Idle thoughts - The "injury" edition

[DaBruinz]

Nate Ebner, Trevor Reilly, Marquise Flowers, Trey Flower, LWaddle , and KVN to name just the ones I know about. They were all added to the long list of starters and contributors that were already out this week, and quite frankly, I'm beginning to worry that at SOME point there will be a tipping point where not even the brilliance of the Pats coaching staff will be able to stem the tide. (BTW- anyone who has any injury updates please let us know)

Marquise Flowers returned to the game and had a tackle in the 4th quarter with on the play that started with 9:26 remaining.. You can verify by looking at the play by play on NFL.Com.

 

[everlong]

1. Steelers opponents offensive passer rating: Browns 32nd, Minnesota 8th, Baltimore 29th, Chicago 26th, Jax 25th, KC 2nd, Detroit 7th, Cincinnati 13th, Indy 22nd, Tenn 28th and GB 19th.

It should be noted they got Minnesota before Keenum got on a roll, got GB against Hundley not Rodgers and BTW Hundley put up a 134 rating against them with 3 TDs and no picks and they got KC after their ridiculously hot start. I think they're in for a surprise in a few weeks.

2. If you happen to use ESPN for standings and the playoff machine they're both wrong on the tiebreaker rules. They have Pitt ahead on common opponents winning percentage. They missed the part about minimum of 4 games of which only KC is common and only Houston will be once the Steelers play them. So in the event the Steelers and Patriots tie in their match up that tie breaker is meaningless. Go figure they would be wrong.

3. Gilmore looks really good. Playing within the system now.

4. Nobody in the AFC scares me. The NFC on the other hand PHI, NO, ATL, Minnesota and LA all look legit. Even though the SB in in Minneapolis I can't help but feel that's the best matchup. Keenum has managed well enough but you have to feel especially behind Bill would contain him and Brady would take that defense apart. I know Minnesota just took apart the Rams but that DL and combination of RB and receivers scares me a lot more in the match ups. PHI, NO and ATL all have legit defense and QBs. Although not a Newton fan the Patriots always struggle against mobile QBs.

5. What a sloppy game. When you win by 18 it's hard to complain too much but against a real foe or even in Miami in two weeks you might not get away with so many mistakes.

6. I wonder if we'll see SG kicking it out of the EZ with all the injuries. Buffalo is 18th in average returns, Miami 15th, and Pitt 31st so we aren't going up against elite units but still.

7. Worst game for the OL in a while. Lots of corrections this week.

8. 10 points by the defense again. I'll be really interested to see what they do against Pitt which is the best offense remaining on the schedule.

9. Brady leads Wentz in every category except TDs but TD:INT ratio is his. I wouldn't care about the MVP except the voters found reasons to give it to Manning when it's been close whereas Brady had to blow everybody out of the water to get it. I know it's the SB MVPs that count but the inequity still bothers me. Much like one getting a pass on sexual harassment and the other being vilified for PSI.

10. I'm pretty sure we'll get Fouts again next week. Uncle, I've had enough.

 

[TB_Helmet]

Thanks for the post Ken, as always.

Initial injury breakdown on BSJ, if people haven't seen yet:

Ebner -- as others have noted, doesn't look good, could be ACL

Waddle -- could be a medial or high ankle sprain. Might miss multiple weeks.

Reilly -- in concussion protocol

Van Noy -- unclear but looks like we might have dodged a bullet. Maybe a calf strain. Had a very slight limp after the game. IMO we can't afford to lose this guy given our LB depth (who would have thought that a year ago??).

Trey Flowers -- hopefully fine, no broken ribs, could just be a pain tolerance issue.

Marquis Flowers -- Returned to game after what is likely just a knee bruise.

So while it seemed like there were a lot of injuries, the only one that has long term consequences could be Ebner. Hats off to him, he made a great call on the fake punt, pretty crazy that he's empowered to make that decision and then pulled it off.

Any word on Cannon? Seems like he'll make a big difference once he returns.

 

[The Brandon Five]

Any word on Cannon? Seems like he'll make a big difference once he returns.

