Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by mosslost, Mar 24, 2019.
More Knox blocking
I doubt he'd be there. I'm tempted to install him as my TE3 ahead of Irv Smith. Smith has the tape and the experience but Knox has the athleticism to be a genuine TE1.
Now THAT's the kind of guy I'd like to pick up in the 3rd on a reach, or even with our last 2nd. He won the underwear Olympics in my mind. And I liked the way he went after that DB.
I'm getting more and more comfortable that there is a good possibility that we can find, not a replacement for Gronk, but at least viable TE option for the overall scheme of our offense. I'd be fine with any of Warring, Sternberger, or Knox from the 3rd round down.
Agreed although I think you're under-estimating their value. I think Sternberger and Knox go in the 2nd. Warring will probably last until the 3rd.
Yes, but he may be gone by our pick at 73 if the big three (Iowa x2, Smith) go in the 1st. There's a drop off and Knox, Sternberger, Moreau, and Warring will probably vie for who goes first in that next tier. Any of them could be good options.
I'm good with Warring and Knox.
Really knoxed him over.
Dwayne Allen was a failure as a Tight End for the Patriots. He was brought in to help with the offense, he didn't. At all. So he wound up as a glorified 6th o-lineman. what would be the point in keeping him until preseason? The Patriots were not going to pay him 6.9 million dollars to be a blocker. Better off bringing in other people - draft em, sign em, trade for em, whatever and seeing what they can do. You already know what Allen brought to the table for the Patriots - Nothing.
I strongly disagree. Allen was an essential part of the running game. You seem to think that blocking isn't important. Allen's compensation wasn't $6.9M. I think that a blocking TE was/is worth $4M AAV. I believe that Allen was going to cost $5M, too much.
You can disagree all you want, but the facts are he is not here anymore. Some one at 1 Patriot Place agrees with me. He is not worth it ... not 5 million, not 4 million... he didn't even get those numbers in free agency. If the Patriots offered him 4 million he would still be here. That has to tell you you are significantly over valuing the player and his role with the team.
Dwayne Allen was not brought to New England to be "part of the running game". You have to understand this, right? He was brought to New England to be a Tight End and he wound up being a third rate offensive lineman. That is a failure, no matter how you want to spin it, especially at 7 million dollars for the final year of his contract.
You seem to think its okay to dedicate a roster spot for a guy who only brought blocking to the table for the Patriots. Even more-so now it is more important to have a versatile player in that role where you can some offensive production. And you wanted to keep him on the team thru the camp, taking reps from guys who might actually need them so they can learn to contribute more then he could....
i'm thinking bring Gronk back. He needs to crack 80 then 90 TDs anyway. I kind of thinking/hope that is what is going to happen. Holding out hope.
Trade for Josh Allen
We will likely carry 3 TE's. I expect one to be a blocking TE who will be at best our 10th player in terms of annual receptions after 5 WR's, 1 TE, and 3 RB's. He might even be lower in receptions than our 3rd TE or FB. I agree that such a player isn't worth $5M. Allen isn't here because others thought he was worth more to them than Belichick did.
Tight end names to know in the NFL Draft in a post-Gronk world
DAY 1 OPTION: Irv Smith Jr., Alabama
Smith could be available at the bottom of the first round and maybe into the top of the second. Might the Patriots wait until Day 2 to roll with this Nick Saban pupil? There are some questions about Smith's size at athleticism at the next level.
At 6-2, 242 he'd have to fit in a "move" tight end role. (His size and speed — 4.6-second 40 — are very similar to Aaron Hernandez's coming out of college.) Smith does, however, have experience blocking effectively from a variety of different positions, and he was one of the best big-play receiving threats at his position last year with a 16.1 yards-per-catch average and 8.2 yards after the catch per completion, according to Pro Football Focus.
Again, so long as there's a tight end on the roster to do some of the dirtier in-line work, Smith could be a good fit as a more dynamic play-maker at the position. NFL.com compared him to Patriots first-rounder Ben Watson.
After reading and watching alot of reviews on TE's I've found my binkie. Kahale Warring TE SDSU the kid has speed and good hands and is not afraid to get in there block. He is 6ft 5 and 250 lbs. He has excelled in other sports although not lacrosse. If available in the 3rd round is definitely worth a pick.
