sanu released

[LJRomanoff]

Why is this a surprise? Sanu was lousy last year. people speculated it was because he was injured, but that was never really confirmed.

How would one confirm that? Consult the alternate universe where Sanu wasn't injured?

 

[Deus Irae]

JFC, who cares if BB was wrong on Julio Jones who the Patriots were never in contention of being able to draft in the first place. Why don't you take a look at this list (83 1st Rd WRs since 2000) and maybe you'll figure out that being able to draft good WRs isn't just a Belichick problem. It's a crapshoot, even in the 1st round.

The question asked wasn't whether or not drafting WRs was just a BB problem, was it? I didn't say that it was just a Belichick problem, did I?

 

[Deus Irae]

Malcolm Brown was a number 1 pick, started for the Pats since his rookie season, their NFL Ranking for rushing TD's allowed in Malcolm Brown's four years as a starter: 6th, 1st, 2nd, 2nd, he made history in 2018 starting in his third Super Bowl in just his fourth season and helped tie a record for the fewest points scored in any Super Bowl. But yeah... he sucked.

The self loathing and malaise amongst the negative Nancys never fails...

Self loathing? Once again, you have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[captain stone]

In 2018 Sony led the entire NFL postseason in yards, yards per carry and TD's.

If Sony doesn't get hurt in 2018 (missing 3.5 games) and you project his regular season stats out over 16 games he would have rushed for roughly 1217 yards and 8 TD's at 4.5 yards per carry. 1217 yards would have placed him 4th most in rushing yards in the NFL in 2018.

Does he make enough big plays? Enough to be one of the most successful rushers in the NFL, so the answer is yes. JAG's don't do that.

Blocking matters, having a legitimate passing threat matters, rushing doesn't happen in a vacuum. The 2019 Patriots were one of the worst run blocking teams in the league until the bye week, or until the season was 2/3rds over and the passing attack was anemic.

Big plays are the result of blocking, not some super power measured by analytics.

Chubb was a better prospect then, is a better professional now, and will continue to be better than Soreknee in the future.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

JFC, who cares if BB was wrong on Julio Jones who the Patriots were never in contention of being able to draft in the first place. Why don't you take a look at this list (83 1st Rd WRs since 2000) and maybe you'll figure out that being able to draft good WRs isn't just a Belichick problem. It's a crapshoot, even in the 1st round.

It's not a crapshoot. And I'm sorry but I'm going to go on here not everything is directed at you. Just trying to shed some light on the draft for others ...

That's bad evaluation. Simply put there's very few prospects worth a 1st round grade. Some years you'll have 5. Others 15-20.

Teams are blind when making picks although there is a bit of a gamble. They have interviews, background checks, scouts/acquaintances and so on to get to know a player off the field, on a personal level.

You have years of tape from high school through college.

Athletic testing & profile fits.

I understand why some use the term crapshoot. Evaluating talent & drafting a prospect is incredibly hard. And there's a huge difference between the two. A lot of people don't know or forget that.

I evaluate talent and put a grade on player before the draft. I'll never know what goes on behind the scenes besides tidbits if that. I go off film, traits & athletic testing. A little gut. And put a grade on player.

Teams have to bring that player in their house. Their "family", team, community. That's a lot harder I'd guess but again they're privy to so much more.

That's why its important to have a grade on a prospect. If you don't have many 1st round grades, don't reach. Trade back, to a different year, vet ... Don't reach. If someone is close enough. Just missed a 1st and you're picking 28 then a good case should be made. I didn't have a 1st round grade on any WR last year but NEP are thin, desperate. We have several types on the board that should fit. Why not? Again make a good case.

In terms of attacking, approaching the draft, these are my core rules.

1)The draft is about finding about where value & need meet. There's absolutely nothing wrong with drafting for need. The value has to be there though. You have to have clear understanding of where you have a prospect in terms of value/round. Don't reach.

2)Mitigating risk, especially with early picks. At the end of the day would you rather a solid player for 6-8 years or take a chance on boom/bust prospects top 64?

