Will Sony make this team?

[mgteich]

PS - with now 5 TEs of the roster I think Vitale is cut. One of them is primed to take FB snaps (prob Keene).

I'd rather have no FB than use a roster spot on Keene. IMO, Keene only has a roster spot if he can beat out Asiasi.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

I'd rather have no FB than use a roster spot on Keene. IMO, Keene only has a roster spot if he can beat out Asiasi.

Agree. Don't see the point of Keene. Jonnu will likely get a ton of these types of passes and screens.

.

 

[50-yard-line]

I'd rather have no FB than use a roster spot on Keene. IMO, Keene only has a roster spot if he can beat out Asiasi.

Keene is about the same size as Jakob Johnson. If he can block anything like Johnson, he might take that spot, particularly since Johnson can be put on the PS without costing us a spot.

There's a camp battle there, for sure, between the three (and heck, Stevenson might get some reps there, too).

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Keane has to do something different because he was horrible last year as a tight end!

he ran routes praying no one threw him the ball!

one of his only catches last year, he promptly fumbled it.

this was a terrible pick.

Harris, Michel, white and Stevenson are locks! If we do keep 5 running backs, the battle for number 5 should be intense.

 

[50-yard-line]

Keane has to do something different because he was horrible last year as a tight end!

he ran routes praying no one threw him the ball!

one of his only catches last year, he promptly fumbled it.

this was a terrible pick.

Harris, Michel, white and Stevenson are locks! If we do keep 5 running backs, the battle for number 5 should be intense.

Keene had 140 total offensive snaps, was targeted 5 times and had 3 catches in a rookie year with no real camp and where he didn't even get on the field until late October, hurt his knee and didn't come back until December....but you can tell all of that?

 

[mgteich]

Keane has to do something different because he was horrible last year as a tight end!

he ran routes praying no one threw him the ball!

one of his only catches last year, he promptly fumbled it.

this was a terrible pick.

Harris, Michel, white and Stevenson are locks! If we do keep 5 running backs, the battle for number 5 should be intense.

I strongly agree with your analysis.

CHOICES FOR FIFTH RUNNING BACK
Johnson
Vitale
None
Taylor
Burkhead
Keene

I don't even list Bolden, since, for me, he is competing for a Special Teams spot.

 

[mgteich]

Keene had 140 total offensive snaps, was targeted 5 times and had 3 catches in a rookie year with no real camp and where he didn't even get on the field until late October, hurt his knee and didn't come back until December....but you can tell all of that?

Belichick didn't sign 2 top ends because he was happy with Asiasi, Keene and LaCosse. That being said, keene will be be given every opportunit in camp to compete for a roster spot.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Going from gronkowski to graham was a huge step down in talent level!

yet going from graham to assyassy and keane was an even larger step down!

bb was dead set on fixing this nearly nonexistent level of talent in 2021 and invested significant investment in Henry and Smith not because he saw keane or assyassy as viable options.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

We pretty much announced the level of greatness we were shooting for at TE when we drafted a guy literally named "meh" in Spanish. I guess its better than Devin Chupa el Culo

 

[203Pat]

Find me one person who's said that and I'll buy you Tom Brady's old house.

Obviously it was hyperbole but many on here seemed to think Sony was worth a first round pick when it looks like it is pretty obvious he wasn't. The guy is average as average can be and now his days as a Patriot are numbered and the minute he's gone the same people who claimed he won us a ring in 2018 will claim he was never very good.

 

[moosekill]

Obviously it was hyperbole but many on here seemed to think Sony was worth a first round pick when it looks like it is pretty obvious he wasn't. The guy is average as average can be and now his days as a Patriot are numbered and the minute he's gone the same people who claimed he won us a ring in 2018 will claim he was never very good.

Did you get lost?? This isn't the Tompa thread. Probably best to head back and add some interesting comments over there!

 

[mgteich]

Obviously it was hyperbole but many on here seemed to think Sony was worth a first round pick when it looks like it is pretty obvious he wasn't. The guy is average as average can be and now his days as a Patriot are numbered and the minute he's gone the same people who claimed he won us a ring in 2018 will claim he was never very good.

It is what it is. Michel has been a part of a reasonable patriot running game, and is part of it for 2021.

Could we have drafted a RB who would have produced more in these four years? Sure.

 

[203Pat]

It is what it is. Michel has been a part of a reasonable patriot running game, and is part of it for 2020.

Could we have drafted a RB who would have produced more in these four years? Sure.

Very reasonable take on Sony.

Did you get lost?? This isn't the Tompa thread. Probably best to head back and add some interesting comments over there!

Who are you?

 

[50-yard-line]

Obviously it was hyperbole but many on here seemed to think Sony was worth a first round pick when it looks like it is pretty obvious he wasn't. The guy is average as average can be and now his days as a Patriot are numbered and the minute he's gone the same people who claimed he won us a ring in 2018 will claim he was never very good.

How many YPC does a running back have to average for you to be happy?

The only guy who had more total yards AND YPC than Michel last year was JK Dobbins (a rookie who was picked at 55 by Baltimore). Ravens are sky high on him and expecting huge things form him - and his first season wasn't as good as Sony's first season.

