But It's Not Mac's Fault....

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I missed woody.
60% of the OL. All but 1 receiver TE,RB,FB all were different.

I’m glad that you think 7 of the 11 players on the field are meaningless. Even you know that’s laughable.

What’s laughable is to act like they added impact players that come close to account for the improvement. They lost their 1000 yard receiver and their team HoF tackle. 20 points in two games with Bledsoe. You know the truth, old man.

 

[sb1]

give zappe 39 starts,

Please no. 2 starts was enough.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

Please no. 2 starts was enough.

Yeah don’t need Zappe actually winning a game or two and screwing our draft position.

 

[sb1]

Yeah don’t need Zappe actually winning a game or two and screwing our draft position.

Complete waste of time to play him unless the team wants to build his value up in a trade. They probably won't. He also sucks. He’ll be gone after this season.

 

[Ring 6]

What’s laughable is to act like they added impact players that come close to account for the improvement. They lost their 1000 yard receiver and their team HoF tackle. 20 points in two games with Bledsoe. You know the truth, old man.

When did I say they added “impact players”. What does that even mean? The players they added has an impact on making the team better. That is indisputable.

The running game went from 87 yards/game and 3.3 a carry to 112and 3.8
How much did that contribute to the 3-4 ppg difference the offense added?
Or is a running game not impactful? 3/5 of the OL is meaningless?

You are so twisted into you man love of Brady that you dismiss all reality.
Brady is the GOAT. No one, except maybe you, although I know you don’t really believe it, you’ve just backed yourself into a corner, believes Brady was an elite QB in 2001 and the only reason the team won.

 

[sb1]

When did I say they added “impact players”. What does that even mean? The players they added has an impact on making the team better. That is indisputable.

The running game went from 87 yards/game and 3.3 a carry to 112and 3.8
How much did that contribute to the 3-4 ppg difference the offense added?
Or is a running game not impactful? 3/5 of the OL is meaningless?

You are so twisted into you man love of Brady that you dismiss all reality.
Brady is the GOAT. No one, except maybe you, although I know you don’t really believe it, you’ve just backed yourself into a corner, believes Brady was an elite QB in 2001 and the only reason the team won.

0-2 before the QB change, 14-3 after. Tough to draw any other conclusion than the QB change was the cause of it. Brady had IT from day one as a starter, it was clear as day to anyone paying attention.

 

[Ring 6]

eff 2020....that roster is so far removed from this one

Hoyer started one game in 2022, vs GB, and was replaced by zappe.....so statistically insignificant

zappe started 2 games....again, compared to macs 39, statistically insignificant again......give zappe 39 starts, and give him the same starts mac has had, with this year's roster and schedule, and his numbers would be worse......the coaching staff in NE agrees, and so do 31 other teams


mac is part of the problem......but not THE problem or even the biggest problem......this team has failed him both in coaching and in personnel, and none of this is really up for debate

so yeah, cherrypicking

Can you give me something that Jones has done that indicate good QB play?

We all agree the results with him have been putrid. So in the same time frame if he was good the other QBs who played and are poor would have done worse. They didn’t.
You blame the weapons, then cite weapons that do better with anyone else than they do with Jones.

Honestly, what redeeming qualities do you see?

Show me on film where he isn’t the problem. I’ve seen many many examples where he is.
At the end of the day, do you really want a QB who puts up sucky production but you can think of excuses for him?

Be honest when we got the ball back against Washington did you REALLY believe he would get us a FG? Did you even hope there was any chance at a TD?
Receivers were open. We should have won. He prevented it.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

Complete waste of time to play him. He also sucks. He’ll be gone after this season.

I get the weak arm and the batted footballs at the line. All valid. But maybe one area in which we could improve with Zappe is decision making. Maybe we don’t leave as many plays on the field. Are we still worried about ruining Mac by benching him?

 

[Ring 6]

0-2 before the QB change, 14-3 after. Tough to draw any other conclusion than the QB change was the cause of it. Brady had IT from day one as a starter, it was clear as day to anyone paying attention.

Come on. 2 games? A team that had one of the biggest offseason turnover in history? “IT” means I want to give him all the credit but can’t do I’ll create a quality that can’t be quantified.
I love Brady. But you are in a fantasy world.
If you replace Bledsoe with 2014 Brady you might have an argument, but there is still that pesky little other 10 players on the field issue.

As I said Bledsoe was holding the team back, just like Jones is now.

 

[sb1]

Come on. 2 games? A team that had one of the biggest offseason turnover in history? “IT” means I want to give him all the credit but can’t do I’ll create a quality that can’t be quantified.
I love Brady. But you are in a fantasy world.
If you replace Bledsoe with 2014 Brady you might have an argument, but there is still that pesky little other 10 players on the field issue.

As I said Bledsoe was holding the team back, just like Jones is now.

So just a coincidence then that the very same team went from 0-2 and lifeless to 14-5 and champs after the QB change?

