My problem with Bill Belichick as a coach

[edkk323]

Sometimes I wish we didn't have likes/dislikes.

It would force people to give analysis & explain themselves.

Agreed. You disliked all of my posts in this thread without a word. what a joke huh?

 

[Deus Irae]

For example, no one expected we sign Gilmore for $14 m per. Given our CB situation and available CB FA last year AND this year, I would say it was a great signing.

Very few fans on this board can see beyond one year. I am not one of them.

That doesn't somehow make your post not ridiculous. It's clear from some of BB's moves, with poster input having been either prior or contemporaneous, that BB doesn't always know better, and BB doesn't always do better.

And that's not a surprise, because everyone makes mistakes, and not all fans are idiots.

 

[Deus Irae]

Man...we are an entitled fan base arent we ? I mean look at 31 other teams and their coaches and their track record . We still need a reason to complain.

It's a message board, not a team owned blog. It's ok if people here don't think everything is always perfect in Patriots land.

 

[edkk323]

It's a message board, not a team owned blog. It's ok if people here don't think everything is always perfect in Patriots land.

Of course. I did not intend to shut down all the negative views and I certainly have them as well. I just have problems with people who say "we should pick player X instead of Y” AGAIN and AGAIN without providing any reasoning.

 

[Tony2046]

That doesn't somehow make your post not ridiculous. It's clear from some of BB's moves, with poster input having been either prior or contemporaneous, that BB doesn't always know better, and BB doesn't always do better.

And that's not a surprise, because everyone makes mistakes, and not all fans are idiots.

What???????????

 

[Bruins29]

I'll never understand wtf BB was doing week 17 2015 in a win and clinch HFA against a 5 win Dolphin team. It was like he did not want to win the game. I know the team was really dinged up but HFA VS the Broncos was crucial.

 

[HailHydra]

or how about the nfl doesn't steal the 2016 1st round pick and the Pats take Michael Thomas

How am I supposed to control that?

 

[Deus Irae]

Of course. I did not intend to shut down all the negative views and I certainly have them as well. I just have problems with people who say "we should pick player X instead of Y” AGAIN and AGAIN without providing any reasoning.

No worries. It's definitely better to have some evidence behind the "I knew that guy would suck" posts. But, around here, that often doesn't matter. We've got the

1. "Can't tell ahead of time"
2. "Too soon to tell"
3. "Yeah, but that's hindsight"

progression that some of the homers use. And, if that fails, the next move is usually the appeal to authority.

 

[edkk323]

What???????????

You spend 5-10 mins doing statement-reasoning-conclusion. You get statements like "nah, you are wrong". They do not want to reason; they just want to complain.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Agreed. You disliked all of my posts in this thread without a word. what a joke huh?

Bc they were ridiculous

One ball washed in one reply that frankly had nothing to do w the OP. It was just a "like" grab that again had nothing to do w the OP.

In the other you called the draft a crapshoot & said fans can't do better.

You're wrong on both accounts.

My player X/Y comment was in regards to some, very few who actually know what the hell their talking about w a grading history to back it up.

 

[edkk323]

No worries. It's definitely better to have some evidence behind the "I knew that guy would suck" posts. But, around here, that often doesn't matter. We've got the

1. "Can't tell ahead of time"
2. "Too soon to tell"
3. "Yeah, but that's hindsight"

progression that some of the homers use. And, if that fails, the next move is usually the appeal to authority.

A well-run organization should consider the long term effect of any FA signing. Fans never have enough info like future demand and supply of CB position and full evaluation of the player. I said this in other post "
New England Patriots figured out a strategy almost two decades ago and implemented it to the letter. It was "never ever overpay your own FA". So called dynasties like Seahawks, Falcons and Broncos have come and gone but we are still here year in and year out. The only teams which could remotely match our success were the Colts and the Steelers. The Colts was out of the conversation after Forehead got injured and the Steelers are in free fall. I am glad that we did not pay Jamie Collins or Chandler Jones or Nate Solder or Butler or Lewis. "

My point is that NEP have a distinctive philosophy on football and business operation. It worked for two decades and they are sticking to it.

I try to guess what is the reasoning behind every move and try to learn instead of questioning it.

