Debate Brady vs Belichick?

[Ring 6]

Brady had fully intended on ending his career as a Patriot. Belichick pushed him out of town in a multitude of ways, all of which have been previously referenced. Belichick is arrogant and stubborn. It cost the team a Super Bowl (52). It's why Gronk "retired." It's why the Patriots led the league in opt-outs. His schtick with the media is totally ridiculous too. Just answer the damn questions.

Brady chose to leave. There is a cost to winning. Every great coach is stubborn because they are committed to their beliefs. That’s a big part of what makes them great.

 

[Ring 6]

You don't know that.

It pretty obvious. They planned to keep him and the money was in line with what they have been paying him call the market.
and yes I do know they never signed him to a 1 year contract.

 

[1960Pats]

Who cares?

The poster I responded to who brought it up. There may be others too.

 

[Ring 6]

The poster I responded to who brought it up. There may be others too.

I don’t understand why how a coach interacts with the media matters to a fan

I guess I should have said “why in the world would anyone care”

 

[1960Pats]

In other news, the Dolphins finally crawled back into a tie in Vegas. If they can win out that will knock the Ratbirds out of the playoffs. Let's go Fins.

 

[moejr]

What if Brady goes one and done. Then does the argument shift to "well if Brady had bill instead of Arians" they needed each other. It was a symbiotic relationship

It's a poor argument anyway. Brady has one of the most talented rosters in the NFL while Bill has one of the worst

Arians is the weak point on TB. Do not like him as a head coach. . Bill having the worst roster is of his own doing. He did not draft well these last few years and it started showing last year.

 

[moejr]

Doubtful they’ll win but they might get there.

KC unfortunately is in a league of it’s own.

KC is beatable. The playoffs are a whole different animal

 

[1960Pats]

I don’t understand why how a coach interacts with the media matters to a fan

I guess I should have said “why in the world would anyone care”

Other than the know-it-alls, I'm sure many fans would like to know answers to questions about the team. Obviously the people who are paid to report on the team care... a lot.

 

[Boomer B]

They would have signed him to that deal this year. Year to year is completely wrong, he never signed a one year contract.

 

[Biffins]

You are not comparing competing prices. The “market” for a player under a capped (and flooded) system is a different market than coaches. Coaches are not subject to the cap. Coaches have something like a 40 year career window while 15 is a ton for players. Therefore there are more candidates, which affects the market.
Your argument would say a stripper is with more than a teacher, nurse or firefighter because they get paid more.

You are not comparing competing prices. The “market” for a player under a capped (and flooded) system is a different market than coaches. Coaches are not subject to the cap. Coaches have something like a 40 year career window while 15 is a ton for players. Therefore there are more candidates, which affects the market.
Your argument would say a stripper is with more than a teacher, nurse or firefighter because they get paid more.

Yeah well considering player salaries are CAPPED and coaches are not skews the argument EVEN MORE in my favour. If player salaries were not capped, presumably they could go higher, and could go higher for the best players. QBs could be making $40m, 45m, 50m per year etc. Coaches salaries won't rise, infact they may even fall if the players have to be paid more.

I am making the very simple observation that if Brady was getting paid $25m per year and BB is getting paid $10m per year, then Brady is worth more for that year to the team. And if players were unacapped, Brady might be making $35m per year etc, making the argument even more skewed.

 

[sb1]

KC is beatable. The playoffs are a whole different animal

That is true. I also don’t think it’s doubtful anymore that Tampa will win it all. They’ve really turned it on at the right time and their offense looks unstoppable when it is on.

 

[FCB02062]

Belichick is 1 season removed from Brady and missed the playoffs. by comparison, Miami had back to back 11-5 seasons immediately after Marino retired and made the playoffs both seasons with Jay Fiedler. Buffalo was back in the playoffs one season after Jim Kelly retired. Doug Flutie led the Bills to 2 playoff appearances in a row. Denver was back in the playoffs after 1 season after Elway retired when Brian Griese led them to an 11-5 record. The Rams made playoffs with Marc Bulger the year after Kurt Warner left.
So if Belichick fails to make the playoffs NEXT YEAR he will have failed at something in which Dave Wanstedt, Wade Phillips, Mike Shanahan, and Mike Martz succeeded - making the playoffs within ONE season of losing the franchise quarterback.
it's already looking like it was more beast than coach Bill given this season. But if Coach Bill leads another rudderless ship in 2021, the die should have been cast "in Brady we Trust"

 

[Biffins]

BS. Bill had 3 straight years he could have given a multi year contract to Brady. Brady wanted a commitment of over 1 year. Bill wouldn’t give it. Instead he kept giving Brady incentive laden 1 year deals. Bill for all his great attributes blew it with the way it ended with Brady. Instead of seeing the GOAT finish with the Pats, we get to watch Cam throw worse then a high school QB.

Frankly I would have been ok having Brady's limelight years here as well. It would still have had a feel good finish. Brady would have helped us win a few more games. We might have made it to the playoffs for a 1 and done. I am ok with that for the 20 FRICKIN years, 9 Superbowl visits. and 6 wins.

Just look at the following table. Look at it again. Then look again. Jesus. This guy has frickin twice as many playoff wins than all the greatest to ever play the game who are all bunched together. COME ON.

Screw BB. I'll never forgive him, Tom should have ended his career with us after all he's given us and all the discounts he took along the way. He just wanted to keep playing and he's still frickin good. BB is just plain wrong. This isn't the second coming of Manning's last lame-duck season.

