Player Signing Patriots Showing Serious Interest in JuJu Smith-Schuster (Update: Done)

[crawhammer]

Except that Smith did it longer. You can argue with yourself all you want, I don’t agree with you, and neither will the Hall.

Antonio Brown (2010-2021): 2nd in targets, 1st in receptions, 2nd in yards, 1st in TDs, 4x 1st team all pro

Steve Smith (2001-2016): 2nd in targets, 5th in receptions, 1st in yards, 8th in TDs, 2x 1st team all pro

AB's career is more impressive, especially if you add in the SB ring, but they both belong in the HOF.

 

[rabidfireweasel]

I wrote this in another thread, but I don’t think the BB thought Meyers was great locker room guy. The players did, yes- Bill, no. Meyers openly questioned, in the press, the Patriots game planning as early as September. Questioning it in press, that was the beginning of the end for him in NE.
Factor in his mind-numbing lay stupid lateral in the Raiders game, which helped knock them out of the playoffs; and that was it. Bill will forgive a guy when the opponent makes a great play; he rarely suffers mental errors. I think BB felt like he couldn’t trust Meyers to do the right thing with a microphone in his face or a big game on the line. Frankly, he is not good enough to do that and have Bill keep him. So, they replaced him with someone for the same price.

 

[203Pat]

You could take Drew Bledsoe’s numbers and make a similar case, but Bledsoe wasn’t a HOF QB, and Brown isn’t a HOF WR. I don’t disagree that he had HOF talent, but he needed to accomplish more in his career era to be a HOF WR. And you are right, if he wasn’t AB, he could very well have given himself a career that would have gotten him in 1st ballot.

Bledsoe for the most part was considered a top 10 QB for a good 5 year stretch but I don’t think anyone ever made the argument that he was the best in the league at any point. AB on the other hand was easily considered the best, if not top 3, at his position for a 5 year stretch. Hell he even has a combined 5 TDs as a punt/kick returner. The guy has the overall numbers, the longevity, and a ring. He might be one of the biggest D-bags to ever put on a helmet but he’s easily a hall of famer.

Because he made some social media videos? When he was 23?

The guy competes on the field.....thinking he'll keep his mouth a little tighter in this locker room

BB has wanted him for awhile now

The nonstop running his mouth. Crapping on the Browns before the game then losing to them. His Tick Tock nonsense. Him talking **** to the Eagles after the Super Bowl when he had 50 yards. He’s an annoying loudmouth and a middling receiver.

 

[A Defiant Goose]

JuJu is one of those guys I could've sworn has been in the league since like 2012. Didn't realize he was only 26 years old. Good to get a quality wide receiver who isn't on the wrong side of 30

 

[RobertWeathers]

I'm pointing out the 3 quarterbacks had the same passer rating in the same era. Humphries and Fielder were not good quarterbacks. All 3 were very similar by many metrics (completion percentage, TD%, Y/A). Bledsoe had substantially more volume so his raw totals are more (including in undesirable categories). I'd take Bledsoe over both of the other two, no question, but I don't consider Bledsoe one of the better quarterbacks of his era. He's definitely not even a 1% consideration for the HOF.

I agree Drew is not a HoF QB.

If you look at the QBs during Drew's prime years here (94-98) there were a lot of elite QBs. Young, Elway and Marino were complimentary pieces. Favre was pretty much #1. I'd take those guys instead of Drew no question.

Drew was in the Neil O'Donnell, Brunell, Jeff George, Harbaugh bucket.

 

[RodThePat]

Disagree with takes that this is a lateral move or downgrade,

Meyers career averaged 0.13 TDs per game played vs 0.37 for JuJu. This is a huge difference. The athleticism and YAC improvement is also significant.

I like Meyers but everyone seems to forget he set a record with most yards before a td. The lateral also seems forgotten.

We will have to see if it works out but JuJu is a better receiver. Meyers value is inflated by a weak free agent market and a season where he was the top option. The Super Bowl champs were trying to resign him, so obviously valued him, but just didn’t have cap space to do so.

