Patriots Minicamp 6-8-2022

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Before the draft we had big arguments about this. By draft time most had agreed that Mac was ok at 15 although there was considerable complaining by many here, not mentioning names, who thought Bill was an idiot for not trading up to get Justin Fields

I have no problem admitting Mac wouldn't have been my first pick. I liked him, didn't love him.

We'll see this year. Year 2 is probably a QB most important in terms of a jump. Everything is set up for him. He hit the lottery in terms of landing spot and targets compared to his peers. So we'll know real quick if he's a legit top 10 QB.

I guess that's the big question I have. I knew he could play and would be "good" in that Kirk Cousins type of way but unless you have a legit top 10 QB you're hoping to catch lightening in a bottle. So from that standpoint it's still very much a wait n see with Mac.

Also consider the people in this discussion if you would. Most really have no clue what they're talking about. Mac was praised up n down last year and he should have been. He had a really good year. Those same people will then tell you how much Tua sucks without realizing their stats were very similar in a 16 game sample.

I've very happy Mac is here. I'm a Pats fan before anything else so our success is all I care about. That said I feel like I've been on the money in terms of who Mac is as a player. Some of my pre-draft post on him were to a T. So I'm happy he's here even if he wasn't my first choice but still waiting on the top 10, franchise QB.

He's been great though. Like taking care of himself, training. Making the rounds in Boston. Me and my kid got a pic with him at the B's game a few weeks back. He's done all the right things. I'm a fan.

 

[borisman]

I have no problem admitting Mac wouldn't have been my first pick. I liked him, didn't love him.

We'll see this year. Year 2 is probably a QB most important in terms of a jump. Everything is set up for him. He hit the lottery in terms of landing spot and targets compared to his peers. So we'll know real quick if he's a legit top 10 QB.

I guess that's the big question I have. I knew he could play and would be "good" in that Kirk Cousins type of way but unless you have a legit top 10 QB you're hoping to catch lightening in a bottle. So from that standpoint it's still very much a wait n see with Mac.

Also consider the people in this discussion if you would. Most really have no clue what they're talking about. Mac was praised up n down last year and he should have been. He had a really good year. Those same people will then tell you how much Tua sucks without realizing their stats were very similar in a 16 game sample.

I've very happy Mac is here. I'm a Pats fan before anything else so our success is all I care about. That said I feel like I've been on the money in terms of who Mac is as a player. Some of my pre-draft post on him were to a T. So I'm happy he's here even if he wasn't my first choice but still waiting on the top 10, franchise QB.

He's been great though. Like taking care of himself, training. Making the rounds in Boston. Me and my kid got a pic with him at the B's game a few weeks back. He's done all the right things. I'm a fan.

How do you mean, BGC? Pre-draft or as the draft unfolded? I as well wanted someone else to fall to us, like Jaycee Horn or Micah Parsons. But when Mac was there it was easy pickings. If Mac was gone I would have been begging for a trade down. I know you liked Zaven Collins so maybe that is who you would have picked instead of QB5?

 

[RobertWeathers]

I feel like he pretty routinely cancels the last day of mini-camp, as long as he feels like everyone took the first two days seriously, almost like a reward. I think the rain is just a convenient excuse.

Yea I think you are right.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

How do you mean, BGC? Pre-draft or as the draft unfolded? I as well wanted someone else to fall to us, like Jaycee Horn or Micah Parsons. But when Mac was there it was easy pickings. If Mac was gone I would have been begging for a trade down. I know you liked Zaven Collins so maybe that is who you would have picked instead of QB5?

Oh I get what you're saying. Yes pre-draft mostly, as I'd rather gamble on a QB > everything else but I loved Newsome, JOK, Stokes, Phillips etc too

I like Mac and happy he's here. I also feel that "here" is the ideal spot and that's just as important for 99% of these QB's not named Brady, Manning etc. I honestly think most of us would be happy if Fields, Lance or Wilson were here but that's speculation.

Again I like Mac and love how he's taking command of the position. Just know you have to be a freak (Rogers, Young, new school - Mahomes, Allen, Lamar) or a cyborg/terminator (Brady, Manning, New school- Herbert) Hoping we have a terminator!

 

[PatsFan2]

I'm sort of having deja vu to 2007. Caldwell was clearly our best wr in 06 and we let him go like yesterday's news when Randy, Stallworth etc came along the following year. Harry is most likely a goner but the biggest surprise would be if Meyers gets pushed off the roster. I think some shocking cuts are going to happen this year on offense and defense.