 

[edkk323]

Bc they were ridiculous

One ball washed in one reply that frankly had nothing to do w the OP. It was just a "like" grab that again had nothing to do w the OP.

In the other you called the draft a crapshoot & said fans can't do better.

You're wrong on both accounts.

My player X/Y comment was in regards to some, very few who actually know what the hell their talking about w a grading history to back it up.

You at least proved the usefulness of the dislike button.

 

[Tony2046]

Bc they were ridiculous

One ball washed in one reply that frankly had nothing to do w the OP. It was just a "like" grab that again had nothing to do w the OP.

In the other you called the draft a crapshoot & said fans can't do better.

You're wrong on both accounts.

My player X/Y comment was in regards to some, very few who actually know what the hell their talking about w a grading history to back it up.

Dude you're so full of shyt.

You and I and everyone else are posting here on a fan forum. Neither you or I are standing on the freaking sidelines. hahahaha

I don't mind your input regarding a players play or capability but do mind you acting as though you are some kind of forgotten draft dynasty king. WTF??

 

[edkk323]

I will give a good example. I am a super homer of BB and how he operates this organization.

He benched Malcolm Butler for the SB because of the "rumored" tardiness. If you run the team for one season ONLY, of course you should do anything you can to win. But if you run your team like a business for 20 or 30 years, you do not compromise your core value at anytime.

It is same situation as businesses cutting to get higher short term profit.

It hurts to lose the SB but BB won't trade it for his philosophy.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Dude you're so full of shyt.

You and I and everyone else are posting here on a fan forum. Neither you or I are standing on the freaking sidelines. hahahaha

I don't mind your input regarding a players play or capability but do mind you acting as though you are some kind of forgotten draft dynasty king. WTF??

Wow you're really mad Tony?

Saying the draft isn't a crapshoot & others besides those in office could do better really angers you lol?

We've seen some of the abysmal failures, mediocrity the NFL has to offers in both evaluating/picking talent for years. The same could be said for coaching.

I've always been more interested in the former & am actually pretty good at it. I'm not saying that ****y. People can be good at things. I don't pretend or think I'm the best fwiw. There are many other amateurs a lot better or just as good. You can actually look at my/their grades & see they know what their talking about.

It's just very dismissive & frankly naive to think no one besides a chosen few could do that.

 

[Tony2046]

Wow you're really mad Tony?

Saying the draft isn't a crapshoot & others besides those in office could do better really angers you lol?

We've seen some of the abysmal failures, mediocrity the NFL has to offers in both evaluating/picking talent for years. The same could be said for coaching.

I've always been more interested in the former & am actually pretty good at it. I'm not saying that ****y. People can be good at things. I don't pretend or think I'm the best fwiw. There are many other amateurs a lot better or just as good. You can actually look at my/their grades & see they know what their talking about.

It's just very dismissive & frankly naive to think no one besides a chosen few could do that.

Yeah I enjoy your input regarding a player's traits et al, but do mind you taking a dump on another poster's perspective the way you do.

Personally I study plays both defensively and offensively because my son and I love it but I would never shyt on another poster's comment or discount it because, like you, I'm not employed by a single NFL team and know that I'm just a novice contributor.

Evidently you think you're above the fray.

 

[TBR]

I will give a good example. I am a super homer of BB and how he operates this organization.

He benched Malcolm Butler for the SB because of the "rumored" tardiness. If you run the team for one season ONLY, of course you should do anything you can to win. But if you run your team like a business for 20 or 30 years, you do not compromise your core value at anytime.

It is same situation as businesses cutting to get higher short term profit.

It hurts to lose the SB but BB won't trade it for his philosophy.

Translation: "Damn, losing the Super Bowl sucked... but it's for the greater good, because Belichick's philosophy didn't take a hit!!!"

Belichick's job is to win games. His job is most definitely NOT to stick to a "philosophy" and resist compromising it at all costs, even if it means hindering the ultimate goal of winning a Super Bowl.

 

[edkk323]

Wow you're really mad Tony?

Saying the draft isn't a crapshoot & others besides those in office could do better really angers you lol?

We've seen some of the abysmal failures, mediocrity the NFL has to offers in both evaluating/picking talent for years. The same could be said for coaching.

