We're on to the OFF-Season

[1960Pats]

I respect your opinion and the reasons you give to defend it, (and I think you are right about Bill keeping a close eye on the college game and continues to learn from it), BUT I couldn't disagree more.

In an ideal world, every quality QB is better when he can throw in rhythm from the pocket. You think that misdirection of the RPO is the only way run games can survive, yet that ISN'T what we saw in tonight's games. It was the run game that DOMINATED both games. But regardless of tonight, the Pats power run game is EXACTLY how you do combat the speed of defenses and 240lb OLB. A well coordinated zone blocking scheme will do it too, but it's hard to do without the right coaching. Patricia and Yates all grew up in the Pats power system, and that's ultimately what they fell back on to a good degree of success.

What I HOPE will happen with the new hires to the offense (and I HOPE it is more than just an OC) is that we will take whatever talent emerges from next years team and go back to what we do best 1. run the ball 2. move the chains 3. throw well to our TE's and RB's.
THAT was the formula that worked for SO many years and WILL (I believe) continue to be successful with better planning, discipline, and execution. James White was averaging over 500yds per year for 6 years and for 2 years over 600yds I was thinking all year what happened to our 3rd down back? Didn't you?

As to the RPO, there are things you can incorporate into our offense. Mac has the innate athletic ability (4.8/7.0 speed and quickness), but has yet to develop the instincts to use them. He may never develop them, but he may. 2 years is a very short window for a QB. D Jones has been considered a bust for most of his first 3 years, now he's a rising star (ntil tonight perhaps)

I love the running game. When I watch runners go into the line I find myself leaning in their direction from my seat.

I'm not sure that Bill is following college ball to make changes in the NYFL. I think he's just looking for the inside scoop on players.

This year, just like most years, it's the top players at key positions that are here at the end. In the past it included more running teams but the passing game has been the emphasis for a while. It's great to see the running game back, though I'm not sure that I'd want my QB to be a runner.

If the Pats can get coaches in here who know what they're doing and don't screw up, then the offense could be a force with just a little tweaking.

Normally I like to give a QB a little time before I make a judgement, but this year feels like Mac deserves a do over of some kind. There were an incredible number of miscues by the team (him included) but he still helped lead the team to within a whisker of the playoffs.

 

[Patsgofor4]

Pats aren’t going to draft a RB in the first round after Mondre’s breakout year but please Baby Jesus keep Bijan Robinson out of the AFC East, and ideally out of the AFC as a whole. Atlanta would be a good spot for him, or Detriot or Green Bay.

 

[Grogan14]

Exactly why are you so enamored by the so called "RPO" craze.

First of all in 2020 Bill was able to use so called RPO concepts for Cam. It's not like the current system can't adjust to this look.

Second, what is it about the RPO that is better than what we have. The problems last year were more out structure and execution or the lack thereof, than the general system. We actually ran the ball pretty well. What we NEED is a more efficient and consistent passing attack that is well coordinated and executed. Hopefully BOB and any other new coaches on the offense will improve that problem.

BTW - I use BOB in the present sense, but I would be TOTALLY shocked if he isn't named by Tuesday after this weekends' games..

Why does OBrien want an OC gig with Patriots when he could probably snag a HC job with Arizona or Cardinals?

 

[Ross12]

Why does OBrien want an OC gig with Patriots when he could probably snag a HC job with Arizona or Cardinals?

What other NFL franchise is in Arizona besides the Cardinals?

 

[Wozzy]

Why does OBrien want an OC gig with Patriots when he could probably snag a HC job with Arizona or Cardinals?

Has he been asked to interview, not from what I’ve read?

The Patriots job would be a great gig, they have a QB he’s familiar with, lots of young talent and resources to improve and a head coach that will step down in the not too distant future.

 

[1960Pats]

Has he been asked to interview, not from what I’ve read?

The Patriots job would be a great gig, they have a QB he’s familiar with, lots of young talent and resources to improve and a head coach that will step down in the not too distant future.

Frank Reich might be a good choice.

 

[venecol]

You think that misdirection of the RPO is the only way run games can survive, yet that ISN'T what we saw in tonight's games. It was the run game that DOMINATED both games.

PHI run game is based on RPO schemes. I saw many times NYG LBs totaly confused on where the ball was going because of it.

What I HOPE will happen with the new hires to the offense (and I HOPE it is more than just an OC) is that we will take whatever talent emerges from next years team and go back to what we do best 1. run the ball 2. move the chains 3. throw well to our TE's and RB's.
THAT was the formula that worked for SO many years and WILL (I believe) continue to be successful with better planning, discipline, and execution.

All due respect Ken but that system worked great w/ Brady/Welker/Edelman/White/Gronk. Who do we have that can match their production? We need to stop living in the past or start bringing in elite talent. Something has to give.

 

[venecol]

This. EP is not a particular collection of plays forming a 'system'. It is a language developed in which to efficiently describe any play from whatever 'system'.

But it's complicated. We've heard it from numerous players. Good players. Including Jules.

 

[venecol]

Was the suspension lifted? But there is still a grievance?

They docked 2 pay checks so the grievance was filed even though the suspension has been lifted.

 

[State]

What evidence do you have that Steve has a weakness dealing with players? He's been a coach in some capacity since 2012 and this is the first I am hearing this.

