Brady forcing balls to other receivers when Amendola is open?

[Deus Irae]

Brady is easy to figure out where he will throw the ball.

Be where youre supposed to be and catch the ball and you will have more targets. Brady will trust you.

Dont be in the right spot or drop catchable balls and you wont get many throws your way. See Stinko as a perfect example.

Right now, Bolden, Vereen and Edelman are excelling in the NE passing game. Almendola is closing on that group.

Dobson and Thompkins are at a crossroads. They need to play better and in a hurry. Boyce must be showing something to get on the field.

I think that what Boyce 'showed' was that Thompkins and Dobson couldn't play that week due to injury, and Collie hadn't been back with the club long enough to get more snaps.

 

[Brady6]

Two media members with All-22 access have picked up on this today. Could be interesting and something to watch going forward, or could just be a product of Brady going through his progressions and Amendola not getting open until he's late in his progression. If nothing else, it should be something of interest to watch, going forward.

As most in can attest to I am hardly a Danny Amendola supporter and I do not think he is anything close to the player we’re paying but this is not even close to accurate.

1. Brady does not throw the ball to the receiver a lot of times he throws it to a spot where the receiver is going to be.
2. The biggest issue I have seen with Amendola when he has played this season is his ability to get open, when he has been open he is generally very good making the catch, of all our receivers with more than 25 targets Danny has the least drops with 3 this season.
3. Amendola was targeted 8 times on Sunday; Edelman was targeted 9 times so Brady is not favoring anyone.

I never cease to amaze me how simplistic and stupid some analysts look at the game, they do not account for progressions, play design or even match ups. On top of that they aren’t on the field in a way that would allow them to read the defense just because a player appears to be open doesn’t mean that Brady doesn’t see the safety cheating up or dropping off his coverage to step in front of the pass. Another reason he may not target him is Brady doesn’t hang his receivers out to be killed which is why Welker has had 2 concussions this year and I cannot remember him having one noted on the injury report in his entire tenure here.

I would also add that if anyone of the more targeted players over the past few games it is Shane Vereen who has 5 dropped passes in the last 3 games and Brady has been going to him more. If Brady didn’t have trust in Amendola or any other receiver they would not be on the field, do you remember how little we saw of Chad Johnson in 2011 when Brady lost trust in him?

 

[Brady6]

Right now, Bolden, Vereen and Edelman are excelling in the NE passing game. Almendola is closing on that group.

Bolden excelling? He has 5 receptions for 43 receiving yards in his last 5 games.

 

[coolguy]

As most in can attest to I am hardly a Danny Amendola supporter and I do not think he is anything close to the player we’re paying but this is not even close to accurate.

1. Brady does not throw the ball to the receiver a lot of times he throws it to a spot where the receiver is going to be.
2. The biggest issue I have seen with Amendola when he has played this season is his ability to get open, when he has been open he is generally very good making the catch, of all our receivers with more than 25 targets Danny has the least drops with 3 this season.
3. Amendola was targeted 8 times on Sunday; Edelman was targeted 9 times so Brady is not favoring anyone.

I never cease to amaze me how simplistic and stupid some analysts look at the game, they do not account for progressions, play design or even match ups. On top of that they aren’t on the field in a way that would allow them to read the defense just because a player appears to be open doesn’t mean that Brady doesn’t see the safety cheating up or dropping off his coverage to step in front of the pass. Another reason he may not target him is Brady doesn’t hang his receivers out to be killed which is why Welker has had 2 concussions this year and I cannot remember him having one noted on the injury report in his entire tenure here.

I would also add that if anyone of the more targeted players over the past few games it is Shane Vereen who has 5 dropped passes in the last 3 games and Brady has been going to him more. If Brady didn’t have trust in Amendola or any other receiver they would not be on the field, do you remember how little we saw of Chad Johnson in 2011 when Brady lost trust in him?

"Another reason he may not target him is Brady doesn’t hang his receivers out to be killed which is why Welker has had 2 concussions this year and I cannot remember him having one noted on the injury report in his entire tenure here."