3)You go after your "types" for your "system". You're putting together a team. Again a family in some ways. It's not only about what happens on the field. It's also about practice/work ethic, film room, guys bonding-developing with each other. The "fit" is crucial. Both what type player & person you want.

4)Have a clear understanding of the draft as whole in terms of where the talent is, depth. What you need & have to work with. How many picks, can you use futures, player trades ... Have an understanding of how you think it'll play out and how you can use to your advantage. This is where you're coming together as a group in the "war room" and going over every scenario and again how you can make it work for you're team. Each draft is a different animal.

5)Everyone is talented but not everyone is smart & tough. Find the football players. The guys who come back for seconds after a bad day. Smart & tough could make the difference when the talent margins are so thin.

 

[Wozzy]

Chubb was better prospect, is better professional, and will continue to be better than Soreknee in the future.

At Georgia, and as a rookie with the Browns, both teams took him off the field on passing downs because his pass blocking and receiving were poor.

The Patriots drafted Sony because he understood complex pass blocking and receiving schemes and could play immediately.

Here's a good breakdown of Chubb's weaknesses. RB's do more than run, I get that pass blocking doesn't earn you fantasy football points, but it actually contributes to winning football in a way that casual football fans don't understand. By the time Chubb is proficient at these things (if ever) he'll be angling for one of the biggest RB contracts in the league, assuming health Sony will either take a median level deal or be moving on.

Browns Film Room: RB Nick Chubb’s weaknesses

WFNY's Joe Gilbert takes a look at the film to examine the areas of Cleveland Browns running back and 2018 second round pick Nick Chubb’s game that are weaknesses or areas of concern.

waitingfornextyear.com

 

[Wozzy]

edit

 

[Wozzy]

Self loathing? Once again, you have no idea what you're talking about.

When you suggest Malcolm Brown wasn't even "a solid starter" for four years, three of which ended in Super Bowl appearances and some of the best run defense in the league... you lose all credibility.

It's typical Patriot fan malaise. Everyone else is great, the Patriots suck including their good players... this despite actual W/L records.

I've been listening to "the Patriots have no talent and only win because of Brady" narrative for two decades... it's garbage and always has been. The Patriots have no talent, but somehow their players annually set the market for their respective positions in free agency.

 

[Wozzy]

It's not a crapshoot. And I'm sorry but I'm going to go on here not everything is directed at you. Just trying to shed some light on the draft for others ...

That's bad evaluation. Simply put there's very few prospects worth a 1st round grade. Some years you'll have 5. Others 15-20.

Teams are blind when making picks although there is a bit of a gamble. They have interviews, background checks, scouts/acquaintances and so on to get to know a player off the field, on a personal level.

You have years of tape from high school through college.

Athletic testing & profile fits.

I understand why some use the term crapshoot. Evaluating talent & drafting a prospect is incredibly hard. And there's a huge difference between the two. A lot of people don't know or forget that.

I evaluate talent and put a grade on player before the draft. I'll never know what goes on behind the scenes besides tidbits if that. I go off film, traits & athletic testing. A little gut. And put a grade on player.

Teams have to bring that player in their house. Their "family", team, community. That's a lot harder I'd guess but again they're privy to so much more.

That's why its important to have a grade on a prospect. If you don't have many 1st round grades, don't reach. Trade back, to a different year, vet ... Don't reach. If someone is close enough. Just missed a 1st and you're picking 28 then a good case should be made. I didn't have a 1st round grade on any WR last year but NEP are thin, desperate. We have several types on the board that should fit. Why not? Again make a good case.

In terms of attacking, approaching the draft, these are my core rules.

1)The draft is about finding about where value & need meet. There's absolutely nothing wrong with drafting for need. The value has to be there though. You have to have clear understanding of where you have a prospect in terms of value/round. Don't reach.

2)Mitigating risk, especially with early picks. At the end of the day would you rather a solid player for 6-8 years or take a chance on boom/bust prospects top 64?

3)You go after your "types" for your "system". You're putting together a team. Again a family in some ways. It's not only about what happens on the field. It's also about practice/work ethic, film room, guys bonding-developing with each other. The "fit" is crucial. Both what type player & person you want.

