PFT: Matt Patricia to call plays on offense?

[Ring 6]

Because Brady is the exception. He's the only quarterback Belichick has ever had success with, granted the success spanned two decades and included 6 Super Bowl titles. But the fact remains Belichick has a decisively losing record with all of his other quarterbacks combined.


I don't expect that but I was responding to someone calling a Belichick a "quarterback whisperer" which is absurd. Belichick has coached or drafted and coached 22 quarterbacks. Exactly one of them can be called successful as an NFL quarterback (Brady). That's literally a 4.5% success rate, which obviously is very poor.


Mac was the 7th alternate replacement. Cassel had a different head coach when he played in that one pro bowl. Brady threw 50 TD passes in 2007. With the same offense and a different quarterback (Cassel), the 2008 Patriots threw 21 TD passes, which is a 58% decrease in production.


They learned they weren't NFL caliber quarterbacks. Kingsbury never played a snap for the Patriots and he had very limited exposure to Belichick. Kingsbury also had an 11-year coaching career in college before landing the head coaching job in Arizona. Belichick gets 0% credit for Kingsbury's development as an NFL head coach.

O'Connell had 6 pass attempts in one season with the Patriots before his NFL career was over. He worked with 4 different franchises before landing the head coaching job in Minnesota. He also never coached under Belichick who here again gets 0% credit for O'Connell's development as an NFL head coach.

In his first year with the team he drafted and then developed Brady into the GOAT. He was here 20 years.
Other than that he picked Legarm off the scrap heap. No one is judging anyone on him.
Then he drafted and developed a rookie QB and one of the if not the most productive rookie QB offenses in history.
2 shots a GOAT and a rookie A+.
Sounds pretty good to me.

 

[crawhammer]

In his first year with the team he drafted and then developed Brady into the GOAT. He was here 20 years.
Other than that he picked Legarm off the scrap heap. No one is judging anyone on him.
Then he drafted and developed a rookie QB and one of the if not the most productive rookie QB offenses in history.
2 shots a GOAT and a rookie A+.
Sounds pretty good to me.

Again you've gone askew of the original comment I disputed. Someone called Belichick a quarterback whisperer. He may be a defensive genius and a great head coach but he's not a quarterback whisperer... not when he had his hands on 22 quarterbacks and exactly 1 of them currently qualifies as having had a success NFL career.

We'll see what Mac Jones does this season with Patricia calling plays... I for one am not very optimistic he's going to improve much on his rookie campaign that you're still overrating.

 

[Ring 6]

Again you've gone askew of the original comment I disputed. Someone called Belichick a quarterback whisperer. He may be a defensive genius and a great head coach but he's not a quarterback whisperer... not when he had his hands on 22 quarterbacks and exactly 1 of them currently qualifies as having had a success NFL career.

We'll see what Mac Jones does this season with Patricia calling plays... I for one am not very optimistic he's going to improve much on his rookie campaign that you're still overrating.

I’m directly on the comment you disputed.
We have this history:
1) developed the goat
2) had one of the most productive rookie qb led offenses in nfl history with his replacement.

Who has had a better 21 years of qb development?

 

[VJCPatriot]

Again you've gone askew of the original comment I disputed. Someone called Belichick a quarterback whisperer. He may be a defensive genius and a great head coach but he's not a quarterback whisperer... not when he had his hands on 22 quarterbacks and exactly 1 of them currently qualifies as having had a success NFL career.

We'll see what Mac Jones does this season with Patricia calling plays... I for one am not very optimistic he's going to improve much on his rookie campaign that you're still overrating.

I think Jimmy G has done pretty well in San Francisco. He's obviously not to Brady's level but he's taken the 49ers deep in the playoffs multiple times.

I can't think of any other starter level QBs the Patriots under BB have produced outside of JG and Brady though. But I guess picking good QBs is not easy. Just look at how mightily the Browns have struggled for so long with a bad QB at the helm, despite a lot of roster talent, ie Baker Mayfield.

Hopefully Mac Jones will become an upper tier NFL QB in the near future. I would have felt more optimistic if BB had hired an OC/QB coach specifically to mentor Mac, but that's not how he chose to go.

 

[Ring 6]

I think Jimmy G has done pretty well in San Francisco. He's obviously not to Brady's level but he's taken the 49ers deep in the playoffs multiple times.