Let's be honest here, concussions were not really taken seriously until last season. There have been plenty of times wes took a hit and got up wobbly like this
Brandon Browner destroying Wes Welker HQ - YouTube

 

[Brady6]

I think that what Boyce 'showed' was that Thompkins and Dobson couldn't play that week due to injury, and Collie hadn't been back with the club long enough to get more snaps.

While I agree that his opportunity stemmed from what you’ve pointed out I would say he used that to prove much more than what you’re suggesting and I think the young man deserves more credit than that, he played a fine ball game the other day and if posters are going to highlight Amendola catching a 1 yard touchdown pass when he was completely uncovered to win the game the really should throw some appreciation Boyce’s direction because that was made possible by his speed creating the pass interference penalty in the end zone.

 

[Brady6]

Let's be honest here, concussions were not really taken seriously until last season. There have been plenty of times wes took a hit and got up wobbly.

I think that is a falsely, concussions have may not have been scrutinized to the degree they are over the past 2-3 seasons but they’ve always been acknowledged in the NFL, Steve Young retired in 1999 due to concussions and many others have done the same over the years.

No doubt Welker took some hits in his time here but very seldom were they due to Brady hanging him out.

 

[coolguy]

I think that is a falsely, concussions have may not have been scrutinized to the degree they are over the past 2-3 seasons but they’ve always been acknowledged in the NFL, Steve Young retired in 1999 due to concussions and many others have done the same over the years.

No doubt Welker took some hits in his time here but very seldom were they due to Brady hanging him out.

But the concussion test were not as strict as they're now.

Bret favre took hard hits to the head all the time, but was never taken out for a play. bret streak would have been snapped long ago had played under these strict concussion rules.

 

[Kontradiction]

As most in can attest to I am hardly a Danny Amendola supporter and I do not think he is anything close to the player we’re paying but this is not even close to accurate.

1. Brady does not throw the ball to the receiver a lot of times he throws it to a spot where the receiver is going to be.

Yes, but the receiver still has to "get open", I.E. - he has to create separation from the corner/LB/safety covering him quickly enough for Brady to be comfortable in throwing to that spot. If he's not getting open quickly enough, it could be a good reason why Brady isn't looking his way as often as most of us would like, regardless of whether Brady is targeting him or an area.

2. The biggest issue I have seen with Amendola when he has played this season is his ability to get open, when he has been open he is generally very good making the catch, of all our receivers with more than 25 targets Danny has the least drops with 3 this season.

You realize that this is what I was speculating on in my last post that you said "wasn't even closet to accruate", right?

3. Amendola was targeted 8 times on Sunday; Edelman was targeted 9 times so Brady is not favoring anyone.

I've never said he was.

I never cease to amaze me how simplistic and stupid some analysts look at the game, they do not account for progressions, play design or even match ups. On top of that they aren’t on the field in a way that would allow them to read the defense just because a player appears to be open doesn’t mean that Brady doesn’t see the safety cheating up or dropping off his coverage to step in front of the pass. Another reason he may not target him is Brady doesn’t hang his receivers out to be killed which is why Welker has had 2 concussions this year and I cannot remember him having one noted on the injury report in his entire tenure here.

I'm sure Welker had his share here. Think Ryan Clark in 2008 and Eric Smith in 2010.

 

[Triumph]

I think that what Boyce 'showed' was that Thompkins and Dobson couldn't play that week due to injury, and Collie hadn't been back with the club long enough to get more snaps.

No, thats not it.

Boyce has been showing more on the practice field which leads to playing time. Thats always has been the way in NE under BB and always will be the way. BB just doesnt let people play when they are not ready.

New England Patriots rookie receiver Josh Boyce is beginning to turn heads | masslive.com

"You can see him getting better on the practice field, which has eventually here led to some playing time – in the kicking game first, then offensively," head coach Bill Belichick said. "He's been able to, to a certain degree, take the ball and run with it."


Boyce did run with it Sunday, literally. He was targeted five times and made three receptions for 49 yards. The most electrifying of his catches coming on a short pass over the middle. The play nearly stopped before he could turn the corner, but he used a quick juke to get around Browns defensive back Buster Skrine for additional yardage.