So many here seem to hate on the guy for two reasons: 1st Round Pick and picked ahead of Chubb. Michel's numbers are pretty damned good. YPC sucked in 2019, I agree, but the Patriots running game absolutely sucked in 2019. Every time they handed off the ball, the back seemed to have to go past someone in the backfield. The Pats were terrible.

 

[mgteich]

How many YPC does a running back have to average for you to be happy?

The only guy who had more total yards AND YPC than Michel last year was JK Dobbins (a rookie who was picked at 55 by Baltimore). Ravens are sky high on him and expecting huge things form him - and his first season wasn't as good as Sony's first season.

So many here seem to hate on the guy for two reasons: 1st Round Pick and picked ahead of Chubb. Michel's numbers are pretty damned good. YPC sucked in 2019, I agree, but the Patriots running game absolutely sucked in 2019. Every time they handed off the ball, the back seemed to have to go past someone in the backfield. The Pats were terrible.

We are patriots fans?

How so you know?

There are few fan bases would say the team was terrible when they went 12-4 and won the division.

 

[203Pat]

How many YPC does a running back have to average for you to be happy?

The only guy who had more total yards AND YPC than Michel last year was JK Dobbins (a rookie who was picked at 55 by Baltimore). Ravens are sky high on him and expecting huge things form him - and his first season wasn't as good as Sony's first season.

So many here seem to hate on the guy for two reasons: 1st Round Pick and picked ahead of Chubb. Michel's numbers are pretty damned good. YPC sucked in 2019, I agree, but the Patriots running game absolutely sucked in 2019. Every time they handed off the ball, the back seemed to have to go past someone in the backfield. The Pats were terrible.

I am not talking about stats. I am talking about watching Sony play. He does absolutely nothing that a UDFA or late round RB couldn't do. He isn't fast, anytime he breaks into the next level he gets ran down instantly. He isn't shifty, he doesn't make anyone miss. He doesn't offer anything as a pass catcher so it pretty much telegraphs what were doing when he's on the field. If he was a good as his stats they wouldn't have spent to picks on RB's to replace him.

 

[50-yard-line]

I am not talking about stats. I am talking about watching Sony play. He does absolutely nothing that a UDFA or late round RB couldn't do. He isn't fast, anytime he breaks into the next level he gets ran down instantly. He isn't shifty, he doesn't make anyone miss. He doesn't offer anything as a pass catcher so it pretty much telegraphs what were doing when he's on the field. If he was a good as his stats they wouldn't have spent to picks on RB's to replace him.

Last sentence first: Michel is about to get expensive if they exercised the 5th year option - more expensive than any back BB's paid in many, many years. So, not surprised that they keep the RB train running.

Your eyes tell you one thing, mine show me another, as in watching Michel in 2019 getting hit almost immediately as he got the ball. And Michel in 2020 running hard and gaining almost 6 yards/carry.

 

[mgteich]

I am not talking about stats. I am talking about watching Sony play. He does absolutely nothing that a UDFA or late round RB couldn't do. He isn't fast, anytime he breaks into the next level he gets ran down instantly. He isn't shifty, he doesn't make anyone miss. He doesn't offer anything as a pass catcher so it pretty much telegraphs what were doing when he's on the field. If he was a good as his stats they wouldn't have spent to picks on RB's to replace him.

We carry 4 running backs (not counting special teamers or fullbacks). HOPEFULLY, they last four years each. Belichick isn't picking up 5th options.
So, we need a new RB every year, and more if the RB's don't last four years.

So, by your measure, every patriot running back is terrible since Belichick continues to draft running backs. The reality is that we have a revolving door, by choice.

Michel is doing exactly what he was drafted to do. Harris is doing just what he was drafted to do. White has done much more than we have any right to expect. Now, we add Stevenson to the mix, probably in a minor role, as is unusually the case for rookies if the starters are back.

 

[Deus Irae]

We carry 4 running backs (not counting special teamers or fullbacks). HOPEFULLY, they last four years each. Belichick isn't picking up 5th options.
So, we need a new RB every year, and more if the RB's don't last four years.

So, by your measure, every patriot running back is terrible since Belichick continues to draft running backs. The reality is that we have a revolving door, by choice.

Michel is doing exactly what he was drafted to do. Harris is doing just what he was drafted to do. White has done much more than we have any right to expect. Now, we add Stevenson to the mix, probably in a minor role, as is unusually the case for rookies if the starters are back.

If Belichick knew he wasn't going to be picking up any 5th year option, he could have traded out of the round, especially since Chubb was also still around. So, basically, you're saying Belichick screwed up.

Is that really your position on this?

 

[Ollie]

I am not talking about stats. I am talking about watching Sony play. He does absolutely nothing that a UDFA or late round RB couldn't do. He isn't fast, anytime he breaks into the next level he gets ran down instantly. He isn't shifty, he doesn't make anyone miss. He doesn't offer anything as a pass catcher so it pretty much telegraphs what were doing when he's on the field. If he was a good as his stats they wouldn't have spent to picks on RB's to replace him.

I think Sony has been quite different each year. First year he was ok, as you say he took what was there behind a good line. He was good but not spectacular. @nd year he wasnt great but the line was also poorer. Both of the first two years he offered nothing special. Last year he was much better. he was more dynam,ic and broke long runs and made people miss much more often hence the 5.7 a carry. Whether this was due to the added competition or decreased workload who knows but he was good to watch last year