I can't think of any other starter level QBs the Patriots under BB have produced outside of JG and Brady though. But I guess picking good QBs is not easy. Just look at how mightily the Browns have struggled for so long with a bad QB at the helm, despite a lot of roster talent, ie Baker Mayfield.

Hopefully Mac Jones will become an upper tier NFL QB in the near future. I would have felt more optimistic if BB had hired an OC/QB coach specifically to mentor Mac, but that's not how he chose to go.

Jimmy is 33-14 (.702) in the regular season and 4-2 (.667) in the post season
The gold standard is 243-73 (.768) and 35-12 (.745)
Manning was .702 and .519
Montana was .714 and .695
Rodgers is .677 and .524

 

[Ring 6]

Since Patricia left, the defenses had ranked 7th (won SB), 1st, 7th and 2nd. I’m not a hater, but it definitely seems like anybody they have “coordinating” the defense is successful. How much of it was really Matt?

The 6 years Patricia was DC
They won 12 or more games every year (75-21). Won the division all 6 years.
11-4 in the post season
Had a bye all 6 years.
Went to the AFCCG all 6 years.
Went to the SB 3 of the 6 years.
Won the SB 2 of the 6 years.

The 6 before
They won less than 12 twice. 76-20 regular season
6-5 in the post season
Had the bye 3 times
Went to AFCCG 3 times
Went to the SB twice
Lost them both

Sound like an enormous difference to me.

In the 4 years since
They won 12 or more once are 40-25 in the reg season
Are 3-2 in the post season
Had the bye once
Went to 1 AFCCG
Went to 1 SB
won 1 Sb

So going back to 6 years before Patricia’s 6 year tenure
Comparing 6 with him and 10 without him

With him
Win more reg season 75-21 vs 106-45
More byes. 6/6 vs 4/10
Went to more AFCCG 6/6 vs 4/10
Went to as many SBs in fewer years 3/6 vs 3/10
Won more SBs 2/1

The 6 years Patricia was DC were far more successful than the years that preceded and followed.

 

[crawhammer]

I’m directly on the comment you disputed.
We have this history:
1) developed the goat
2) had one of the most productive rookie qb led offenses in nfl history with his replacement.

Who has had a better 21 years of qb development?

Joe Gibbs won Super Bowls with Joe Theismann, Doug Williams and Mark Rypien in the same decade. Those 3 quarterbacks combined for a 10-0 record with 19 TDs and 7 INTs. That's success with multiple different quarterbacks.

Bill Parcells won Super Bowls with two different quarterbacks and got to a third with another. He also got to a conference championship game with Testaverde. Overall he got to the postseason with 6 different starting quarterbacks. Belichick can't touch what either of these other two head coaches accomplished with a variety of starting quarterbacks.

Belichick drafted Brady as an afterthought at 199. He shares credit in Brady's development but it's pretty obvious by now that Brady is a uniquely gifted quarterback who would have achieved some degree of success with any head coach(es). Mac Jones had a good rookie season but not better than good; he was 14th in TDs and led the 14th ranked passing offense. So we're not inducting him into the HOF yet.

Given what you're presenting as "history" (2 of 22 quarterbacks being worthy of mention), there's just no reasonable argument to be made that Belichick is a "quarterback whisperer."

I think Jimmy G has done pretty well in San Francisco. He's obviously not to Brady's level but he's taken the 49ers deep in the playoffs multiple times.

Garoppolo has made it to the postseason twice. Combined he was 5-19 with 0 TD and 2 INTs in the 4th quarter of the two losses.

The 6 years Patricia was DC were far more successful than the years that preceded and followed.

So why isn't he the DC now? Because he's being blocked by someone more important to Bill personally.

 

[Ring 6]

Joe Gibbs won Super Bowls with Joe Theismann, Doug Williams and Mark Rypien in the same decade. Those 3 quarterbacks combined for a 10-0 record with 19 TDs and 7 INTs. That's success with multiple different quarterbacks.

Bill Parcells won Super Bowls with two different quarterbacks and got to a third with another. He also got to a conference championship game with Testaverde. Overall he got to the postseason with 6 different starting quarterbacks. Belichick can't touch what either of these other two head coaches accomplished with a variety of starting quarterbacks.