 

[Deus Irae]

No, thats not it.

Boyce has been showing more on the practice field which leads to playing time. Thats always has been the way in NE under BB and always will be the way. BB just doesnt let people play when they are not ready.

New England Patriots rookie receiver Josh Boyce is beginning to turn heads | masslive.com

BB had nobody left to play ahead of Boyce. He 'earned' time by not being hurt.

 

[Triumph]

Bolden excelling? He has 5 receptions for 43 receiving yards in his last 5 games.

Overall Bolden is money in the passing game with a 76% catch rate.

I suspect an injury might be hampering him because his last game wast good at all.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

Well first it isnt 55 targets in 3 weeks, that is all season.
He played a ton of snaps in week1.
When your favorite receiver is the open receiver and one of your receivers gets open a lot, you throw to him.

Yep.
Last year Vereen had multiple rock star moments.........flashes that indicated he was capable, even ready, of taking it to the next level. From my own recollection/view, last year he looked fairly consistently able to get open and was a legitimate big gain threat once he caught the pass. This year, seeing these last several games, it looks like his past flashes were the precursor to what would be/is one fairly bad ass NFL "third down" back. It also answers the question: why BB wouldn't want to keep a very solid Woody when it wasn't hitting into his wallet too much.

With the passing threat Brady brings to the table, DCs frequently have less flexibility for defending the Patriots' passing game. The end result of this is Vereen will, sometimes, be covered by a defender that simply doesn't have the overall agility to competitively cover him. Vereen's ability + multiple coverage mismatches = lots of passes thrown his way (at least it should equal this). And when Dobson/Thomkins get back into the game to, hopefully, provide a bit more stretch of the coverage, the numerous pass attempts to Vereen may even increase a little (though Gronk's departure/a lack of a TE threat clouds that reality).

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

No, thats not it.

Boyce has been showing more on the practice field which leads to playing time. Thats always has been the way in NE under BB and always will be the way. BB just doesnt let people play when they are not ready.

New England Patriots rookie receiver Josh Boyce is beginning to turn heads | masslive.com

(A) This whole season I'd guess the WR getting the fewest targets/snaps (not named Slater) is Boyce. (B) as of a few weeks ago, two receivers who were getting A LOT of targets/snaps, Dobson/Thomkins, got injured-have been out-their playing time gone. (C) Immediately after B, Boyce's snaps went way way up.

I personally have no problem whatsoever with BB seeing the injury report, seeing Dobson/Thomkins won't be available, then calling Boyce into his office to say, "Kid you've been doing a hell of a job lately. Congrats, I'm bumping your playing time way up. And can you grab me a cup of coffee and donut on the way out?".
Seriously though, the chronology pretty clearly suggests Boyce's big increase in playing time is due to Dobson/Thomkins being injured. And if that is not the case and their injuries just happened to occur at the same time Boyce earned playing time favor with BB/coaches? That's a pretty big coincidence. Impossible? No. Unlikely? Yes.

With that said, I'm in agreement with you if you are suggesting his increased playing time has resulted in him showing a little something on the field. I'm not saying he lit it up but it looked promising. Yet we are 4 weeks away from Playoff football and Brady is having to break in another rookie. Ouch! Unless Boyce surprises everyone with immediate and solid production, Boyce getting greatly increased playing time just cannot be a good thing.

 

[supafly]

Seriously though, the chronology pretty clearly suggests Boyce's big increase in playing time is due to Dobson/Thomkins being injured.

I would think that is spot on. It's quite possible that he may have been on kick off return duty no matter what, but I find it extremely difficult to believe that he suddenly took over Dobson or Thompkins' roles.

Either way, if he can produce on any level and continue some of the progress that we saw when they got him the ball in space, it'd be a great thing. One way or another we'll obviously need to get as much production as possible to combat the first half nightmares, while also the injury to Gronkowski.

