 13 (8/15/17) (Joint Practice with the Texans)

[NG Pats Fan]

I don't understand how any of what you have written explains why in your opinion Amendola's role is easier replaceable than Hogan's. But whatever, this discussion is pointless anyway because nobody will trade any of the two anyway.

Due to Amendolas age, being injury prone, I would say there are other wide receivers in the league who can replace Amendolas regular season production and bring the same skill set as a 5th WR. Maybe Austin Carr is one.

I think with hogans skill set, age, size, production, he is much harder to replace as a number 3 WR. There are not many WRs in the league like hogan. Hogan has the height, speed, ability to win 1 on 1s, can lineup anywhere, great hands, can go deep.

Obviously Amendola is very clutch the heart and soul of our offense. But we are so deep at WR with clutch players we can make up for the difference.


I would not trade either. But if I had to choose one to keep, it's hogan all the way

 

[The Gr8est]

Meanwhile in MIA .. the AFCE collapse continues

Probably a residual affect from the block Michael Floyd laid on him last year.

 

[AtomicDawg]

Cannon turning from turnstile to the RT version of Tyron Smith is such an awesome story

Made Von Miler invisible.



Beasley and Watt too. Hopefully he adds Mack and Boss to the list.

 

[Tony2046]

I don't understand how any of what you have written explains why in your opinion Amendola's role is easier replaceable than Hogan's. But whatever, this discussion is pointless anyway because nobody will trade any of the two anyway.

Ok if you are unwilling to discuss that how about this?

JG for Watt.

 

[Kargetina]

Ok if you are unwilling to discuss that how about this?

JG for Watt.

I would sweeten the deal and give them Cyrus Jones as well.

 

[Crazy Patriot Guy]

Probably trying to stay out of the insane heat in Texas.

From someone who lives 90 miles from Houston......this.

 

[Wheelman]

If Rivers is improving that rapidly I can't wait to see what he does in December.

I don't think their 2 starting tackles are at practice though. Who is he taking on?

 

[varjao]

Stop with this crazy talk about trading receivers, remember when the offense was Josh Boyce, KT and Dobson.

 

[AtomicDawg]

I don't think their 2 starting tackles are at practice though. Who is he taking on?

It's either Chris Clark or Julien Davenport. Brown still hasn't reported.

 

[PatsBoy12]

Good news. He was having a damn good camp.

Let's hope he didn't fall behind too much and can continue to build on that momentum.

 

[PatsBoy12]

MM is slowly getting better.

We now have five guys who can legitimately stretch the field - Cooks, Gronk, Hogan, Mitchell and, to a bit of a lesser degree, Jules. This offense will be more fun to watch than '07... Mark my words.

 

[Wheelman]

Well if you want to get someone solid you need to give someone solid. Like @randomk1 said, no one will give up a good DE for Lucien or Carr. You need someone established.

The reason I mentioned Hogan is right now he is the 4th, 5th or 6th option on the team.

Gronk/Cooks/Edelman are all clearly ahead. I would argue White as a 3rd down back will see more targets and also Mitchell might make that 2nd year jump and move Hogan down the depth chart more. Even if not he is only a hair worse if that.

Also for depth behind him you have Amendola who we know is solid and Carr or Lucien (particularly Carr who is think will be a decent NFL depth player..

Only so many balls to go around. Now you can argue Edelman and Gronk and Mitchell seem to have injury issues and if there is a situation when they are all out you would certainly miss Hogan then. But that is a lot to go wrong,

On the other hand if Flowers goes down how confident are you in 2 rookies and Ealy to get the job done while he is out? What if Solder/Cannon go down? You can't worry about a bunch of guys going down in one facet of the game when just one going down in another would kill your team.

While I am concerned it might hurt the team if they get a few injuries on the pass catcher end I am more worried about how much depth is lacked at OT and DE so I would be very willing to explore the option depending on the player you get back.

We need deep speed. We need field stretchers. That's what we haven't had in a long time. If Cooks goes down we have nobody. Lucien and Carr are not speedsters. Hogan is also an excellent route runner. He tracks the deep ball really well. How many times have we seen Brady not being able to connect with the deep ball with our receivers in the past when they're open? But with Hogan it's different, he can track the deep ball in the air really well. And the deep ball chemistry with Brady was there immediately in the 3rd pre season game. You could tell. And it was backed up in Brady's first game back last season against the Browns. We really need what Hogan gives us. And for the price we got him, what a steal! It would be crazy, absolutely crazy to give up on Hogan.