I would really like to see Tre Nixons' skillset on display to see what he excels at. We already know what Meyes is all about. Tre Nixon's bio is pretty good up to his injury the Pats may have stole one here.

Tre Nixon Draft and Combine Prospect Profile | NFL.com

www.nfl.com

 

[PatsFan2]

There’s one every year, it usually carries over the preseason. Bam Childress was a hero some time back.

Tre Nixon has talent, good speed and mobility. He had a long way to go after his rookie year but it sounds good so far.

It's great to hear he's clicking with Mac already kinda makes you go Hmmmm poor Harry.

 

[PatsFan2]

Nixon's size and athleticism is very similar to Agholor, Tre leaving college was about ten pounds lighter but he had good strength for a WR. Both have low 4.4 speed, with similar explosion and mobility.

Hopefully he is a better route runner and understands the game better than Agholor did as a young player... and Nixon did as a rookie, where he looked lost.

Super-weapons more often than not get developed, they don't just appear out of the mists.

Athletic comparisons:

Nelson Agholor
6'0" 200
4.42 Forty
12 Reps
36.5 Vert
125" Broad
4.34 Shuttle
6.83 Cone

Tre Nixon
6'0" 187
4.44 Forty
18 Reps
35.5 Vert
125" Broad
4.25 Shuttle
6.81 Cone

Stefon Diggs
6'0" 195
4.46 Forty
11 Reps
35.0 Vert
115" Broad
4.11 Shuttle
7.03 Cone

Malcolm Mitchell
6'0" 198
4.45 Forty
15 Reps
36.0 Vert
129" Broad
4.34 Shuttle
6.94 Cone

His freshman year before he left Ole Miss he was on a squad with A.J. Brown, Van Jefferson, D.K. Metcalf and Dawson Knox. So obviously his coach could recruit weapons.

The more I read up on Tre Nixon I think we may have stole one here. Glad he had some familiarity with the system last year that's going to be a plus.

 

[Wozzy]

Nobody thought he was a reach at 15. He was the 5th QB taken in what was considered a strong QB draft. Everyone said the reason he dropped was his "lack of athleticism". From what I can tell he's a late bloomer and has a ton of upside growth, with a competitive chip in his shoulder. Reminds me of someone else

I remember draft day and the draft day threads, there were people screaming when the Bears moved ahead and took Fields, calling BB a chump for getting scooped. There were people saying "take Mac at 15," there were people saying "don't take Mac at 15," there were people who said BB took the 5th best QB out of desperation. I post on multiple forums so it's possible my recollection is not all based on this one site, but the malaise was present... and the "weak arm" nonsense has been ever present. A lot of people look foolish for betting against Mac, I don't expect them to step forward and admit it.

 

[Wozzy]

If you count Slater as a WR sure. You're historically accurate.

Without Slater there were 5 WR's who contributed in 2021... on average they usually carry 5... without Slater.

I don't see them carrying 6 without including Slater, no matter how much the game has changed.

 

[Wozzy]

It's great to hear he's clicking with Mac already kinda makes you go Hmmmm poor Harry.

Fk Harry... the guy's soft. Doughboy.

Apparently Mac and Tre Nixon are buddies.

 

[Wozzy]

The more I read up on Tre Nixon I think we may have stole one here. Glad he had some familiarity with the system last year that's going to be a plus.

He could make Agholor or Meyers expendable and save the team a bunch of money and cap space.

 

[Pats2000]

I remember draft day and the draft day threads, there were people screaming when the Bears moved ahead and took Fields, calling BB a chump for getting scooped. There were people saying "take Mac at 15," there were people saying "don't take Mac at 15," there were people who said BB took the 5th best QB out of desperation. I post on multiple forums so it's possible my recollection is not all based on this one site, but the malaise was present... and the "weak arm" nonsense has been ever present. A lot of people look foolish for betting against Mac, I don't expect them to step forward and admit it.

I watched a lot of the mainstream sports media leading up to that draft. I dont remember anyone making the assertion, except for Rex Ryan after the fact. Especially when Mac was on his first few games. Because you know rookies always come out slinging the ball 50 yards downfield

 

[Wozzy]

I watched a lot of the mainstream sports media leading up to that draft. I dont remember anyone making the assertion, except for Rex Ryan after the fact. Especially when Mac was on his first few games. Because you know rookies always come out slinging the ball 50 yards downfield

So you're suggesting "Mac has a weak arm" was all in my imagination?