4)Have a clear understanding of the draft as whole in terms of where the talent is, depth. What you need & have to work with. How many picks, can you use futures, player trades ... Have an understanding of how you think it'll play out and how you can use to your advantage. This is where you're coming together as a group in the "war room" and going over every scenario and again how you can make it work for you're team. Each draft is a different animal.

5)Everyone is talented but not everyone is smart & tough. Find the football players. The guys who come back for seconds after a bad day. Smart & tough could make the difference when the talent margins are so thin.

It's literally the title of a book.

Whenever you rely on humans, but especially in a job where the average career lasts three years, it's a crapshoot.

Amazon product ASIN B01NA02R40
You can turnover every stone, use all due diligence and still end up with egg on your face... even if some teams are better at it than others.

Chad Jackson was the best WR prospect in his draft class... by a lot. He was a smart pick where he was taken, but you can't truly account for "injury" or "idiot."

 

[1960Pats]

That was probably an attempt to appease Brady. Super uncharacteristic for BB

Brady had nothing to do with that. Belichick has always been in total control of the roster. And making mistakes on WR's is right in Belichick's wheelhouse. He's lucky that he's had Brady to cover up for his poor choices.

 

[1960Pats]

Hall of Shame for sure, but BB gets blame for putting an inexperienced player back to return a punt who's only fielded one punt his entire career. He clearly looked uncomfortable doing it.

Chalk that up as Billy's last blunder for Tom Brady.

And Brady gets blame if he actually pushed this trade.

If I ask my wife to cook a meatloaf for dinner and it turns out horrible, am I to blame by asking for meatloaf?

 

[1960Pats]

At this point that’s a winning season.

C'mon Man! Only losers think that way.

 

[1960Pats]

I've always preferred proven players over draft picks. Sanu may be the exception to my rule.

 

[skinnydog]

How would one confirm that? Consult the alternate universe where Sanu wasn't injured?

I think you missed my point. I thought Sanu was lousy last year and deserving a cut before free agency this year to free up cap space. Some thought he was only lousy due to a injury and would be better this year.

 

[Pats2000]

Brady had nothing to do with that. Belichick has always been in total control of the roster. And making mistakes on WR's is right in Belichick's wheelhouse. He's lucky that he's had Brady to cover up for his poor choices.

We'll see this year wont we

 

[Bill Lee]

Simply put there's very few prospects worth a 1st round grade. Some years you'll have 5. Others 15-20.

I've heard BB doesn't let his scouts use terminology such as "1st rounder". He wants to hear things like "probable starter" or "role player with special teams potential" etc mapped to a player's third year.

 

[Bill Lee]

Brady had nothing to do with that. Belichick has always been in total control of the roster. And making mistakes on WR's is right in Belichick's wheelhouse. He's lucky that he's had Brady to cover up for his poor choices.

Yet if BB didn't pick Brady in the 6th round Brady might be covering up his boss's poor choices at Pizza Hut.

 

[TheRainMaker]

If I ask my wife to cook a meatloaf for dinner and it turns out horrible, am I to blame by asking for meatloaf?

If you knew she never made meatloaf or isn't good at it, then you are to blame. I thought I made this pretty clear in my OP. Sanu has only returned one punt in his career. He's not a very agile receiver and it was painful to watch him try to dodge defenders on that punt return. And the fact that he was hung out dry returning that punt when the team was in desperate need of bodies at WR, was irresponsible of Billy.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Is bb bad at drafting wide receivers or was Brady really picky about who he threw to?

He admitted on Howard Stern that if he thinks a receiver is useless, he won't bother with them.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

I've heard BB doesn't let his scouts use terminology such as "1st rounder". He wants to hear things like "probable starter" or "role player with special teams potential" etc mapped to a player's third year.

Yup & This has been mine since 2011. 1st round is almost broken down into 3 groups.

Basically don't get caught up in that. Bill & A LOT of others do that to make their scouts think & describe a player in detail as opposed throwing a generic label on them. Bill Walsh did the same thing