 

[supafly]

I'm not sure if anyone else has pointed it out, because I haven't looked through all 10 pages of the thread, but I thought that I noticed Amendola being open on the left part of the endzone when Brady threw the TD pass to Edelman where he got popped and drew the personal foul.

I could obviously be wrong, but I am wondering if anyone else noticed this. As others on page 1 pointed out, it could be a matter of Brady just being under too much pressure or failing to see someone in the progression soon enough.

We have definitely seen plenty of times where Brady does miss the open man however, so the thread and question is worth pondering.

 

[Triumph]

(A) This whole season I'd guess the WR getting the fewest targets/snaps (not named Slater) is Boyce. (B) as of a few weeks ago, two receivers who were getting A LOT of targets/snaps, Dobson/Thomkins, got injured-have been out-their playing time gone. (C) Immediately after B, Boyce's snaps went way way up.

I personally have no problem whatsoever with BB seeing the injury report, seeing Dobson/Thomkins won't be available, then calling Boyce into his office to say, "Kid you've been doing a hell of a job lately. Congrats, I'm bumping your playing time way up. And can you grab me a cup of coffee and donut on the way out?".
Seriously though, the chronology pretty clearly suggests Boyce's big increase in playing time is due to Dobson/Thomkins being injured. And if that is not the case and their injuries just happened to occur at the same time Boyce earned playing time favor with BB/coaches? That's a pretty big coincidence. Impossible? No. Unlikely? Yes.

With that said, I'm in agreement with you if you are suggesting his increased playing time has resulted in him showing a little something on the field. I'm not saying he lit it up but it looked promising. Yet we are 4 weeks away from Playoff football and Brady is having to break in another rookie. Ouch! Unless Boyce surprises everyone with immediate and solid production, Boyce getting greatly increased playing time just cannot be a good thing.

Nobody knows until he plays with live bullets flying like last Sunday.

He should have caught the TD pass, but you could argue that he was hindered by the left arm and shoulder grabbing. I would say Boyces performance vs the Browns was better than average and earned him more snaps vs Miami.

If Boyce hits the sweet spot of a 66% catch rate or higher and can consistently hover in that area, he is going to cut into playing time for Dobsons 54% CR and Thompkins 46% CR.

 

[Triumph]

Edelman had 9 targets and caught 6 = 66% catch rate

Almendola had 8 targets and caught 4 = 50% catch rate

So, the game is on the line and you have 2 WRs open. Which WR do you choose with time ticking down and needing another TD to win? WR # 1 who in this game catches 2 out of 3 passes or WR # 2 who in this game catches 1 out of 2 passes?

For the season, Almendola has an overall catch rate of 65%. He could very well be the go to guy for the win next game.

Advanced NFL Stats Win Probability - Current Games

 

[RIpats88]

I fully expect amendola to be a BIG part of the offense going forward since gronk is out. He's been getting open. Hell get more looks

One thing I noticed though was amendola was wide open down the seam when brady threw the interception trying to get it to Boyce in the first q

 

[Triumph]

BB had nobody left to play ahead of Boyce. He 'earned' time by not being hurt.

No

Slater wasnt hurt, Devlin was cleared to come back in, Mulligan wasnt hurt, Ridley has caught a pass or two. Collie dressed.

Boyce was listed as the other starting WR opposite Edelman per NFL.com. Makes no sense when Almendola was healthy too.

 

[ausbacker]

I'm not sure if anyone else has pointed it out, because I haven't looked through all 10 pages of the thread, but I thought that I noticed Amendola being open on the left part of the endzone when Brady threw the TD pass to Edelman where he got popped and drew the personal foul.

I could obviously be wrong, but I am wondering if anyone else noticed this. As others on page 1 pointed out, it could be a matter of Brady just being under too much pressure or failing to see someone in the progression soon enough.

We have definitely seen plenty of times where Brady does miss the open man however, so the thread and question is worth pondering.

I did notice it supa but I was watching from the comfort of home on a widescreen television. It wasn't happening at game speed, Amendola was on Brady's blind side and I could only assume that he wasn't his first read as Edelman was open pretty quickly and to me, it seemed like a safe throw to make.