1. Allen was brought in to be more than a blocker. You know, replace Martellus Bennett. Get it? There is more to a tight end than blocking. You should expect more.
2. Allens salary for 2019 was to be 6.9 million dollars, with 500k of that as a bonus on the third day of the new season. His cap hit was going to be 7.4 million. BB and Allen talked about keeping him here, but not at those figures. Since he signed in Miami for 3.25 a year, what does that tell you about what the Patriots offered him? Yeah..... So what were you were saying about the cap? That you want to spend 4 million dollars on a guy
3. Sure Blocking is important. Never said it wasn't. What you guys cant seem to grasp is that you don't need to tie up a roster spot with a TE2 who only blocks. Versatility, roster building 101 in New England, in case you haven't noticed.
4. So what else did Allen bring to the team besides blocking? Answer me this - What more did he bring?
5. The last thing is this - You are dead wrong. If Allen were so valuable to this team, he would still be here. Hes not. BB let him walk over a paltry 3.25 million a year.
1. Clearly you never actually watched any games over the past couple years. If you had, you'd know that Allen was relegated to blocking a majority of the time because that's what the Pats needed from him. Especially after Cannon got hurt in 2017. Allen wasn't brought in to replace Bennett. Bennett was a level above Allen. Allen was brought in to be the TE2 L.
2. I'm saying that I've forgotten more about the cap than you''e shown you have knowledge.
3. Dude. You crapped on blocking in your post that I responded to. You made it sound worthless. You clearly don't understand that TEs with few exceptions are asked to block more than 75% of the game. All you did was talk negatively about blocking. Without Dwayne Allen, the Patriots don't have the dominant running game and likely don't make the SB.
4. Allen brough intangibles called professionalism and leadership. Things you haven't shown you understand.
5. I'm not "dead wrong". As I stayed, Correlation doesn't equal causation. You don't seem to grasp that simple concept.
Just quit while your behind.
1. Even with his limitations receiving Allen did a solid job here. He helped the offense as a whole with his run and pass blocking.
2. 3.5 is quite a bit for a blocking TE. Prob worth closer to 2 imo. Who knows how much we may have increased an offer had the Gronk news come out sooner.
3. We tied up our TE2 spot the past 2 years, didn’t seem to hurt us that much. The OL/run blocking was a huge success this past season especially in the playoffs. Allen did his part in this aspect.
4. Besides blocking? Nothing. But you can’t just say he added nothing to our offense if he gave us good run and pass blocking. Guys like him don’t get the credit but they still play a part in the machine.
5. 3 plus mil isn’t paltry when your up against the cap and you have a prospect in Izzo in the fold, and on a cheaper rookie deal. Like I said earlier, who knows what would’ve happened had Gronk retired prior to Allen signing with MIA. Maybe BB would’ve matched or come close to have the veteran back on the team.
The team knew Bennett was gone. They traded for Allen. So yeah... no. Get a grip because the trail ain't hard to follow.
You've forgotten more about the cap than I have ever known? Maybe. But you clearly are not demonstrating it here. Tell me where I'm wrong .
I did not crap blocking tight ends. I crapped on Dwayne Allen. There is a difference. And of course I understand the role of a tight end. There are a variety of roles. However the way this team uses them even guys who were used primarily as blockers could contribute somewhat to the overall game of the team.
He was such a disappointment in his overall game that the Patriots brought an injured Martellus Bennett back and tried to play him ... At some point you got to be able to read the tea leaves here...
And did you really just say he brought intangibles and leadership? to this team? Now I know you are just making stuff up.
Team approached Allen about a haircut. He declined. He is gone. The story is told everyday in the NFL over a few hundred thousand dollars, let alone several million. He was not worth the money. He was a disappointment as a player. It has nothing to do with your cliche talk that sounds impressive but actually adds nothing of value to the discussion.
When they traded for him did you look at his stat sheet and say
"Oh good, a blocking tight end"
"dude snagged 400 yards and 6 tds last year... he can step in for Marty without much drop off... wait til he plays with Brady!"
Izzo didn't play in the fourth preseason game and only caught passes in the first.
He played with the starters early in the second game and then was hurt.
And the year off hurts, not helps.
But he will be a contributor!
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