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Red Zone Problems on Offense for 3 Straight Years

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DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
[Edit: first sentence updated to include week3]

1. The 2021 Pats are only 2 for 8 in the red zone through three games (32nd/last in the NFL). Problem is this issue has been going on 3 years in a row. We have a one-trick pony OC whose play-calling in the red zone is atrocious. Where is the play-action? Where are the slants, or endzone fade routes? Where are targets to tight ends in the endzone?

2. Here are some numbers from the 2019 season when Tom Brady was here:
27th in the NFL in red zone offense.
28th in converting plays that need 3 or fewer yards.
Last in TE touchdowns.


3. I won't say much about 2020 except more red zone woes, dead last in TE production, and also can't blame Cam when the red zone play-calling tried to repeatedly run it every time without any disguise.

In 2021 we have an OC who has no idea what to do with 2 good tight ends. The OC is obsessed with 11-personnel shotgun passes which are predictable.

It has been 3 years in a row of terrible red zone conversions. 2019 even when we had the GOAT QB here, 2020, now 2021. A bucket of excuses every year. Red zone woes in 2021 continue to be something to watch, as the team realizes we need a new offensive coordinator for 2022. Our OC is playing predictable checkers against DCs playing chess.

2019: Red zone and short-yardage failures
2019: Red Zone Issues

2019: "How bad are the Pats in the red zone?"
2020: Patriots "were too predictable in the red zone"
 
Last edited:

Vindicate

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job
Alongside this rebuilding, I think a decent handful of us have been nuanced in our judgment of coaching staff (others haven't, but whatever, nbd) - however, I do think this is the year we can finally get a read on McDaniels and pass some judgment. There are pieces in place for a decent offense, one that has potential to convert, especially with the two TE setup - and so far the first two games have been trending similar to the previous years.

Granted, it has been only two games. But our rookie QB has been convincing enough that it isn't entirely a QB issue. We have the personnel to convert. Now it falls on coaching. If I had to chalk it up to circumstances, I'd say that we have had such a renewal of roster on the offense and shortened practice/pre-season times that maybe the coaching staff is easing them into what's often described as a very complex system of offense. However, if my whimsical emotional judgment had to offer its input, I'd say the signs are pointing to McDaniels not doing well.
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
Alongside this rebuilding, I think a decent handful of us have been nuanced in our judgment of coaching staff (others haven't, but whatever, nbd) - however, I do think this is the year we can finally get a read on McDaniels and pass some judgment. There are pieces in place for a decent offense, one that has potential to convert, especially with the two TE setup - and so far the first two games have been trending similar to the previous years.

Granted, it has been only two games. But our rookie QB has been convincing enough that it isn't entirely a QB issue. We have the personnel to convert. Now it falls on coaching. If I had to chalk it up to circumstances, I'd say that we have had such a renewal of roster on the offense and shortened practice/pre-season times that maybe the coaching staff is easing them into what's often described as a very complex system of offense. However, if my whimsical emotional judgment had to offer its input, I'd say the signs are pointing to McDaniels not doing well.

We spent $56M guaranteed money on 2 great tight ends that have a history of scoring red zone TDs. But you look at the play calling it's clear this OC has no clue how to use 2TEs. He reverts back to his favorite thing on the planet which is spread shotgun. With 2 great tight ends there are so many things we could do in the red zone to befuddle defenses. But we don't do any of that.
 

Run DMC

In the Starting Line-Up
I think the Pats coaching staff needs to get the hook. Josh blows and Bill is getting too old. Matt P is a boot licking clown. We have our QB of the future, it's time to burn the coaching staff and scouting/drafting department to the ground. Mayo our next HC? Or Stefanski from Cle would be interesting.
 

Pape

In the Starting Line-Up
@Ian can you please stop dropkickflutie from posting the same anti-mcdniels screed over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
I think the Pats coaching staff needs to get the hook. Josh blows and Bill is getting too old. Matt P is a boot licking clown. We have our QB of the future, it's time to burn the coaching staff and scouting/drafting department to the ground. Mayo our next HC? Or Stefanski from Cle would be interesting.

I'd be for trying to entice Brian Daboll or Bill O'Brien to back here, in some capacity (perhaps an OC title + Asst HC). I think this team would really contend if we kept BB as hc and changed up the oc. We are wasting time to find out the current oc is a fraud.


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DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
We have two high paid tight ends. You would think we would utilize them in the redzone

We aren't even trying to fake out the defense. 2 TEs at the 10 yard line, defense has to respect the run. But we don't even try to run play action. Through 2 games I think only 1 TE target in the red zone. It's bonkers !!!
 

Pape

In the Starting Line-Up
Brady might win the MVP this year. He's on fire. Brady was clearly carrying mcD for 15 years.

