Debate Brady vs Belichick?

[203Pat]

So your argument is
1) HE won 6 championships all by himself
2) Keeping him as his QB and making no moves to even bring in competition is the coach signaling a lack of commitment
3) he “never maximized his value” which was because he valued winning more than a few extra dollars but NOW that changed
4) with no competition on the roster he wanted the second year guaranteed. Why? He was getting the second year any way. The only way he wasn’t was if he suffered a career ending injury.
So your belief is that suddenly Brady changed everything he believed in because he feared he would have a career ending injury and not get paid for the first year he couldn’t play. Tom Brady. Really?

1) No Andy, I didn't say all by himself.
2) Not committing to paying him pay 2019 was a lack of commitment.
3) He valued winning as well as having a good team around him. The Bucs didn't pay him a ton. He is the 14th highest paid QB and playing like a top 5 QB. He took less than market value but wasn't going to play for peanuts. He also wanted more than a one year deal.
4) I don't know why you keep saying competition on the roster. He wanted a multi year deal. I don't know where the disconnect is.

My belief is pretty simple. He wanted a commitment for 2019 as well as 2020 and Bill was only willing to commit to him for one year. I am not sure why this is so difficult. I am also not sure why I let you pull me into this argument so I can bang my head against the wall.

 

[Ring 6]

1) No Andy, I didn't say all by himself.
2) Not committing to paying him pay 2019 was a lack of commitment.
3) He valued winning as well as having a good team around him. The Bucs didn't pay him a ton. He is the 14th highest paid QB and playing like a top 5 QB. He took less than market value but wasn't going to play for peanuts. He also wanted more than a one year deal.
4) I don't know why you keep saying competition on the roster. He wanted a multi year deal. I don't know where the disconnect is.

My belief is pretty simple. He wanted a commitment for 2019 as well as 2020 and Bill was only willing to commit to him for one year. I am not sure why this is so difficult. I am also not sure why I let you pull me into this argument so I can bang my head against the wall.

1) you implied they owed him something because “he won the team 6 championships.”
2) They were willing to pay him beyond 2019. They mutually negotiated a contract, and it appears it was Brady who wanted the out. The team didn’t request not being able to use the tag.
3) he didn’t give the patriots a chance to sign him. He took the first (only?) other offer and told the patriots he was gone, don’t bother trying.
4) he didn’t need a multi year deal because he was clearly the whole here. Again the only way he wasn’t back again in 2021 was if he sustained a career ending injury, 2 year deal or not. So it boils down to you believe his motivation was to get paid an extra year of injured. Despite his only known comments being “I want to have fun” and “im gone and there is nothing you can do to keep me here”
He signed the contract that made 2020 and 2021 voidable. He made them include not tagging him. You have no clue that it wasn’t his choice to not include real years for 20 and 21, what we do know is in 20 he took the first (only?) other offer and did not give the patriots a chance to make an offer.
That’s a guy choosing to leave not being forced out.

 

[203Pat]

1) you implied they owed him something because “he won the team 6 championships.”
2) They were willing to pay him beyond 2019. They mutually negotiated a contract, and it appears it was Brady who wanted the out. The team didn’t request not being able to use the tag.
3) he didn’t give the patriots a chance to sign him. He took the first (only?) other offer and told the patriots he was gone, don’t bother trying.
4) he didn’t need a multi year deal because he was clearly the whole here. Again the only way he wasn’t back again in 2021 was if he sustained a career ending injury, 2 year deal or not. So it boils down to you believe his motivation was to get paid an extra year of injured. Despite his only known comments being “I want to have fun” and “im gone and there is nothing you can do to keep me here”
He signed the contract that made 2020 and 2021 voidable. He made them include not tagging him. You have no clue that it wasn’t his choice to not include real years for 20 and 21, what we do know is in 20 he took the first (only?) other offer and did not give the patriots a chance to make an offer.
That’s a guy choosing to leave not being forced out.

1) You inferred, I stated facts.
2) If they were planning on paying him why did they structure the deal with 2020 as a void year that even had he stayed would have cost $6 mill against the cap?
3) The Patriots had plenty of time to re-sign him. They didn't want to. I am glad you and Don Yee are so tight you are aware of how negotiations went with the other 31 teams.
4) Very simple. He wanted to have a multi year contract. He didn't get one. Both sides knew it was over.

 

[Ring 6]

1) You inferred, I stated facts.
2) If they were planning on paying him why did they structure the deal with 2020 as a void year that even had he stayed would have cost $6 mill against the cap?
3) The Patriots had plenty of time to re-sign him. They didn't want to. I am glad you and Don Yee are so tight you are aware of how negotiations went with the other 31 teams.
4) Very simple. He wanted to have a multi year contract. He didn't get one. Both sides knew it was over.

1) saying “he won the team 6 championships” doesn’t require inference, you are saying HE WON THE FOR THE TEAM
2) to spread the cap hit. Are you telling the patriots plan was to let him walk and gave no QB? Come on.
3) Brady had plenty of time to talk to the patriots, and he didn’t.
4) the patriots expected him back. You think he wanted a multi year deal. I am proving that it didn’t matter. If he signed a one year deal with the patriots, he would have gotten another one year deal unless he sustained a career ending injury.
once again your argument amounts to all that Brady valued was getting an extra 25 mill next year if his career ended this year by injury. And he valued that so much he never asked the patriots for it.