Brady 100% was elite from day one as a starter. He made everyone better. That's what elite QB's do.

 

[Ring 6]

So just a coincidence then that the very same team went from 0-2 and lifeless to 14-5 and champs after the QB change?

Brady 100% was elite from day one as a starter. He made everyone better. That's what elite QB's do.

Use whatever word you want, they turned over the roster and had a slow start. 2 games is not a sample size that is reasonable at all.

like “IT” “he made everyone better” is a way to say you want to give him all the credit but can’t do you will say something unquantifiable.

It’s a shame that 52 other players get no credit, he must have been controlling them with a joystick.

So was Trent Dilfer elite in Baltimore?

 

[cmasspatsfan]

Use whatever word you want, they turned over the roster and had a slow start. 2 games is not a sample size that is reasonable at all.

like “IT” “he made everyone better” is a way to say you want to give him all the credit but can’t do you will say something unquantifiable.

It’s a shame that 52 other players get no credit, he must have been controlling them with a joystick.

So was Trent Dilfer elite in Baltimore?

Aren't you arguing in another thread the Zappes two games is a good sample size?

 

[sb1]

Use whatever word you want, they turned over the roster and had a slow start. 2 games is not a sample size that is reasonable at all.

like “IT” “he made everyone better” is a way to say you want to give him all the credit but can’t do you will say something unquantifiable.

It’s a shame that 52 other players get no credit, he must have been controlling them with a joystick.

So was Trent Dilfer elite in Baltimore?

I don’t recall Dilfer’s presence turning around his team from 0-2 and lifeless to champs or making his team better so I’d have to vote no on that.

Brady was elite right from the start. The team turned things around right away. Either you have it or you don’t. He had it.

A “slow start” in hindsight only. A team we know is good starting 0-2 = “slow start”. Did we know already at the time the Pats were good? Or was 0-2 who they really were? They were 5-11 the year before and literally on a downward trend since Tuna left.

 

[VJCPatriot]

There's plenty of blame to go around for the Patriots having the 31st ranked scoring offense in the entire league.

But let's see what Mac Jones can do against the Colts.

The sharks are starting to circle now, smelling blood in the water.

I'll wait and see how he performs in Germany, but my suspicion is that he's going to fall short of expectations yet again.

 

[captain stone]

So again the question is why? That should not have happened.

Deep down, we all know the answer to to that one: the 9-4 start was a bit of a Mirage... more than a bit, frankly.

 

[captain stone]

you think Keyser Söze is Crawhammer? Interesting

Keyser's been posting here before Crawhammer started posting here, I'm fairly sure of that... I think.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Belichick drafted Richards in the 2nd round because of his intelligence. Didn’t matter he didn’t have athleticism or any football IQ. Still the worst draft pick I’ve ever seen since he was projected to go 3-4 rounds later.

Ras Al Ghul was Bill's worst pick for me. He didn't have 10-15 minutes to think about this pick, he had ALL NIGHT to decide from any player in the draft to take. Yet he takes a guy who's already had major injuries since High School.

San Diego is an example of a team wasting a quarterbacks theoretical talents and potential.

The Patriots are not.

San Diego again is a team that did in fact give skill weapons to their QB. Even if I agree with you in concept, we know Herbert is good because he has the weapons to prove it. The fact that nobody is giving any great examples of a QB with bad weapons being wasted is kinda telling. But it's also hard to find a team with worse weapons than new England

San Diego still has a team huh? Lol.

 

[PATS16N0]

Lol habit.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Mac is nowhere close. He had some confidence it seemed in that first year, but it ain't there anymore. And it's far too noticeable.

So again the question is why? That should not have happened.

They went on a stretch of playing bad teams and teams that didn't make the playoffs after their 2-4 start. They were able to control games by running the football which protected Mac from throwing in unfavorable situations. That all ended when they played Indy where the Colts beat them at their own game and made Mac a passer. As we've seen, Mac and the offense are not capable of playing catch up.

This is why Bill should've prioritized building the O-line to play smash mouth football. And I mean really prioritize it rather than reaching for G's in the 1st round. The offense has no identity.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Tom certainly wasn't an All Pro during his first year, but he clearly stabilized the offense and the team believed in him. It's very similar to what happened with Big Ben year 1 in Pittsburgh. The Pats benefitted from an easy schedule going 9-1 against teams .500 and below (Brady won all 9). That's 63% of their schedule. On the other hand, they were 2-4 against teams .500 and above (Brady was 2-3 and Bledsoe was 0-1). 3 of 6 of those teams were in the playoffs which they went 1-2.

They really weren't that good of a team in 2001. Had they had a tougher schedule, they would've missed the playoffs - especially without Brady playing. And if it weren't for a snowstorm, Oakland would've ran them off the field. They were a totally different animal than the Rams which was west coast based - an offense Bill still struggles with.