There's a chance Zappe starts over Brissett

[Froob]

This is giving very “Bernie can still win” energy

 

[Rob0729]

The only way Zappe starts over Brissett is either Brissett is injured and cannot play or Zappe is cut or traded and he starts with his new team and Maye beats out Brissett for the starting job.

I give Zappe about a 10-20% chance of being with the team on the practice squad and about a 5% chance of being on the final 53 man roster.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

0.0% chance that Zappe will start over Brissett, if he even makes the roster, unless JB suffers an injury late in training camp AND they have a very compelling reason to not start Maye week 1.

So you're agreeing with me that there's a chance Zappe starts! That scenario was actually discussed (another poster brought it up). There are a few other injury scenarios that work too, but those result in Zappe starting after the season begins. For example, Maye goes into the season as QB1, gets a serious injury after being blindsided because our LT sucks (or otherwise). Brissett gets the call and gets injured a few games later because we just have bad luck. Now what? Rolling with Milton? I really doubt they do that. He's not even ready to be an NFL QB. If Zappe is still on the roster or PS, he gets the call. The real fun will be if the Pats cut ties with Zappe and he gets picked up elsewhere. Now they have to find a vet who knows the AVP system or run a restricted offense.

The best part about this thread is that poster after poster thinks I'm making an argument FOR Zappe to start, which has made it entertaining and spicy. I don't want Zappe to start. I don't even care if the name "Zappe" is replaced by some other QB they acquire after cutting him. I do not think he's a starter, nor do I think he's particularly talented. But it is perplexing to me that people dislike Zappe as a player so much that they make indefensible arguments as to why he's still with the team ("camp arm", for example). They discount realistic scenarios in which "Zappe" could end up starting games this season, and if they don't end up with a "Zappe" on the team or the PS, they could be in a spot where a JAG backup with no experience in the AVP system is the starting QB.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

Zappe could be there because
1) We try to have a camp fodder #4 QB for camp.
2) It cost nothing. Maybe, we can trade him for a 6th or 7th before or during camp.
3) He is free insurance against a Brissette injury, if they can get Milton ready to be the backup until Maye is ready.
4) Zappe is a backup going into the season unless Maye and Milton are ready to play.
5) Zappe is the #4 going into the season, there until either Maye or Milton is ready for prime time.

I agree with all except #1. With the new PS changes, having a "camp fodder" arm is pointless. You want a player that can learn the system, get on the PS, and at least not be a laughingstock should he get the call if there's a run of injuries. If you think Zappe is that terrible, then you find another guy who at least has some potential to not be Zappe-level terrible. And if they believe that Zappe is that terrible, then they need to get that guy in there soon so he can learn the system.

As I've said elsewhere, it seems clear that the team's evaluation is higher than many on this forum who believe he is a garbage player who shouldn't be in the NFL. He wouldn't be on the team, even at this stage. He's getting reps, coaching and experience in the new system, and those reps, etc., could be going to another guy who isn't a train wreck. It may be they haven't found anyone better yet, and he gets the boot later in the preseason. It will be fascinating to see how this plays out (at least for me).

 

[sb1]

Zappe was worse than Jones last season. Which is remarkable cause that was a really…and I do mean really low bar to go under. Somehow he did. His teammates seem to like him though and that could be why he’s sticking around for now.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

LOL

Those who deny his obvious greatness?

Come on man.

Please don't put words in my mouth. It's easy to win debates when you pretend people have said things they haven't.

I've said in other places here that Zappe is at best (his ceiling) a decent backup who has a long career in the NFL, bouncing around from team to team (like Hoyer). He might even be a shade better than Hoyer. That's the best he turns out. I'm not even saying that's his trajectory.

The deniers are folks who say he isn't an NFL QB, there's no way he makes the 53, there are absolutely no scenarios in which he could start, that he's total garbage, that he's just a "camp arm", etc.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

Zappe was worse than Jones last season. Which is remarkable cause that was a really…and I do mean really low bar to go under. Somehow he did. His teammates seem to like him though and that could be why he’s sticking around for now.

There's no question Mac Jones is more talented than Zappe. Perhaps his teammates and some fans preferred his play over Jones because Zappe at least seemed not to quit. The results were similar (losing games), but Jones was really tough to watch as he went into a fetal position under pressure over and over. It reminds me of the situation with Eason and Grogan back in the mid eighties. No doubt Eason had more talent and ability, but he was a coward in the pocket, and Grogan was a gamer. He'd take the hits and keep playing.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

If your standard is that anyone who can stay on a roster, but isn’t good enough to win with when called upon, is an NFL QB then you’re right, every QB in the NFL is an NFL QB. Technically speaking that’s correct. If the standard is that an NFL QB is one you can reliably start and win with then Zappe isn’t one, and that’s my standard. And imo Joe Milton has the potential to turn into an NFL QB, and Bailey Zappe doesn’t. So I believe they should release Zappe and keep Milton.

Okay. I think that's more like the definition of an NFL starting QB, but okay. It's restrictive, because you can event point to existing starters who don't meet it, but different strokes for...

I wonder how different the thread would have been if I had substituted Zappe with "Backup QB" (not named Maye and Milton, because obviously the calculus is very different with either of those players). Zappe is so polarizing that I think logic goes out the window sometimes. But, at least it was a spicy thread and generated interest. Things have been slow lately.

 

[PatsFan2]

Zappe could be there because
1) We try to have a camp fodder #4 QB for camp.
2) It cost nothing. Maybe, we can trade him for a 6th or 7th before or during camp.
3) He is free insurance against a Brissette injury, if they can get Milton ready to be the backup until Maye is ready.
4) Zappe is a backup going into the season unless Maye and Milton are ready to play.
5) Zappe is the #4 going into the season, there until either Maye or Milton is ready for prime time.