It’s been reported that as co-DC he calls the game day X’s and O’s while Mayo implements the plans for the upcoming opponent with the defense when he’s not coaching the linebackers.

We probably have the least talented group of linebackers since Belichick has been here, especially in the middle.

Plus, you have to admit players respect coaches who played the game. Didn’t use to be this bad. Didn’t we have a player complain about this with the safeties coach?

And Stevie’s rapport with the players is far less than that of Mayo. That’s why we have this unusual setup in the first place.

 

[Wozzy]

PHI run game is based on RPO schemes. I saw many times NYG LBs totaly confused on where the ball was going because of it.

Jalen Hurts runs a 4.4 forty, we have to be realistic about what more RPO plays will look like with our QB’s.

Mac and Zappe are as fast as Mahomes… does he look like he’s struggling?

All due respect Ken but that system worked great w/ Brady/Welker/Edelman/White/Gronk. Who do we have that can match their production? We need to stop living in the past or start bringing in elite talent. Something has to give.

We didn’t have Andy Reid this season, we didn’t even have McDaniels… we had Bozo the clown. It wasn’t due to a lack of weapons. Outside of Kelce, the Chiefs WR’s are nothing special.

 

[State]

But it's complicated. We've heard it from numerous players. Good players. Including Jules.

Yeah. It’s concept based. It puts a lot of cognitive pressure on receivers to identify the defense and respond accordingly. Brady thrived in it.

I wish we could listen to Randy Moss discuss it. He was a seasoned vet when he came here. I wonder how’d he’d have done with it right out of Marshall.

 

[Wozzy]

Frank Reich might be a good choice.

Not saying you’re wrong, but Reich comes from the west coast school. Obie runs our system.

 

[State]

Outside of Kelce, the Chiefs WR’s are nothing special.

Kadarius Toney or whatever his name is was a massive disappointment in NJ but is a first round talent. And he’s reborn in the rathole of KC.

 

[venecol]

Jalen Hurts runs a 4.4 forty, we have to be realistic about what more RPO plays will look like with our QB’s.

Sure but the response was to Ken disagreeing w/ RPOs.

Mac and Zappe are as fast as Mahomes… does he look like he’s struggling?

You're not seriously putting Mac/Zappe in the same sentence as Mahomes. Are you? Lol

We didn’t have Andy Reid this season, we didn’t even have McDaniels… we had Bozo the clown. It wasn’t due to a lack of weapons. Outside of Kelce, the Chiefs WR’s are nothing special.

What does my response have to do w/ KC? It was in response to Ken attributing the success of our system based on the dynasty days. Those days are gone.

 

[Wozzy]

Kadarius Toney or whatever his name is was a massive disappointment in NJ but is a first round talent. And he’s reborn in the rathole of KC.

Thornton and Marcus Jones are first round talents. Henry is one of the best TE’s in the league when healthy. Parker once put up 1200 yards and 9 TD’s with Fitzpatrick as his QB. We had one of the most talented RB rooms in the NFL this season.

None of this ^ matters if you’re the most penalized offense in the NFL, if opponents are calling out your plays presnap and you’re coached by a moron.

The Bucs went from a top three offense the previous two seasons to the 26th lowest scoring team without Arians. Coaching matters, talent matters, talent without coaching is useless… look at Kadarius Toney’s time with the Giants if you need another example.

 

[Wozzy]

Sure but the response was to Ken disagreeing w/ RPOs.

What does my response have to do w/ KC? It was in response to Ken attributing the success of our system based on the dynasty days. Those days are gone.

Traditional offenses still work. Staffords won a ring last year, Brady the year before, both of those guys are statues.

When does this utopia of running QB’s get here… they’ve been predicting it for the last decade or more?

You're not seriously putting Mac/Zappe in the same sentence as Mahomes. Are you? Lol

Who was Mahomes when he was exiting Texas Tech, who was Brock Purdy before he played a snap. Stop pretending you can see the future, you can’t.

These guys don’t have to become Mahomes, they could become Purdy or another solid QB and this team could still win rings.

 

[Ring 6]

Has he been asked to interview, not from what I’ve read?

The Patriots job would be a great gig, they have a QB he’s familiar with, lots of young talent and resources to improve and a head coach that will step down in the not too distant future.

He hasn’t, it’s a “he wanted to interview ossenfort so maybe that alone means he is ossenfort choice for HC” rumor.

 

[Ring 6]

It’s been reported that as co-DC he calls the game day X’s and O’s while Mayo implements the plans for the upcoming opponent with the defense when he’s not coaching the linebackers.

We probably have the least talented group of linebackers since Belichick has been here, especially in the middle.

Plus, you have to admit players respect coaches who played the game. Didn’t use to be this bad. Didn’t we have a player complain about this with the safeties coach?

And Stevie’s rapport with the players is far less than that of Mayo. That’s why we have this unusual setup in the first place.

It hasn’t “been reported” it was written that one writer thinks that mayos camp believes he “has more to do with coordinating and sb calls the plays” that single unsourced perception has taken a life if it’s own on this board, evidently as a back door way to trash BB.

 

[Ring 6]

But it's complicated. We've heard it from numerous players. Good players. Including Jules.

EP isn’t complicated. The Patriot sight read passing game is “complicated” because it is based upon option routes which require the QB and the receiver to see the same thing. Dummies can’t adapt.