Pretty useless to compare their career because those numbers are greatly inflated by JuJu's 2017/18 production when he was much faster and dynamic pre-injury and played alongside Antonio Brown. He's not that player anymore. Meyers had double Schuster's TDs last year and one played in an incomparably more productive and high scoring offense than the other, for instance.

 

[Steve102]

The nonstop running his mouth. Crapping on the Browns before the game then losing to them. His Tick Tock nonsense. Him talking **** to the Eagles after the Super Bowl when he had 50 yards. He’s an annoying loudmouth and a middling receiver.

You know, I was on this program a year ago. I'm tired of them signing these "coachable Bill type guys". If the guy is a pain in the azz, then someone will have to reel him in. This isn't the 2003 Patriots with Tedi Bruschi in the locker room wagging his finger in a disapproving manner. I am happy that they went and got a guy who is against type. There's no record of this guy being a bad teammate, is there? I am willing to play wait and see.

 

[203Pat]

You know, I was on this program a year ago. I'm tired of them signing these "coachable Bill type guys". If the guy is a pain in the azz, then someone will have to reel him in. This isn't the 2003 Patriots with Tedi Bruschi in the locker room wagging his finger in a disapproving manner. I am happy that they went and got a guy who is against type. There's no record of this guy being a bad teammate, is there? I am willing to play wait and see.

I agree with you on that point. I’m happy we went out and got a guy who doesn’t necessarily mesh with the BB personality criteria. I just wish it was someone with more upside than Juju.

 

[Steve102]

I agree with you on that point. I’m happy we went out and got a guy who doesn’t necessarily mesh with the BB personality criteria. I just wish it was someone with more upside than Juju.

I think this guy has more upside than Meyers, that's why he's here and Meyers isn't.

 

[SlowGettingUp]

If you sort on average YAC above expectation for 2022, and look only at receivers with more than 50 receptions, the order is as follows:

1. Waddle
2. Deebo Samuel
3. A.J. Brown
4. JuJu

NGS | NFL Next Gen Stats

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nextgenstats.nfl.com

That's pretty damn good company.

In terms of production, it's hard to compare the No.1 receiver (lots of targets but more coverage) vs. No. 2/3 receiver (fewer targets but weaker coverage).

 

[crawhammer]

I wrote this in another thread, but I don’t think the BB thought Meyers was great locker room guy.

So you think Juju is going to be "a great locker room guy"?

The players did, yes- Bill, no.

Players opinions matter more in the locker room.

Meyers openly questioned, in the press, the Patriots game planning as early as September. Questioning it in press, that was the beginning of the end for him in NE.

Too bad. Belichick needs to relax. Benching Welker for some innocent foot jokes. Malcolm. Bourne in the doghouse. It's ****ing ridiculous.

Factor in his mind-numbing lay stupid lateral in the Raiders game, which helped knock them out of the playoffs; and that was it. Bill will forgive a guy when the opponent makes a great play; he rarely suffers mental errors.

Here's who I blame 100% for that "stupid lateral"... the Head Coach. Bill Belichick. Kneel down dummy. Pretty simple. Tie-game, it's 3rd-10, 0:03 left in the 4th, Mac doesn't have the arm for a hail mary from that field position (as the HC stated), so take a knee and move onto OT. Absolutely nothing positive could come from running a play there, especially a handoff for a run up the middle. Idiotic coaching, again.

I think BB felt like he couldn’t trust Meyers to do the right thing with a microphone in his face or a big game on the line. Frankly, he is not good enough to do that and have Bill keep him. So, they replaced him with someone for the same price.

Have you heard Juju in front of a microphone?

This is ridiculous, not signing your most dependable receiver because you don't like his presser content and he made the mistake of lateraling to his quarterback who literally laid down like a doormat for Chandler to walk over into the end zone.

 

[Badbisco]

Pretty useless to compare their career because those numbers are greatly inflated by JuJu's 2017/18 production when he was much faster and dynamic pre-injury and played alongside Antonio Brown. He's not that player anymore. Meyers had double Schuster's TDs last year and one played in an incomparably more productive and high scoring offense than the other, for instance.