 

[203Pat]

1) saying “he won the team 6 championships” doesn’t require inference, you are saying HE WON THE FOR THE TEAM
2) to spread the cap hit. Are you telling the patriots plan was to let him walk and gave no QB? Come on.
3) Brady had plenty of time to talk to the patriots, and he didn’t.
4) the patriots expected him back. You think he wanted a multi year deal. I am proving that it didn’t matter. If he signed a one year deal with the patriots, he would have gotten another one year deal unless he sustained a career ending injury.
once again your argument amounts to all that Brady valued was getting an extra 25 mill next year if his career ended this year by injury. And he valued that so much he never asked the patriots for it.

 

[Ring 6]

Wow great come back.

 

[Boomer B]

No point in talking to the guy. People connected to the parties have talked and written about it, but ol Andy says don’t believe them. I’ll trust Zolak, Fauria, and Curran over ol Andy who’s never in his life spoke to Brady, Belichick, or Kraft. I’ll look at the reality that Belichick made Brady renegotiate in Aug 18 and Aug 19 and would keep him year to year then the magical imaginary world Andy lives in where all of a sudden in 2020 Belichick was gonna hand out a multi year guaranteed deal.

It’s really not worth dealing with the him. No concept of common sense.

 

[203Pat]

No point in talking to the guy. People connected to the parties have talked and written about it, but ol Andy says don’t believe them. I’ll trust Zolak, Fauria, and Curran over ol Andy who’s never in his life spoke to Brady, Belichick, or Kraft. I’ll look at the reality that Belichick made Brady renegotiate in Aug 18 and Aug 19 and would keep him year to year then the magical imaginary world Andy lives in where all of a sudden in 2020 Belichick was gonna hand out a multi year guaranteed deal.

It’s really not worth dealing with the him. No concept of common sense.

I knew what was coming and just couldn't help myself. The narratives out there that people craft to make sure Bill is never in the wrong are just over the top.

 

[Rob0729]

And if BB doesn’t get a decent QB.... and has “bad luck” and has 3 more losing seasons.... then what?

One bad season is one thing. Four years of losing is on him. He went 11-5 and would have made the playoffs at other year with Matt Cassel. So four years of losing seasons are totally on Belichick.

 

[sb1]

And if BB doesn’t get a decent QB.... and has “bad luck” and has 3 more losing seasons.... then what?

Then Pats likely are looking for a new head coach. Not sure what good that will do though. If the roster is such that they do have 3 more losing seasons in a row and no first place schedule, then I wouldn’t expect much out of this team for at least the rest of the decade and maybe longer than that.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Tonight's a big night for Bill.

 

[sb1]

Tonight's a big night for Bill.

Maybe you missed an s on that last word.

It’s meaningless for the Pats.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Maybe you missed an s on that last word.

It’s meaningless for the Pats.

Bill doesn't want to take a beatdown on MNF. If he does, it fuels the narrative that he's mortal without Brady/can't beat anybody good without Brady. We need to see the team put up a fight.

Bills are going to want this game badly. Getting another win and sweeping the Pats on the season would be a great win for them.

 

[amfootball]

Bill doesn't want to take a beatdown on MNF. If he does, it fuels the narrative that he's mortal without Brady. We need to see the team put up a fight.

Bills are going to want this game badly. Getting another win and sweeping the Pats on the season would be a great win for them.

We don't have Gilmore against one of the best, if not the best passing team in the league. We have not scored a TD in 2 and a half games. I think we are getting beat down much like what the Rams did to us.

 

[sb1]

Bill doesn't want to take a beatdown on MNF. If he does, it fuels the narrative that he's mortal without Brady/can't beat anybody good without Brady. We need to see the team put up a fight.

Bills are going to want this game badly. Getting another win and sweeping the Pats on the season would be a great win for them.

The Bills are a much better football team than we are right now, they’re the AFC East champs and a legit Super Bowl contender this year. I don’t think that a big Buffalo win tonight will add or take away anything from the narrative.

Bill can change the narrative to his favor with a successful rebuild.

 

[Tompa12]

Replace Cam with even say, Dalton what would our record be?

Point being, Cam and the offense has been so bad, that despite that, Bill is going to lead this team to likely 7-9. Even with an average QB like Dalton, we would likely be in the playoffs.

 

[PatriotSpy]

Replace Cam with even say, Dalton what would our record be?

Point being, Cam and the offense has been so bad, that despite that, Bill is going to lead this team to likely 7-9. Even with an average QB like Dalton, we would likely be in the playoffs.

WTF is this? Denver with a putrid quarterback has a chance to be 6-10. This isn't some accomplishment glorifying bill.

 

[PatsWSB47]

WTF is this? Denver with a putrid quarterback has a chance to be 6-10. This isn't some accomplishment glorifying bill.

You have a point

 

[sb1]

Replace Cam with even say, Dalton what would our record be?

Wouldn’t be any better.

 

[Tompa12]

WTF is this? Denver with a putrid quarterback has a chance to be 6-10. This isn't some accomplishment glorifying bill.

It means that Bill can lead a team to the playoffs with an average QB and who knows, even further and doesn’t need a HOF caliber QB to win.