DRAFT Cole Strange-Welcome to the Pats

[upstater1]

Belichick doesn't care that "no one" agrees with him. He's not running scared.

Now even if he's right in his evaluations given the information he has, the picks he makes still have to work out on the field, and there are a lot of random factors in play for all picks including injuries and the measures of outcomes are statistically insignificant as well. Leading to absurdities like claiming that BB is bad at drafting CB's but great at signing CB's as UDFA's. I can't imagine a credible mechanism for that, but I would love for someone to ask BB about that perception to hear what he says.

I really said nothing about whether scouts agree with Belichick or not, nor did I say anything about Belichick being bad at drafting CBs.

I made 2 easy points:

1. If Belichick doesn't think very much of the players in this range, most of whom were at positions of need, speed on defense, front 7, CBs, then this doesn't bode very well for the rest of the draft.

2. CB is a much bigger need than OG. Malcolm Butler and Jalen Mills are who we have there to start right now.

Put these two points together and the selection of Strange over the CBs must mean that Belichick doesn't believe the CBs were good value, or for that matter, any good.

We'll also be comparing Strange in the future to players like Darian Kinnard and Sean Rhyan, who are likely the next 2 guards off the board.

 

[XLIX]

Snead told you his obscure school off the top of his head…. they knew exactly who the player was.

The kid is a great guard prospect, one of the best in this draft class. I didn’t expect or want a guard, but then nobody does.

No. He was a 3rd to 4th round prospect, not a "great guard prospect".

If he turns into a Pro Bowl guard where he was projected or drafted will be irrelevant.

Get back to us when that happens.

Oh and what happens if he doesn't turn into a Pro Bowl guard, but the guy we got rid of does..?

 

[crawhammer]

So the player sucks… do we have you down on record?

The pick sucks. They could have taken him much later than the friggin 1st round. You can put me on record as saying Cole Strange will not be Logan Mankins. You can also put on record as saying Belichick is getting thoroughly outdone by many other GM's around the league including now Joe Douglas of the NYJ. Jermaine Johnson is going to have a bigger impact than Strange so I'll start there because we could have had JJII falling into our lap too. I'll also keep a close eye on all of the DB's taken after Belichick traded #21... McDuffie, Elam and Hill all landing in the AFC. We could all be raving about any one of those players today but instead we're trying to figure out who's the creampuff that no one has ever heard of before.

 

[skinnydog]

Offensive line was a glaring need. They have ten more picks, plenty of ammo to move around and pick more great prospects. This draft is really deep.

If the draft is really deep, they could have gotten a good guard later

 

[Rob0729]

Again, I'll repeat myself. Just because the Pats were being cheap, does not make the player a failure as a draft pick, it just makes the Pats cheap.

Chandler Jones played at a pro bowl level with the Patriots. As you observed Chandler Jones even elevated his game to a higher level with the Cardinals, reaching all-pro status. But again this just continues to prove that his talent was well worth the draft pick.

Reiterating the point of the reply, that people don't seem to get, Chandler Jones is not a 'failure' as a draft pick simply because he was not offered a 2nd contract by the Patriots as the previous poster stated. It just means that he played really, really well, and the Patriots were being CHEAP. So they traded him instead of PAYING what he was actually worth in free agency. To state that a player didn't reach his 2nd contract with the Patriots is a failure of a draft pick is a fallacy of logic for the particular case of Chandler Jones. You have to look at what he did after he was traded, and he did extremely well by any measure.

I guess I wasn't following the thread. I was just responding to you about the cheap part and that is why they got rid of him.

 

[neuronet]

So umm...this will help our defense stop the Bills right?

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Your revisionist history won't help you here. McCourty was widely seen as the 3rd or 4th best CB in that year's draft and was the 3rd CB selected. I googled "2010 Mock Draft" and the first 2 I clicked on (Peter King and Fox Sports) each had McCourty going late in the first round.

Absolutely no one was confused when NE took him at #27. That was almost exactly where he was expected to go.

Try again. I'm telling you what the talking heads were saying on TV. After the Pats took him at 27th overall, there was a long pause before Mayock goes off on his special teams ability. And there were a lot of people here on this board who were pissed because they wanted the Pats to draft Sergio Kindle.

 

[Wozzy]

No. He was a 3rd to 4th round prospect, not a "great guard prospect".

Mel Kiper doesn’t set the big board for pro teams.

Get back to us when that happens.

Oh and what happens if he doesn't turn into a Pro Bowl guard, but the guy we got rid of does..?

You won’t admit you were wrong if he does… I’ll try to remember to come back to remind you.

 

[DW Toys]

Love all the people ignoring McMillan (age 26) who was looking the part in camp before injury, McGrone (age 22) that slipped last year because of an injury and was viewed as a pick for 2023. Not to mention the trade for Mack Wilson (age 24) and the signing of Jabril Peppers (age 26). I mean take away Bentley and those 4 is completely different LB corp than last year. They got younger. Faster? We'll see but they've done moves to try to get younger and fast already. Just gotta see if it worked out.

and I really don't want to hear about how "none of those guys is a guarantee" because the same could be said for 3 LBs you listed.