This team is already playing pretty well and at some point will add:

- Cannon (Pro-Bowl RT)
- Hogan
- Mitchell or Valentine
- Slater (Pro-Bowl Gunner)

Also, based on game plan I expect to see the return of Rowe and Gilislee at some point.

Let's hope that Trey's injury heals quickly.

 

[patriot1136]

It's too bad about Ebner, that shakes up a great ST unit. Hopefully Slater is on the mend to help keep things in tact special teams wise. I wonder if maybe D. Jones or D. Travis could be promoted to take Ebner's spot?
I hope the Waddle and Reilly injuries aren't too bad. Both of those guys have been solid and seem to be a good fit here.

 

[PatsDeb]

It felt at times that the Patriots were goading the Dolphins and that they were trying to teach them some type of lesson.

It's funny you should say this. When they did the fake punt, my first thought was, "Man, they do not respect the Dolphins AT ALL and want to show them that." (my second thought was, "why didn't you save this for the playoffs?"). I thought they Pats were a little too loose for their own good, leading to some sloppy play as others have noted, and a lot of chippiness (since when does Danny Amendola get into a verbal fight on every play, and an actual one, leading to the ejection of the other player?). Although maybe it can't be helped with the likes of the Dolphins. It just felt like our guys stooped (a little) to the level of competition, rather than just "doing what they do." Again, maybe it can't be helped. I am not trying to judge, just pointing it out.

 

[IllegalContact]

Eric Lee played like there's no dropoff with him out there......he looks better than crazy man Marsh....dude is def jacked up and is more scary than a guy who has crosses under his eyes

 

[maineman209]

When they did the fake punt, my first thought was, "Man, they do not respect the Dolphins AT ALL and want to show them that." (my second thought was, "why didn't you save this for the playoffs?")

The thing about fake punts is they usually only work once or twice in a season - if they work at all.

However, with the Pats having successfully executed one now (and having attempted - or pretended to attempt - a second one), every opponent from here on through the playoffs will likely feel the need to account for the possibility of a fake punt in their preparations. And that may cause their ST guys to hesitate just a half beat longer to read the situation before rushing the punter on any of Allen's future punt attempts.

Allen has averaged 3.36 punts per game this season. There are five regular season games and (we hope) three playoff games remaining, including the SB. So, that's potentially 27 future punts plays for which this now-revealed fake punt may have a hidden, beneficial effect - versus the element of surprise on one or two future fakes.

Chess to checkers.

 

[Soliel]

I liked the fake. After Pagano pulled that dumb one, I was no longer sure how it was supposed to go. I was like hmm. You don’t line up over by the bench?

 

[PatsDeb]

The thing about fake punts is they usually only work once or twice in a season - if they work at all.

However, with the Pats having successfully executed one now (and having attempted - or pretended to attempt - a second one), every opponent from here on through the playoffs will likely feel the need to account for the possibility of a fake punt in their preparations. And that may cause their ST guys to hesitate just a half beat longer to read the situation before rushing the punter on any of Allen's future punt attempts.

Allen has averaged 3.36 punts per game this season. There are five regular season games and (we hope) three playoff games remaining, including the SB. So, that's potentially 27 future punts plays for which this now-revealed fake punt may have a hidden, beneficial effect - versus the element of surprise on one or two future fakes.

Chess to checkers.

Yeah, I get that, but we've given up the element of surprise for the play to actually work, and now that Ebner is apparently done for the season (which noone could have predicted, admittedly), we've probably lost that hesitation too (as in, the Pats won't try it again anyway with some new replacement for Ebner). I guess I don't like the spot and the opponent where they used it. Seems like they used up a great "once in a season" play on an unworthy opponent in an unworthy spot. It is what it is.

Edit - I forgot about the 2nd one where Allen looked poised to throw it before Miami called a time out? Or did we get a false start penalty? Can't remember, but I guess the Pats were going for the hesitation thing. Maybe they even ramped it up after Ebner went out to show they have several tricks in the bag on 4th down.

 

[maineman209]

For those who may be thinking that Nink might come back from retirement to help out in light of the injury to Trey Flowers ...

 

[maineman209]

... we've probably lost that hesitation too (as in, the Pats won't try it again anyway with some new replacement for Ebner).