We are not carrying Four QB's just to keep Zappe... Maye shoud be ready for prime time Milton have all the time in the world. The only way we keep Zappe is if Biscuit have a season ending injury.

 

[PatsFan2]

If your standard is that anyone who can stay on a roster, but isn’t good enough to win with when called upon, is an NFL QB then you’re right, every QB in the NFL is an NFL QB. Technically speaking that’s correct. If the standard is that an NFL QB is one you can reliably start and win with then Zappe isn’t one, and that’s my standard. And imo Joe Milton has the potential to turn into an NFL QB, and Bailey Zappe doesn’t. So I believe they should release Zappe and keep Milton.

Oh they will Mayo told me he's just trying to get a Conditional UDFA for Zappe.

 

[Rob0729]

There is always a chance that Zappe could be the starter this year. But there is also a chance I win Powerball or get eaten by a shark.

Zappe's ceiling is a solid back up. The problem is I don't think his fans or he can accept that. He could have a long career and make a lot of money as a back up if he accepts his role. He just isn't good enough to be a starter except in an emergency.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

Yes, if Brissett is injured, Zappe will start Game 1. However, I don't think that this is the subject of this thread. Some folks think that Zappe is competing with Brissett for his starting spot, which I don't think is the case. I think that is more likely that Zappe is cut before camp than he is competing to start.

I agree that Zappe (or some other guy they acquire in time if they end up not liking Zappe for the role) will start in that case. It seems like a no-brainer for me, but there's been diversity of opinion on that point.

I don't think that's the case either, but there have been mixed signals on whether the starting job is up for grabs.

Whether Zappe is cut is a big unknown to me. There's information we lack. The biggest questions for me:

* Will they carry only 3 QBs? If they carry 4, Zappe or another backup with experience will be on the roster.
* If they carry 3, are they willing to roll with Milton as QB3? If they aren't willing, then Zappe (or another vet) makes the roster. If they are willing, Zappe's fate is sealed, and he probably makes the PS. Milton's special status complicates this.

 

[rkarp1]

There is always a chance that Zappe could be the starter this year. But there is also a chance I win Powerball or get eaten by a shark.

Zappe's ceiling is a solid back up. The problem is I don't think his fans or he can accept that. He could have a long career and make a lot of money as a back up if he accepts his role. He just isn't good enough to be a starter except in an emergency.

I cannot see a scenario other than injury where Zippy gets the reps to show out. the other 3 need reps, and giving them to Zappe seems wasteful.

 

[rkarp1]

I agree that Zappe (or some other guy they acquire in time if they end up not liking Zappe for the role) will start in that case. It seems like a no-brainer for me, but there's been diversity of opinion on that point.

I don't think that's the case either, but there have been mixed signals on whether the starting job is up for grabs.

Whether Zappe is cut is a big unknown to me. There's information we lack. The biggest questions for me:

* Will they carry only 3 QBs? If they carry 4, Zappe or another backup with experience will be on the roster.
* If they carry 3, are they willing to roll with Milton as QB3? If they aren't willing, then Zappe (or another vet) makes the roster. If they are willing, Zappe's fate is sealed, and he probably makes the PS. Milton's special status complicates this.

if Brissett is injured, seemingly Maye is next in line, no? wouldn't he offer the best chance to win, seeing as he will have received many more snaps in practice over Zappe? in theory, through the summer, Zappe would be the lesser experienced QB in this offense.

 

[Wozzy]

There’s. chance Maye starts over all of them… why are we making proclamations in shorts and tees?

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

I cannot see a scenario other than injury where Zippy gets the reps to show out. the other 3 need reps, and giving them to Zappe seems wasteful.

Right, so you don't believe Mayo. Neither do I. But, it's not so clear cut.

I doubt -- at this stage of Milton's development -- that the Pats would prefer to put him into a game over a more experienced backup. But there are people on this board that like Milton more than Maye, bedazzled by his arm strength and overlooking his serious deficits (e.g., accuracy, willingness to use his legs). So prioritizing reps for Milton might not be what the team actually does, because they need the guy who has a higher chance of playing *this year* to get his work in. Milton is a project.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

There’s. chance Maye starts over all of them… why are we making proclamations in shorts and tees?

Because the threads have been sparse and boring. And yes, Maye could start. I doubt he will unless they have absolutely no other choice to field a legitimate offense.

 

[Wozzy]

Because the threads have been sparse and boring. And yes, Maye could start. I doubt it will unless they have absolutely no other choice to field a legitimate offense.

Brissett was a legitimate QB last season against the Jets D, they were pretty good. He can start until Maye is ready.

Maye isn’t taking the starting job in shorts and tees, he’ll take it by making massive strides in camp and preseason. It’s way too early for bold declarations.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Please don't put words in my mouth. It's easy to win debates when you pretend people have said things they haven't.

I've said in other places here that Zappe is at best (his ceiling) a decent backup who has a long career in the NFL, bouncing around from team to team (like Hoyer). He might even be a shade better than Hoyer. That's the best he turns out. I'm not even saying that's his trajectory.

The deniers are folks who say he isn't an NFL QB, there's no way he makes the 53, there are absolutely no scenarios in which he could start, that he's total garbage, that he's just a "camp arm", etc.

I am not pretending anything. You stated that there are a group of people who should be labeled as "Zappe deniers"

that's freakin' hilarious

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

I am not pretending anything. You stated that there are a group of people who should be labeled as "Zappe deniers"

that's freakin' hilarious

Oh, I thought so too, thanks