Cousin JMC,
Your thoughts are outstanding.
I had this Strange kid on my Mocks but later as anybody.

Pros:​

When evaluating prospects who primarily play against lower levels of competition than do those at big-time programs, it is crucial to see them dominate regularly. A clear NFL talent at the FCS level, Cole Strange is a smooth and quick mover who can be used creatively in the run game and pass protection. He gets to space on screens and outside run concepts; he also mirrors well both before and after engaging. Strange has loose hips to hinge and seal. The Mocs’ standout wins with persistent leg drive and people-moving power at the first and second levels of the defense. Strange has proven himself capable of creating space against higher-level competition. The Tennessee native has a strong grip, above-average core strength, and a finishing mentality. Strange has a solid anchor. When entering engagement, the athletic tackle displays sound weight distribution. He has a very flexible frame. He shoots low and inside punches. Further, Strange maintains a wide base and keeps his feet moving through contact. His pad level has gotten better over time. In the run game, Strange constantly looks for work. He gets to the second level easily and is exceptional engaging in space. The starting guard can even perform reach blocks to the second level. In pass protection, Strange sustains blocks with grip strength, change of direction ability, and power. The high-effort lineman is scheme-versatile.

I think even BB knew that slating in Ferentz to start meant more trips for Mac to the ice bath after games.

Whomever did the Draft last year, bring him back.....but I digress.

Bill can mediate his credibility for this Draft by picking up one of the few "blue chippers" that are still available in Round #2. Then you can play the draft slot swap game.

But as you say there are some chips not being correctly evaluated on our forum.
Thoughts:

I think Peppers is a LB here. He's bigger than Nkobe.Dean.

I think I would be all in for CB Andrew Boothe and Chad Muma as an interior LB. To get faster on the D Line Logan Hall is my favorite. Watch he and Cole Strange fight it out at the Senior Bowl.

ILB Leo Chanal should be available at #54. He has size and speed

Speed CB? . Zyon McCollum, CB, Sam Houston State (SR, 6'2", 199 pounds)

Sleeper? Malcolm Rodriguez, LB, Oklahoma State ( 5'11", 227 pounds)


A WR you should not be surprised to see as a Pat is Romeo Doubs, WR, Nevada (SR, 6'2", 201 pounds). I think the Pats have met with him 3 times and E.J. Perry QB from Brown.


I would have either Alabama WR Bolden or Perry pegged for our 7th Round pick.


Future ?It would not offend me if they Drafted Bernhard Raimann, OT, Central Michigan to groom his for when Wynn leaves after this year.

Or I can see BB going after David Ojabo, edge, Michigan for the future upon recovery. He would have been a top ten pick. Now we can play the Draft slot game.
As Example: Would any of us be upset if Bill had Drafted Ojabo at #29? No. So Ojabo at #54, Strange at #29.....It works out to the naysayers.
OK

Now the Navy deal......won't Bill consider LB Diego ***ot ,a three-time All-AAC defender and was the Shrine Bowl defensive MVP

So how do we unravel this Cousins? I have thrown 12 names out there for consideration. If we get 1/4 of them, good for us. But I see an easier path to help Mac and our defense.

These are wouldya/if you coulds-

What if Deebo is still in play?Would you throw the best choices up their plus a player or two for Deebo? The Titans flinched and Howie got A.J. Brown. So at the end of the Draft you had Deebo and a really good Guard plus some lower hole fillers? Would that work for you Cousins?

What if the Raiders were willing to take a lower pick for former first Rounder DL Clelin Ferrell who is stuck in a rotataion in LV? It's not sacks, it's pressures. 35 in the last two years part time.

I wish Groh would read this stuff so he would get more of a perspective.

Just some ideas Cousin. Thoughts?
DW Toys

 

[Wozzy]

The pick sucks. They could have taken him much later than the friggin 1st round. You can put me on record as saying Cole Strange will not be Logan Mankins. You can also put on record as saying Belichick is getting thoroughly outdone by many other GM's around the league including now Joe Douglas of the NYJ. Jermaine Johnson is going to have a bigger impact than Strange so I'll start there because we could have had JJII falling into our lap too. I'll also keep a close eye on all of the DB's taken after Belichick traded #21... McDuffie, Elam and Hill all landing in the AFC. We could all be raving about any one of those players today but instead we're trying to figure out who's the creampuff that no one has ever heard of before.

You were the guy screaming Richard Seymour, Logan Mankins, Devin McCourty and Joe Thuney were a reach back when… you’re literally that guy.

 

[Wozzy]

If the draft is really deep, they could have gotten a good guard later

Why not get the best?