PLAYOFF WINS​

Table inside Article

PLAYER	TEAM	WINS
Tom Brady	Patriots	30
Joe Montana	49ers/Chiefs	16
Terry Bradshaw	Steelers	14
John Elway	Broncos	14
Peyton Manning	Colts/Broncos	14
Brett Favre	Packers/Vikings	13
Ben Roethlisberger	Steelers	13
Troy Aikman	Cowboys	11
Roger Staubach	Cowboys	11

 

[Boomer B]

You don't know that.

He’s playing with technicalities. NFL contracts only have a certain portion guaranteed, and then it’s up to the team to decide if they want to keep paying the original deal. So after the 2017 season, Brady had a contract but it wasn’t guaranteed. He had to renegotiate it in Aug of 2018. In Aug of 2019 he renegotiated again. While it initially looked like a multi year, only 2019 was guaranteed. Essentially the Patriots were going year to year as they were only guaranteeing one year at a time, but added the extra years to be able to manoeuvre the cap.

Anyone with half a brain can see that he was playing on 1 year deals.

 

[Biffins]

Frankly I would have been ok having Brady's limelight years here as well. It would still have had a feel good finish. Brady would have helped us win a few more games. We might have made it to the playoffs for a 1 and done. I am ok with that for the 20 FRICKIN years, 9 Superbowl visits. and 6 wins.

Just look at the following table. Look at it again. Then look again. Jesus. This guy has frickin twice as many playoff wins than all the greatest to ever play the game who are all bunched together. COME ON.

Screw BB. I'll never forgive him, Tom should have ended his career with us after all he's given us and all the discounts he took along the way. He just wanted to keep playing and he's still frickin good. BB is just plain wrong. This isn't the second coming of Manning's last lame-duck season.

PLAYOFF WINS​

Table inside Article

PLAYER	TEAM	WINS
Tom Brady	Patriots	30
Joe Montana	49ers/Chiefs	16
Terry Bradshaw	Steelers	14
John Elway	Broncos	14
Peyton Manning	Colts/Broncos	14
Brett Favre	Packers/Vikings	13
Ben Roethlisberger	Steelers	13
Troy Aikman	Cowboys	11
Roger Staubach	Cowboys	11

Everyone keeps saying how great Brees is, or Rodgers is, or Wilson is, and how important those guys are to their respective organizations. And how they will retire there. Like Brees seems to be.

And they all have ONE frickin SB win. ONE.

Brady got us SIX. and we kicked him to the curb.

 

[Biffins]

It was noted by many in the beginning that Bill's schtick wouldn't work if the team was losing. We're seeing that now. His sarcastic "great question" comment to Lou Merloni recently made him look like a jerk, especially since the question was appropriate considering that the Pats had just been eliminated from the playoffs.

Exactly, this whole "holier than thou" and "Patriot Way" bs only works when you are winning. Otherwise you just look like a sore loser and a dipshit.

 

[Biffins]

???? The Pats never offered him that deal. It’s been very clearly reported that after 2017 (when Brady was MVP) that Bill was only willing to go year to year and wouldn’t guarantee the $, Brady had to earn incentives. Brady wanted a multi year contract and when Bill wouldn’t budge during training camp 2019 Brady said he’d only sign the 1 year deal if they couldn’t tag him when it’s done. Bill agreed, knowing he would likely lose him. If Bill had offered him a multi year deal Brady would still be here.

Exactly. And Brady had JUST won the 6th SB and he was being treated like trash and was rightly offended.

 

[Biffins]

Brady has just had two of the best halves of his career. The 5 TD passes in one quarter against Tennessee in 2009 was pretty impressive. He obliterated Miami's defense in 2007, during that phenomenal season, that game was pretty close to perfect. But he's never looked any better than he has in his last 4 quarters... 668 yards, 6 TD's, 0 INT's and 65 points.

The Bucs offense is rounding into form just at the right time with Brady at the helm. He's still capable of playing at an elite level and proving himself without Belichick who meanwhile is laying a gigantic turd with another quarterback.

As if none of us could have predicted this after watching Brady for last 20 years. Remember the naysayers in 2013 saying he's done. And he won an NFL MVP and 3 more SBs after that. COME ON!!

 

[crawhammer]

I don’t understand why how a coach interacts with the media matters to a fan

I guess I should have said “why in the world would anyone care”

Because I want to hear accountable answers.

To questions like...

Why are you sticking with Newton at quarterback?

How pissed are you that Brady is ripping it up in Tampa Bay?

What's with the two TE's you drafted in the 3rd round?

Do you consider N'Keal Harry a bust?

Why are you so inept at drafting at the WR position?

What the hell were you thinking with that game plan against Miami (January 3, 2016)?

Eric Alexander covering Dallas Clark, really?

4th-and-2...Do you want to take that one back?

Why did you really bench Malcolm Butler in the Super Bowl?

 

[Biffins]

Brady has just had two of the best halves of his career. The 5 TD passes in one quarter against Tennessee in 2009 was pretty impressive. He obliterated Miami's defense in 2007, during that phenomenal season, that game was pretty close to perfect. But he's never looked any better than he has in his last 4 quarters... 668 yards, 6 TD's, 0 INT's and 65 points.

The Bucs offense is rounding into form just at the right time with Brady at the helm. He's still capable of playing at an elite level and proving himself without Belichick who meanwhile is laying a gigantic turd with another quarterback.

Thank god for Brady, Gronk and the Bucs giving me a team to cheer for the rest of the year to hold my interest.