Respectfully disagree. Especially against opponents who are particularly aggressive about rushing the punter, if the Pats include Burkhead on that unit, it seems highly likely to make them think just a bit longer now.

And that works in reverse, then, too. Make other teams think that the threat is there by including Burkhead a few times. Then substitute a player for Burkhead who (like Ebner) never handles the football and the element of surprise is restored.

Either way, the Pats have now sown seeds of doubt in the minds of opposing ST coaches and players which they'll be able to leverage in every game the rest of the way. That seems like a much better ROI than waiting and pulling off one successful fake punt later.

 

[Tony2046]

@patfanken - That's one hell of a job for just ad libbing. Enjoyed every bit of it.

Wish you would share more stories of your football days. Maybe you could do that during the next offseason. That would be fun to read.

FYI: In the thread I mentioned I thought MP was asking M. Butler to spy on the QB this year but your explanation in the thread regarding the DPI call made more sense.

I really hope the "replay thread" and/or Bedard will break down some of the blocking schemes that led to those 200 yds.

Noted. I will work on that once the all-22 becomes available.

 

[AtomicDawg]

Injury updates since OP was curious.

 

[Tony2046]

Yeah, I get that, but we've given up the element of surprise for the play to actually work, and now that Ebner is apparently done for the season (which noone could have predicted, admittedly), we've probably lost that hesitation too (as in, the Pats won't try it again anyway with some new replacement for Ebner). I guess I don't like the spot and the opponent where they used it. Seems like they used up a great "once in a season" play on an unworthy opponent in an unworthy spot. It is what it is.

Edit - I forgot about the 2nd one where Allen looked poised to throw it before Miami called a time out? Or did we get a false start penalty? Can't remember, but I guess the Pats were going for the hesitation thing. Maybe they even ramped it up after Ebner went out to show they have several tricks in the bag on 4th down.

I'm not sure what that second "fake" punt was. Was BB trying to get a delay of game penalty on purpose to throw another fake punt play on film but the refs screwed it up by resetting the clock? Odd play to say the least.

 

[signbabybrady]

I'm not sure what that second "fake" punt was. Was BB trying to get a delay of game penalty on purpose to throw another fake punt play on film but the refs screwed it up by resetting the clock? Odd play to say the least.

The snapper and punter knew they were taking the delay of game. I think they were just screwing around after the whistle. Kinda like in basketball when Garnett would goaltend to block shots after the whistle.

 

[Tony2046]

The snapper and punter knew they were taking the delay of game. I think they were just screwing around after the whistle. Kinda like in basketball when Garnett would goaltend to block shots after the whistle.

Could be. Just rewatched it and the reason the refs reset the play clock, imo, is because while the clock was winding down the refs were preventing the snap to allow Miami enough time to substitute their players in. The Pats did one of those leave the offense on the field and then quickly rush the punt team in deals. Anyways they had to reset the play clock. Looks like they took the delay of game to give Allen a bit more room to pin them deep in their zone which almost worked.

 

[PatsDeb]

I'm not sure what that second "fake" punt was. Was BB trying to get a delay of game penalty on purpose to throw another fake punt play on film but the refs screwed it up by resetting the clock? Odd play to say the least.

Yeah, it was weird. It almost looked like it WAS a deliberate delay of game play, like they were pretending to have the punter throw it, but oops, it took too long, so I guess we'll just line up for a regular ole punt now, wink, wink. It's like the game got too boring so the Pats decided to spice it up, sometimes not with the greatest results

 

[captain stone]

Anyone know who will now assume the Protector position? That will not be an insignificant decision.

Ebner unfortunately suffered a classic phony turf injury, same as Edelman did during the pre-season. It became obvious that his season ended after I replayed that moment, especially at half-speed. It's a damn shame that the home field of Tom Brady apparently cannot sustain a viable natural grass playing surface.

 

[mgteich]

Eric Lee played like there's no dropoff with him out there......he looks better than crazy man Marsh....dude is def jacked up and is more scary than a guy who has crosses under his eyes

Eric Lee is a great addition.

However, we may wish that we had Marsh for his ST skills, with Reilly, Slater and Ebner out.