By the numbers: Patricia's offense downright offensive

[mike_usagisan]

thank you. There were several plays in the Minnesota game that would have popped if the key blocker made their assignment. The double reverse, Strange couldn't contain his man, pass in the flat to Stevenson, CB runs over the WR attempting to block, play blown up, pass to the flat to Stevenson and he gets taken down by a toe. DO YOUR JOB.

Right, and I think that's coaching. A number of people have said it before, but probably the smallest coaching staff in the NFL accounts for a lot of players not getting the attention/teaching they probably should. I agree with everyone saying that Bill needs to address that in the offseason because 2/3 into the season, this is who the team is.

 

[Patjew]

A lot of fat shaming.

 

[captain stone]

thank you. There were several plays in the Minnesota game that would have popped if the key blocker made their assignment. The double reverse, Strange couldn't contain his man, pass in the flat to Stevenson, CB runs over the WR attempting to block, play blown up, pass to the flat to Stevenson and he gets taken down by a toe. DO YOUR JOB.

I think during the double-reverse (Bourne, right?) it was Thanksdad who had his sh!t pushed-in by the DT... Still have the game on DVR, I'll see if I can find it later... I agree that it could've been a nice gain if properly blocked.

 

[Thelonious]

"Mac has regressed through little fault of his own" you are an apologist who refuses to lay little if any blame at the feet of the QB. If you simply admit that you're a blind Mac homer, it would be easier for everyone.

I'm more middle ground than you think. To me it's 60% on Mac and his decisions making, pocket awareness and movement. 40% on oline and coaching/play design. Which oline is a major product of coaching.

But hey, you don't have to agree with me. You can keep ugh'ing away.

With Matt in place, it is difficult to form a firm jusdgment as to Mac's merits. That said, Mac has shown NO SIGN of having what it takes to overcome the challenges a lousy OC creates. I would think if Mac really were any sort of "franchise qb," we would see SOME sign of Moxie, resilience, command....SOMETHING! As far as I'm concerned, the jury is 100% still out on Mac Jones.

 

[Pats2000]

With Matt in place, it is difficult to form a firm jusdgment as to Mac's merits. That said, Mac has shown NO SIGN of having what it takes to overcome the challenges a lousy OC creates. I would think if Mac really were any sort of "franchise qb," we would see SOME sign of Moxie, resilience, command....SOMETHING! As far as I'm concerned, the jury is 100% still out on Mac Jones.

I agree with that assessment

 

[Pats2000]

This part isn't necessary - just throwing that out there.

Necessary? Is it necessary that I drink my own pee? No, but it's sterile and I like the taste.

 

[Ian]

Necessary? Is it necessary that I drink my own pee? No, but it's sterile and I like the taste.

I'm assuming you know what I mean - ie: that was my nice way of telling you to please tone it down moving forward.

And it's sad that he's gone. Great actor. #RIP

 

[Pats2000]

I'm assuming you know what I mean - ie: that was my nice way of telling you to please tone it down moving forward.

And it's sad that he's gone. Great actor. #RIP

 

[Thelonious]

Top 3 accurate passers in the league right now.

View attachment 47818



Patricia needs to get better scheming up plays in the red zone.

Demonstrating for the kaziilionth time in human history that.."stats are for losers."

 

[Pape]

Yep, it's like the old saying goes: I don't blame you as much as I blame the one who hired you...

That is exactly right. I'm sure Patricia is working diligently at getting better, but honestly he's not doing well vis a vis the Mac Jones skill set... You can see what he wants to do... But it's not working, and no real adjustments have been made to the offense to cover up the inadequacies... The routes are too long, the protection breaks down all too often, or the blockers are out of position leading to multiple drive killing holding penalties... That is all on Matt because those are his jobs... and ultimately on BB because he's left him out in the cornfield all alone... Patricias offense needs to be at least 10% faster... Shorter routes, more dump off guys whatever or however... They just aren't doing it...

And troy brown should be teaching the wrs how to eye the QB instead of just head down route running... But that's for another topic

 

[Twentytothree]

That said, Mac has shown NO SIGN of having what it takes to overcome the challenges a lousy OC creates.

Well, if having a lousy OC works as an excuse for Brady, I guess one can cut Mac some slack.

For me, the Vikings game was not an indication that one needs to blow everything up, but rather that they need to keep working on the details and getting everyone to do their job (as said before).

 

[Thelonious]

That is exactly right. I'm sure Patricia is working diligently at getting better, but honestly he's not doing well vis a vis the Mac Jones skillet... You can see what he wants to do... But it's not working, and no real adjustments have been made to the offense to cover up the inadequacies... The routes are too long, the protection breaks down all too often, or the blockers are out of position leading to multiple drive killing holding penalties... That is all on Matt because those are his jobs... and ultimately on BB because he's left him out in the cornfield all alone... Patricias offense needs to be at least 10% faster... Shorter routes, more dump off guys whatever or however... They just aren't doing it...

Matt working hard at being an OC is like a carpenter working hard at brain surgery. Hammer away all you want, Bud - it ain't gonna work.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

I'd a 3-pronged Trident of Suck: Coaching, QB & OL... The only question is the percentages each of them should be ass-igned...

Nothing at all wrong with the OP; those numbers merely confirm what we've been seeing All Dam Year.

I'm not the kind of guy to say I told you so but I've (I'm sure others have as well!) been saying this for while now. Everything is bad lol.