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and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over 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and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over

time for new material dude
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over

time for new material dude

I'm glad you care so much. Really great counter arguments you are offering. Just ignore if you don't want to read about your family member. But keep chiming in and posting here too, you're welcome to, I want to keep discussing this :)
 

denverpatsfan

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
It's definitely a play calling problem. 3 different QBs now. 2 for 7 is atrocious.

Hoping they will unleash the tight ends this coming Sunday. Have to beat this Saints team. They have no shot against the Bucs.
 

Pape

In the Starting Line-Up
I'm glad you care so much. Really great counter arguments you are offering. Just ignore if you don't want to read about your family member. But keep chiming in and posting here too, you're welcome to, I want to keep discussing this :)
dude, Belichick himself would tell you you are wrong, and you still wouldnt stop.

Its in every post. In every thread. Its gone beyond trolling at this point.
 

scott99

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
1. Lazar posted today the 2021 Pats are only 2 for 7 in the red zone through two games. Problem is this issue has been going on 3 years in a row. We have a one-trick pony OC whose play-calling in the red zone is atrocious. Our OC is playing predictable checkers against DCs playing chess. Where is the play-action? Where are the slants, or corner fade routes? Where are targets to tight ends in the red zone?

2. Here are some numbers from the 2019 season when Tom Brady was here:
27th in the NFL in red zone offense.
28th in converting plays that need 3 or fewer yards.
Last in TE touchdowns.


3. I won't say much about 2020 except more red zone woes, dead last in TE production, and also can't blame Cam when the red zone play-calling tried to repeatedly run it every time without any disguise.

In 2021 we have an OC who has no idea what to do with 2 good tight ends. The OC is obsessed with 11 personnel shotgun passes which are predictable.

It has been 3 years in a row of terrible red zone conversions. 2019 even when we had the GOAT QB here, 2020, now 2021. A bucket of excuses every year. Red zone woes in 2021 continue to be something to watch, as the team realizes we need a new offensive coordinator for 2022.

2019: RZ and short yardage failures
2019: Red Zone Issues

2019: "How bad are the Pats in the red zone?"
2020: Patriots "were too predictable in the red zone"
I can’t believe they haven’t reached out to you yet. You obviously know more about football than Belichick and McDaniels.
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
I can’t believe they haven’t reached out to you yet. You obviously know more about football than Belichick and McDaniels.

I'm just reporting the facts. Hence why I cited so many articles. Red zone woes have been happening for a long time. If one is annoyed I am calling it out, should be even more annoyed the red zone woes persist and haven't been fixed for a long time.
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
I know that Brady won't throw 4 Ints.

Dump off safety valve passing only last so long.

Here's a clip of some good examples. Look at this great offensive coordinator Byron Leftwich using a ton of 2TE formations today in the red zone and also utilizing end zone fades and attacking the corner.

 

Gumby

In the Starting Line-Up
@Ian can you please stop dropkickflutie from posting the same anti-mcdniels screed over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over
Just rename him “son of NEM”
 

RIpats88

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
We aren't even trying to fake out the defense. 2 TEs at the 10 yard line, defense has to respect the run. But we don't even try to run play action. Through 2 games I think only 1 TE target in the red zone. It's bonkers !!!

Yeah, I don't get why you sign Hunter Henry and Jonnu smith it you aren't going to use them in the RedZone.

Now, maybe they are trying to ease Mac Jones in. But at some point let the kid throw into the end zone.
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
Yeah, I don't get why you sign Hunter Henry and Jonnu smith it you aren't going to use them in the RedZone.

Now, maybe they are trying to ease Mac Jones in. But at some point let the kid throw into the end zone.

I have a feeling Mac will be an absolute assassin in the red zone if we fix the play calling. A defender HAS to think run assignment first if Henry and Jonnu are both next to the OLine in 12 personnel. It would be almost unstoppable to have both TEs block and release, and use play action pass. A defender cannot stop this if the TE is good, and with 2 good TEs we should be at the top of the league in red zone scoring.

Where is Bill O'Brien ??? Bring him back after this year at Alabama.
 

RIpats88

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
I have a feeling Mac will be an absolute assassin in the red zone if we fix the play calling. A defender HAS to think run assignment first if Henry and Jonnu are both next to the OLine in 12 personnel. It would be almost unstoppable to have both TEs block and release, and use play action pass. A defender cannot stop this if the TE is good, and with 2 good TEs we should be at the top of the league in red zone scoring.

Where is Bill O'Brien ??? Bring him back after this year at Alabama.

If they ran play action on that last RedZone series where the jets had everyone on the line I bet they score.

I think they are being very conservative with Mac. Hopefully they change the play calling around. We are going to need to play better against the saints if we want to win.
 

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