I've always been more interested in the former & am actually pretty good at it. I'm not saying that ****y. People can be good at things. I don't pretend or think I'm the best fwiw. There are many other amateurs a lot better or just as good. You can actually look at my/their grades & see they know what their talking about.

It's just very dismissive & frankly naive to think no one besides a chosen few could do that.

Tony is not mad, he is just confused by your vague comments. You calling our draftees abysmal failures?
2014
Round2 Jamie Collins
Round2 Aaron Dobson
Round3 Logan Ryan
Round3 Duron Harmon
Round4 Josh Boyce
Round7 Michael Buchanan
Round7 Steve Beauharnais
"Above AVG"
2014
Round1 29 Dominique Easley
Round2 62 Jimmy Garoppolo
Round4 105 Bryan Stork
Round4 130 James White
Round4 140 Cameron Fleming
"Nothing but a 35m per yr QB but not a huge failure"
2015
Round 1: DT Malcom Brown, Texas
Round 2: SS Jordan Richards, Stanford
Round 3: DE Geneo Grissom, Oklahoma
Round 4: DE Trey Flowers, Arkansas
Round 4: OG Tre' Jackson, Florida State
Round 4: OG Shaq Mason, Georgia Tech
Round 5: LS Joe Cardona, Navy
"Only three quality starters but not a huge failure"
2016
Round2 Cyrus Jones
Round3 Joe Thuney
Round3 Jacoby Brissett
Round3 Vincent Valentine
Round4 Malcolm Mitchell
Round6 Kamu Grugier-Hill
Round6 Elandon Roberts
Round6 Ted Karras
Round7 Devin Lucien
" abysmal failures everywhere"
2017
Round3 Derek Rivers
Round3 Antonio Garcia
Round4 Deatrich Wise Jr.
Round6 Conor McDermott
"2 out of 4, avg"
2018
Round1 Isaiah Wynn
Round1 Sony Michel
Round2 Duke Dawson
Round5 Ja'Whaun Bentley
Round6 Christian Sam
Round6 Braxton Berrios
Round7 Danny Etling
Round7 Keion Crossen
Round7 Ryan Izzo TE
"two games in, might as well call it failure"

2 out 6 is not enough to call it abysmally failed.
Your "statement" is as vague and useless as it gets.

"Some is better, some is worse, you know, I am not saying I am good, but you are wrong to say I am not good"

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Yeah I enjoy your input regarding a player's traits et al, but do mind you taking a dump on another poster's perspective the way you do.

Personally I study plays both defensively and offensively because my son and I love it but I would never shyt on another poster's comment or discount it because, like you, I'm not employed by a single NFL team and know that I'm just a novice contributor.

Evidently you think you're above the fray.

I mean I said his post was ridiculous, thats really not that bad & I don't think I was the only one.

I also don't think I'm "above the fray" or w/e you want to call it. I don't think like that. That said you can look at the re-watch thread or other post & see analysis of a play, player I don't see elsewhere. Tbh most will just post a tweet of someone else w nothing else. That's not ****y, it just is what it is.

Like I said there are many people that don't work for a team that are absolutely as good if not better than some in those positions.

There was a forum that got shutdown years ago that had 2-3 brilliant posters that used to coach football that went on to do other things. Twitter has a ton of brilliant football minds, some of which worked for teams or got a job working for a team starting out as an amateur.

I just think it's weak to think just bc someone doesn't work for a team means they couldn't coach or draft good players. Again I have zero interest in coaching or being a scout. The latter gets paid **** for the most part & aren't listened to anyway. I've had success they way I do it.

NFL is most definitely a "good ole boys" network. It's changing a little but it still has a ton of that in it.

With that you get a ton of people automatically excluded no matter how talented they are.

 

[edkk323]

Translation: "Damn, losing the Super Bowl sucked... but it's for the greater good, because Belichick's philosophy didn't take a hit!!!"

Belichick's job is to win games. His job is most definitely NOT to stick to a "philosophy" and resist compromising it at all costs, even if it means hindering the ultimate goal of winning a Super Bowl.

Belichick's job is to win games or A GAME? I will say his job is never to win A SB but to stay competitive enough to win MANY SB. If sticking to his core value is the only way he knows how to do it, then good for us.