Excluding 17 and 18 JJSS still scored 0.31 TDs per game, 2.3x JM.

 

[Lagaffe_07]

In terms of production, it's hard to compare the No.1 receiver (lots of targets but more coverage) vs. No. 2/3 receiver (fewer targets but weaker coverage).

They had the same amount of target

 

[rabidfireweasel]

Pretty useless to compare their career because those numbers are greatly inflated by JuJu's 2017/18 production when he was much faster and dynamic pre-injury and played alongside Antonio Brown. He's not that player anymore. Meyers had double Schuster's TDs last year and one played in an incomparably more productive and high scoring offense than the other, for instance.

There are lots of ways to look at it. JuJu’s best year is definitely a bit of an aberration, because Ben threw for over 5000 yards that year. At the same time, his declining production is closely related to having Mason Rudolph and a shot arm/ last legs Ben throwing him the ball.

JuJu was never a burner, he was a 4.5 guy coming out, but plays right to his timed speed. He definitely outruns more people than Meyers. His major injury was a shoulder injury, which might have slowed him down a very small amount- but not much.

We will get to see this Fall.

 

[PatsFan2]

Pretty useless to compare their career because those numbers are greatly inflated by JuJu's 2017/18 production when he was much faster and dynamic pre-injury and played alongside Antonio Brown. He's not that player anymore. Meyers had double Schuster's TDs last year and one played in an incomparably more productive and high scoring offense than the other, for instance.

That's not an indictment of Juju at all Kelce had 12 TD's and RB Jerick McKinnon had 9 receiving TD's. KC knew who they were looking for in the RZ plus Juju was second in Targets on the Chiefs with 101 Meyers is not Juju good yet and the Coaching Staff agrees.

 

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

Am I the only one happy to have his personality in the lockerroom? We need somebody with fire. Somebody who can be a leader. Yeah, he might be considered a diva by some here but we need somebody who can play with a fire lit under them. Last season this team lacked that fire imo. Can JuJu bring that?

 

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

I agree with you on that point. I’m happy we went out and got a guy who doesn’t necessarily mesh with the BB personality criteria. I just wish it was someone with more upside than Juju.

We needed some personality on this team. I'm all for it.

 

[RodThePat]

That's not an indictment of Juju at all Kelce had 12 TD's and RB Jerick McKinnon had 9 receiving TD's. KC knew who they were looking for in the RZ plus Juju was second in Targets on the Chiefs with 101 Meyers is not Juju good yet and the Coaching Staff agrees.

Judging slot receivers by TD production is silly to begin with. How many TDs did Edelman have a year? Or Welker? Or Troy Brown? That's not what the offense generally demands of them, just an added bonus. To cite TDs as the primary indication one player at that spot is better than the other tells me zero, I was just pointing out how meaningless it is. Schuster's TD production in KC has no bearing in who he was as a player, it's not what he was there to contribute. Same with Meyers with the Patriots.

As for the whole "the coaching staff agrees" as an argument of authority, that's just so lame. If you believe Schuster's better that's fine, but that justification is incredibly silly.

 

[PatsFan2]

Judging slot receivers by TD production is silly to begin with. How many TDs did Edelman have a year? Or Welker? Or Troy Brown? That's not what the offense generally demands of them, just an added bonus. To cite TDs as the primary indication one player at that spot is better than the other tells me zero, I was just pointing out how meaningless it is. Schuster's TD production in KC has no bearing in who he was as a player, it's not what he was there to contribute. Same with Meyers with the Patriots.

As for the whole "the coaching staff agrees" as an argument of authority, that's just so lame. If you believe Schuster's better that's fine, but that justification is incredibly silly.

Maybe I misinterpreted your original post when you said Meyers doubled Juju's TD totals. Meyers had a very good year TD wise compared to prior years.

 

[203Pat]

I think this guy has more upside than Meyers, that's why he's here and Meyers isn't.

For me I don’t see a ton of difference but honestly. I don’t know their 40 times and all that but I’d guess Juju’s are probably better so at least there’s that.