Trying to specifically lay blame is tough but the OL is #1 imo. They've been bad all year and inconsistent in all departments. Scheme matters but not as much as actual play. You can get away with simple "scheme" and system with exceptional play and commitment from your OL. Just ask Shanahan, Kubiak ... hell in our day we would tell the defense what's coming and you couldn't stop it and that's not just bc of Brady. It's bc we were a machine and as mentally tough as it gets.

Trying to place more blame on Mac or Matt is futile imo. Mac doesn't look like a QB who would have flourished under a better OC if I'm being honest. Mechanics, decision making, pocket presence etc is on Mac but obviously we could have done better than Matty P lol. I mean let's be real we've never heard of coaches who go 6-10/7-11 but Matty landed in a sweet spot after peeing on himself in Detroit.

I'm all for bringing in a more qualified guy or even going and getting a big name but I'm not sure we see that from Bill with his past history.

Priority - OL - it's going to look a lot different if things stand the way they are rn. Tackles are expensive unless you draft them and we might need two starters unless Hines or someone takes over for Onwenu. Moving big Mike yet again but that's one way to save money. If Onwenu kills it he'll be asking for top dollar after what we've put him through lol. Same for Strange maybe they try him at LT, who knows. Either way it's a big change all-around.

WR - we could get out of some contracts and have Kobi up. We've played some ****ty defenses and the only guy that truly stands out is Parker and he's unbelievably unreliable lol. Agholor makes at least one dumb play a game that makes you think of that meme "unlike Agholor!!" Kobi is extremely solid. Improved every year. I'd love him back but no overpaying. He's our 3rd down savior though. Stevenson has led us in rec 2-3 times this year with like 60 yards. Again though playing some bad defenses like Minnesota. It's awesome we put up 26 but need more from targets when they're going up again 2nd and 3rd stringers.

Mac - Same as it ever was. Cut down on the TO worthy plays, he's been better late but how about a whole season. Like beginning to end with some explosive plays. Post-snap processing, pocket presence, mechanics. Literally listed all those last year as things I wanted to see. Circumstances change and aren't great but you would've like to see something to say "ok he's really made strides there" I get it. It's a work in progress.

The TE situation is a disaster though. Henry is legit and but I forget Smith is a Patriot at times. Which is sad bc he is a yac guy that can move around a little. Tough even though he's not a good blocker. Can't really have them on the field together. Not a good situation.

We have money in 23 and some flexibility with contracts but this offense might need a real makeover.

 

[Rob0729]

This year kinda reminds me the years that Ernie Zampese ran the Patriots' offense. There was a lot of confusion those years. They consistently had to burn time outs because Zampese couldn't get the call into Bledsoe in time. There is a lot of confusion this year too. Different, but clearly people are not getting the correct offensive information.

 

[Thelonious]

Well, if having a lousy OC works as an excuse for Brady, I guess one can cut Mac some slack.

For me, the Vikings game was not an indication that one needs to blow everything up, but rather that they need to keep working on the details and getting everyone to do their job (as said before).

I have cut Mac considerable slack in light of the OC issue. All slack having been granted, he still looks hopelessly mediocre to me. I'd wait a while longer in fairness, but so far...no thanks. Nice guy - no doubt - but so what?

 

[Pape]

Matt working hard at being an OC is like a carpenter working hard at brain surgery. Hammer away all you want, Bud - it ain't gonna work.

I don't think that is particularly true... What he doesn't have is experience on the offensive side of the ball... Without that institutional knowledge, he doesn't have the touch or feel to properly execute an offense... You see it in our red zone numbers... He can learn, but it will take time... Too much time considering there are guys who are more suited to running an offense because they have the knowledge base to work from... And it's a shame because there is talent being wasted on this team.

 

[JMC00]

thank you. There were several plays in the Minnesota game that would have popped if the key blocker made their assignment. The double reverse, Strange couldn't contain his man, pass in the flat to Stevenson, CB runs over the WR attempting to block, play blown up, pass to the flat to Stevenson and he gets taken down by a toe. DO YOUR JOB.

No offense is 100% on plays nor has there ever been. Offense did enough to win that game if refs make 2 right calls

 

[borg]

Geno Smith: 19 TDs.....Passer Rating 107.9.........QBR 64.2.....6 Wins

Tua:.................19 TDs.....Passer Rating 115.7.........QBR 82.8......8 Wins

JV Corkster: 6 TDs........Passer Rating 87.3...........QBR 35.2.....4 Wins

 

[captain stone]

This year kinda reminds me the years that Ernie Zampese ran the Patriots' offense. There was a lot of confusion those years. They consistently had to burn time outs because Zampese couldn't get the call into Bledsoe in time. There is a lot of confusion this year too. Different, but clearly people are not getting the correct offensive information.

Yeah by the time Zampese arrived here Bledsoe had been using their version of E-P for 4/5 years, so trying to learn & apply Zampese's version of Gillman-Coryell was similar in some ways to trying to learn a new language from someone who didn't understand your own language...

 

[Thelonious]

I don't think that is particularly true... What he doesn't have is experience on the offensive side of the ball... Without that institutional knowledge, he doesn't have the touch or feel to properly execute an offense... You see it in our red zone numbers... He can learn, but it will take time... Too much time considering there are guys who are more suited to running an offense because they have the knowledge base to work from... And it's a shame because there is talent being wasted on this team.

I guess I think ol' Bill just got a little too clever, a little too taken with his own vaunted exceptionalism, and made a disastrous mistake. Pride goeth before a fall. I understand that reasons can be cobbled together why it wasn't a TERRIBLE idea in prospect, but the fact is, it hasn't worked, at all, so such rationalizations don't mean much.