 

[long distance]

I have no problem admitting Mac wouldn't have been my first pick. I liked him, didn't love him.

We'll see this year. Year 2 is probably a QB most important in terms of a jump. Everything is set up for him. He hit the lottery in terms of landing spot and targets compared to his peers. So we'll know real quick if he's a legit top 10 QB.

I guess that's the big question I have. I knew he could play and would be "good" in that Kirk Cousins type of way but unless you have a legit top 10 QB you're hoping to catch lightening in a bottle. So from that standpoint it's still very much a wait n see with Mac.

Also consider the people in this discussion if you would. Most really have no clue what they're talking about. Mac was praised up n down last year and he should have been. He had a really good year. Those same people will then tell you how much Tua sucks without realizing their stats were very similar in a 16 game sample.

I've very happy Mac is here. I'm a Pats fan before anything else so our success is all I care about. That said I feel like I've been on the money in terms of who Mac is as a player. Some of my pre-draft post on him were to a T. So I'm happy he's here even if he wasn't my first choice but still waiting on the top 10, franchise QB.

He's been great though. Like taking care of himself, training. Making the rounds in Boston. Me and my kid got a pic with him at the B's game a few weeks back. He's done all the right things. I'm a fan.

Nice post BGC.

Every team, FO/HC, have different ideas, requests for a franchise QB. So i dont think its about Mac being top 10 QB - whatever that even means since the top listings of various “experts“ are all over the place, then there's year to year etc.

I do agree this is a key year for Mac to establish himself as NE “franchise“ QB - in terms of what that means for one person alone - BB.
BB's reserved offseason - keeping all giant future cap almost intact - probably speaks to that as well.

And even when he fully convinces BB - his “franchise“ status will be tested yearly as long as BB is here.

agreed - so far so good : )

 

[Pats2000]

So you're suggesting "Mac has a weak arm" was all in my imagination?

None of them said his 15 spot was a reach. And many of these sports shows have one person take a negative take and the other a positive take, regardless if they think that or not.

Some of that criticism was warranted too. No one said there wasn't any criticism, but people weren't calling it a reach that he was the 5th best QB on draft night

 

[Wozzy]

None of them said his 15 spot was a reach. And many of these sports shows have one person take a negative take and the other a positive take, regardless if they think that or not.

Some of that criticism was warranted too. No one said there wasn't any criticism, but people weren't calling it a reach that he was the 5th best QB on draft night

Where is the draft day thread?

 

[Deus Irae]

It makes him feel better about the fact the Patriots seem to be on the right path, without Tom.

Please explain this theory. Most current thinking is that they've actually fallen farther back in the pack over the course of the offseason to date, so I'd love to hear your take on how that's incorrect.

 

[Wozzy]

Please explain this theory. Most current thinking is that they've actually fallen farther back in the pack over the course of the offseason to date, so I'd love to hear your take on how that's incorrect.

Because football games aren't won on paper.

 

[Wozzy]

None of them said his 15 spot was a reach. And many of these sports shows have one person take a negative take and the other a positive take, regardless if they think that or not.

Some of that criticism was warranted too. No one said there wasn't any criticism, but people weren't calling it a reach that he was the 5th best QB on draft night

I found the game day thread, the "don't take Mac" thoughts start emerging around page 44, I'll take you there...

DRAFT DAY DISCUSSION - OFFICIAL 2021 NFL DRAFT - ROUND 1 - Discussion Thread

If the Pats really wanted Fields, they could have topped the deal that the Eagles gave Dallas. Bears gave up too much. If Fields panned out then those picks they traded don’t matter

www.patsfans.com

 

[Pats2000]

I found the game day thread, the "don't take Mac" thoughts start emerging around page 44, I'll take you there...

DRAFT DAY DISCUSSION - OFFICIAL 2021 NFL DRAFT - ROUND 1 - Discussion Thread

If the Pats really wanted Fields, they could have topped the deal that the Eagles gave Dallas. Bears gave up too much. If Fields panned out then those picks they traded don’t matter

www.patsfans.com

What? Why are we going to individual Patsfans posters. Yeah I'm sure there were plenty of uninformed people out there saying Mac wasn't worth pick 15. Show me the consensus or even the media outliers that said he wasn't at least the 5th best QB in the draft.