Just to add further, we saw it a few times some DB's giving Hogan space to respect his deep speed.

 

[n6249c]

We now have five guys who can legitimately stretch the field - Cooks, Gronk, Hogan, Mitchell and, to a bit of a lesser degree, Jules. This offense will be more fun to watch than '07... Mark my words.

at the moment we have Lucien as well. FWP.

 

[zydecochris]

Well if you want to get someone solid you need to give someone solid. Like @randomk1 said, no one will give up a good DE for Lucien or Carr. You need someone established.

The reason I mentioned Hogan is right now he is the 4th, 5th or 6th option on the team.

Gronk/Cooks/Edelman are all clearly ahead. I would argue White as a 3rd down back will see more targets and also Mitchell might make that 2nd year jump and move Hogan down the depth chart more. Even if not he is only a hair worse if that.

Also for depth behind him you have Amendola who we know is solid and Carr or Lucien (particularly Carr who is think will be a decent NFL depth player..

Only so many balls to go around. Now you can argue Edelman and Gronk and Mitchell seem to have injury issues and if there is a situation when they are all out you would certainly miss Hogan then. But that is a lot to go wrong,

On the other hand if Flowers goes down how confident are you in 2 rookies and Ealy to get the job done while he is out? What if Solder/Cannon go down? You can't worry about a bunch of guys going down in one facet of the game when just one going down in another would kill your team.

While I am concerned it might hurt the team if they get a few injuries on the pass catcher end I am more worried about how much depth is lacked at OT and DE so I would be very willing to explore the option depending on the player you get back.

As always your reasoning is solid (I have really grown to look forward to your analyses, BTW), but in this case I respectfully disagree.

Last year, Hogan really took a leap forward with Brady throwing him the ball. And, by all accounts, Hogan appears to have taken another gigantic leap forward this year in training camp. His cap hit is very reasonable, $3M in 2017 and $3.5M in 2018. Very importantly, he is only 28. He has fit in so seamlessly with Brady and the Patriots, I could see him agreeing to a moderately reasonable contract to stay with the Pats after 2018.

In contrast, Amendola turns 32 in November of this season, and will turn 33 during the 2018 season. Edelman is 31, although it is encouraging to see him adopt some of TB's workout and diet regimen. Cooks is only 23, but his cap hit rises to $9M next year and everything I've read indicates he will be looking for a giant payday after 2018, and it remains to be seen if the Patriots will give it to him.

So: Hogan is still young, has a reasonable contract, fits New England like a glove, and he seems to be really coming into his own now. I would really be shocked to see him dealt.

 

[Nehalem]

Stop with this crazy talk about trading receivers, remember when the offense was Josh Boyce, KT and Dobson.

Come on now. If they had managed to stay healthy maybe the Pats beat Denver in the AFCCG

 

[Tony2046]

Stop with this crazy talk about trading receivers, remember when the offense was Josh Boyce, KT and Dobson.

There isn't any need to compromise a potentially record breaking offense to fortify an already solid defense.

BB will find a way to address the issue without sacrificing any offensive depth.

It's a complimentary game. The defense just needs to allow less points than the offense can score. Having a top secondary and a solid DL pretty much ensures that. Solving the DE depth whether it's now or over time as a couple of rookies grow will just add to its dominance.

IMO.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

Stop with this crazy talk about trading receivers, remember when the offense was Josh Boyce, KT and Dobson.

What brady did in 2013 with those WR corps is nothing short of greatness

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

Marcus Cannon is a monster. I cannot believe at one time he was this forums whipping boy

Don't know what you're talking about ( selective amnesia). We've always been behind him......Although for some that meant pushing him off the cliff......
He ought to have Dante on permanent Christmas/Birthday/Anniversary card list because whatever Mr. Scarnecchia taught him, it took......

 

[scott99]

We now have five guys who can legitimately stretch the field - Cooks, Gronk, Hogan, Mitchell and, to a bit of a lesser degree, Jules. This offense will be more fun to watch than '07... Mark my words.

I don't know man, that 2007 offense was insane. It was video game like. Never saw anything like it.

 

[Don Calhoun]

This is my favorite news of the day.

Who are we to believe? Howe or Giardi?