 

[DaBruinz]

I wake up to this. What an embarrassment, glad I didn’t bother staying up. Wasting a first rounder on someone that would have been available in later rounds? Come on, that was a ridiculous first round pick. No LB talent left? Jesus…SMH

Sorry to disappoint you. BB clearly had information that Cole Strange was NOT going to be available in later rounders. He said as much.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

I text with @midwestpatsfan from time to time and he had this to say. Mike is a good dude that knows what he's talking about and isn't afraid to have an opinion.


It's possible I'm too low on Strange, I had a 3rd on him. Tough to argue against Bill and his resume they obviously felt Strange was a top 25-30 prospect and stuck to their boards.

Remember we picked Geneo Grissom before Flowers and Mason so it's about the collective in the end but I get the frustration. A ton of good prospects on the board though, a lot. I suspect we trade up in the 2nd and get a prospect everyone will love

 

[DaBruinz]

So umm...this will help our defense stop the Bills right?

Hmm.. Let's see. If the Offense is on the field MORE than the Bills offense, then yes. It's fewer opportunities for them.. Gives the defense plenty of rest.. Why is that hard to figure out?

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Mel Kiper doesn’t set the big board for pro teams.

You won’t admit you were wrong if he does… I’ll try to remember to come back to remind you.

He’s a Bucs/Tommy fan. He’ll be long gone.

 

[Nehalem]

Again, I'll repeat myself. Just because the Pats were being cheap, does not make the player a failure as a draft pick, it just makes the Pats cheap.

Chandler Jones played at a pro bowl level with the Patriots. As you observed Chandler Jones even elevated his game to a higher level with the Cardinals, reaching all-pro status. But again this just continues to prove that his talent was well worth the draft pick.

Reiterating the point of the reply, that people don't seem to get, Chandler Jones is not a 'failure' as a draft pick simply because he was not offered a 2nd contract by the Patriots as the previous poster stated. It just means that he played really, really well, and the Patriots were being CHEAP. So they traded him instead of PAYING what he was actually worth in free agency. To state that a player didn't reach his 2nd contract with the Patriots is a failure of a draft pick is a fallacy of logic for the particular case of Chandler Jones. You have to look at what he did after he was traded, and he did extremely well by any measure.

Chandler Jones was one of the best draft picks BB ever made.

He was a starter on a team that went to 3 AFCCG and won a SB.

Then he was traded for draft picks that resulted in Thuney, who started for 5 full seasons at a high level, and Malcolm Mitchell, who helped us win the 28-3 game. And trading him freed him space to sign Gilmore.

Anyone who hates on the Chandler Jones pick, and subsequent trade is an idiot.

 

[Rob0729]

Let's face it, five years from now people could be talking about the genius of Belichick for seeing the value in a Pro Bowler/All Pro when others didn't or Strange could be a forever butt of Patriots fans jokes like Harry and Ras I Dowling. None of us know. That is why I never get too upset or excited about draft picks.

I am disappointed in the pick because it looks like the Pats might have been able to get him at least with their second round pick. But otherwise, I think it was a position of need and he looks like he could be a stud if reaches his potential. Still plenty of players on the board that people pegged as first rounders that might fall to at least a place where the Pats might trade up to get.

 

[RIP#40]

How about you go watch Strange's practices for the Senior Bowl? Where he played CENTER after having all of 1 game there his entire career.

He more than held his own against opposing players.

I really wish FANS like you would stop thinking you're smarter than a Coach who has won 8 SBs and been to 12 of them. Belichick is the the GOAT of Football Coaches. Yet YOU think he's trying to show he's smarter than everyone else by picking Strange. A player who is versatile and has a mean streak on the O-line. Seriously.

This, exactly.

 

[Xerostomia]

That reply had nothing to do with cap management but rather your statement that Chandler Jones was a 'failure' as a draft pick because he did not 'stick around' for a 2nd contract. He most certainly was not a failed draft pick. The Patriots were just being cheap as usual. Chandler Jones more than proved his value to the team that he was traded to - 2 all-pro selections and 3 more pro bowls does not make a player a failure.

It's not Chandlers fault that the Patriots couldn't manage their cap well enough to retain their best talent. Somehow Tampa Bay manages to retain most of their best talent year after year, but apparently that's beyond BB's capabilities as a GM. Again it's the team's fault in this case, not the player's.

Fair enough. I was trying to frame my argument around the premise that having a 1st round player stick around beyond the rookie contract is a more successful draft pick for the team, vs controlling him for only 4-5 years and losing him to free agency or trading him (whatever the reasoning). Perhaps failure is the wrong word. Personally, I look at 1st round picks as potential franchise cornerstone players, and when they don't stick around, I look at it as a failure (failure to pick the correct player, failure to develop, failure to retain).

We did get Gilmore via free agency, and he was not a 'failure' for the Bills, but they did fail to retain him, and we benefited from that (perhaps not signing Jones allowed BB to sign him?).

 

[Wozzy]

Has anyone ever been elated with a guard?

The position is more anticlimactic than any other in the draft… it’s more bland than the taste of my dck.

Come game day OLine is where games are won and lost.