Belichick drafted Brady as an afterthought at 199. He shares credit in Brady's development but it's pretty obvious by now that Brady is a uniquely gifted quarterback who would have achieved some degree of success with any head coach(es). Mac Jones had a good rookie season but not better than good; he was 14th in TDs and led the 14th ranked passing offense. So we're not inducting him into the HOF yet.

Given what you're presenting as "history" (2 of 22 quarterbacks being worthy of mention), there's just no reasonable argument to be made that Belichick is a "quarterback whisperer."


Garoppolo has made it to the postseason twice. Combined he was 5-19 with 0 TD and 2 INTs in the 4th quarter of the two losses.


So why isn't he the DC now? Because he's being blocked by someone more important to Bill personally.

What does Joe Gibbs have to do with anything? You think developing a flash in the pan 3 times to win once is better than developing the GOAT to win 6?
That’s bizarre.

If he hadn’t developed the GOAT he would have had opportunities to develop others. It’s pretty much 2 for 2.

Garopollo has been a successful qb who wins. Winning despite his flaws is the sign of good coaching.

The point is that Patricia is a good football coach and the OL is in good hands.

 

[venecol]

I wonder what MP did in Detroit that had most players wanting him out and Stafford saying trade me anywhere but NE?

 

[TheRainMaker]

I wonder what MP did in Detroit that had most players wanting him out and Stafford saying trade me anywhere but NE?

Rumor was he was playing the "I won rings" card and players didn't like that. In fact, there were rumblings they wanted him gone as earlier as the first training camp.

 

[All3Phases]

Rumor was he was playing the "I won rings" card and players didn't like that. In fact, there were rumblings they wanted him gone as earlier as the first training camp.

I normally wouldn’t believe this, but listening to him take credit for Butlers play in the super bowl makes me believe this 100%

 

[TheRainMaker]

I normally wouldn’t believe this, but listening to him take credit for Butlers play in the super bowl makes me believe this 100%

The most bizarre thing about that is Butler got beat every time they ran that in practice - only to put him out there with the game on the line. You'd think they wouldn't run that with the game on the line.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

The most bizarre thing about that is Butler got beat every time they ran that in practice - only to put him out there with the game on the line. You'd think they wouldn't run that with the game on the line.

This is false. Butler got beat a handful of times in practice and BB perfected his technique so that he would run it perfectly in the SB…

 

[TheRainMaker]

This is false. Butler got beat a handful of times in practice and BB perfected his technique so that he would run it perfectly in the SB…

No it's not. And as you'll see in the video, Arrington was supposed to run this play had he not gotten abused by Matthews.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

No it's not. And as you'll see in the video, Arrington was supposed to run this play had he not gotten abused by Matthews.

LOL, who do you think number 21 in the attached pic was? Clearly, Malcolm was practicing this play prior to the SB.

Also, BB at 4:59-5:21, BB says they perfected Malcolm's technique in practice to get the play right.

As usual, BB's coaching wins us a SB.

 

[Ring 6]

This is false. Butler got beat a handful of times in practice and BB perfected his technique so that he would run it perfectly in the SB…

No. They ran it a handful of times in practice in order to teach the technique. Butler picked it up from that coaching. Ernie Adams discovered the tendency in film review.

 

[denverpatsfan]

Where was all this awesome coaching during Super Bowl 52???

 

[Betterthanmost]

This is a lose lose situation for Patricia, if Jones flops, it will be because of him, if Jones does really well, it will be because of Jones. If he stays the same, again the blame will fall on Patricia for not developing him.

 

[Ring 6]

This is a lose lose situation for Patricia, if Jones flops, it will be because of him, if Jones does really well, it will be because of Jones. If he stays the same, again the blame will fall on Patricia for not developing him.

Patricia is the OL coach not the QB coach

 

[TheRainMaker]

LOL, who do you think number 21 in the attached pic was? Clearly, Malcolm was practicing this play prior to the SB.

Also, BB at 4:59-5:21, BB says they perfected Malcolm's technique in practice to get the play right.

As usual, BB's coaching wins us a SB.

You’re arguing something I’m not arguing. When did I say he wasn’t practicing it? And the pic you showed shows Malcolm getting beat. The video clearly says he couldn’t stop it in practice. Bill told him what he needed to do. The video never says they ran it again after Bill spoke to him.