Bill Belichick will meet with the media today at 9:30 a.m

[IllegalContact]

Its actually the opposite, which is why it turned into what it did.
You, without the facts, were saying with certainty that air was taken from the ball, Brady would be a liar and cheater if he denied it, and he will be fined.
I said you can't conclude that without the facts.

If you said all along that you were basing this on a guess and accepted that it was without factual basis, we could have avoided all this, but instead you dug your heels in the sand.

not really.......

if the 11 balls were indeed checked in at 12.5psi, the 50 degree air would not have turned them all to 10.5lb.......that is a fact unless you claim the laws of physics cease to exist at that moment

the caveat:
- the refs measured them wrong

so....it is either a screw up, the claim of 10.5psi at halftime is untrue, or the balls were tampered with.

based on what is there, you don't need many fact to conclude 1 of 2 possible outcomes.

nothing I have said is far fetched or impossible...you seem to be enamored with the idea that you are somehow closer to the truth

 

[Joker]

It is also possible that there is simply a lack of information to say any individual is guilty of anything and that the league will review the process in the offseason

I disa1gree. It is now IMPOSSIBLE to put any of this off to the offseason. Goodell has done this crap before, letting the Patriots twist in the wind for an entire year. He either ANSWERS now or give the reins to someone better qualified to run the NFL operations correctly.

 

[Ring 6]

not really.......

if the 11 balls were indeed checked in at 12.5psi, the 50 degree air would not have turned them all to 10.5lb.......that is a fact unless you claim the laws of physics cease to exist at that moment

10.5 is not even close to a fact

the caveat:
- the refs measured them wrong

so....it is either a screw up, the claim of 10.5psi at halftime is untrue, or the balls were tampered with.

based on what is there, you don't need many fact to conclude 1 of 2 possible outcomes.

nothing I have said is far fetched or impossible...you seem to be enamored with the idea that you are somehow closer to the truth

I am enamored with the fact that we don't know the details, so I don't know what happened nor do you.

Until there is any credible verification that the balls tested at 10.5psi, everything else you say is meaningless.
That is an has been the point. You are basing your conclusion on a rumor, at least twice removed, that has not been corroborated in any way.

The issue isn't with the conclusion you draw its that you draw it based on facts that are nowhere near known to be true.

 

[Fansince77]

I already said it was an assumption, but a logical one.

you just seem to have your heels dug in that it is not possible for any of it to be true......I believe someone let air out.....it looks that way to me. Maybe there's a logical conclusion that says otherwise, but if I were to lay money down, I'd say that someone did let air out

But you`re coming to that conclusion from numbers ESPN came out with, No-one knows that actual mumbers. BB just said they inflate towards the lower end of the range allowed, its easy to then see how it could end up being lower from game conditions, being wet or who knows.....Bottom line, Ball pressure does not win the Patriots games, if it did, why does Stevan Ridley fumble so much? Why does Amendola drop so many passes? Thee is no advantage, Patriots just outclass most teams in the League, been this way for a sold 15 years and gonna be that way for awhile longer.

 

[btdrnks]

ESPN's Chris Mortensen, who broke the news of the NFL's findings

This may not be popular but did I believe Bill Belichick? Yes.

— Chris Mortensen (@mortreport) January 22, 2015

 

[grux]

ESPN's Chris Mortensen, who broke the news of the NFL's findings

This may not be popular but did I believe Bill Belichick? Yes.

— Chris Mortensen (@mortreport) January 22, 2015

The back pedaling has already started. LMAO.

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

Sorry guys for being late to the party.

Michael Wilbon said he believed Belichick and I must have passed out. The 180 the press has taken since BB's presser makes me think something has been leaked to the media that indicates there was no wrongdoing.

and the NFL can't cover this up with as Referees can easily contradict any untruths that might be spoken. Just curious why I don't recall any specific details coming form them (with the exception that the NFL told them to wait until they've made an official statement)

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

"OH....... you said 0.2 psi? I'm sorry, I thought you said 2 psi... My Bad. Well, at least I got the "deflated part" right, no? I'm sorry for the confusion everyone"

Book it. This will be his excuse. Remember, you heard it here first.

 

[BradyManny]

Sorry guys for being late to the party.

Michael Wilbon said he believed Belichick and I must have passed out. The 180 the press has taken since BB's presser makes me think something has been leaked to the media that indicates there was no wrongdoing.

Don't worry, they're still out for blood - Brady's next to bend over and take it from the media. Let's hope he plays his 3:45 press conference as well as Belichick did his.

 

[The Gr8est]

Sorry guys for being late to the party.

Michael Wilbon said he believed Belichick and I must have passed out. The 180 the press has taken since BB's presser makes me think something has been leaked to the media that indicates there was no wrongdoing.

and the NFL can't cover this up with as Referees can easily contradict any untruths that might be spoken. Just curious why I don't recall any specific details coming form them (with the exception that the NFL told them to wait until they've made an official statement)

Someone should ask Wilbon if he still thinks someone should take out Brady's knees.

 

[zydecochris]

There have been several people on this thread talk about what is or is not possible "according to the laws of physics", but there has been some confusion about what is, in fact, possible. It is true that according to the ideal gas law P1/P2 is proportional to T1/T2, but temperature must be in degrees kelvin and pressure should be absolute pressure, not gauge pressure (12.5 psi is gauge pressure). I happen to be a Physics Professor but rather than write a gigantic E-Mail here, let me refer to the link below which quotes Martin Schmaltz at BU, the article is, IMHO, accurate and succinct. The key issue is whether the balls were inflated indoors (at indoor temperatures) or outdoors (at outdoor temperatures), and where the pressure was subsequently measured. For the balls to have been deflated by 1.6- 2.0 psi in the cold weather (which evidently is only rumored), they would have had to be inflated at about 82 degrees F. So: a 1.6-2.0 psi deflation is, in fact, possible under the right circumstances. I hope the link clarifies things.

http://www.boston.com/sports/footba...ut-the-ball/Eocm5m29nIlh0HRBjFWsYO/story.html

 

[IllegalContact]

10.5 is not even close to a fact

while it has not been confirmed either way, it is the default information to use in one potential outcome

to a certain degree it seems that credibility with you is partially based on what you want as an outcome.

Until there is any credible verification that the balls tested at 10.5psi, everything else you say is meaningless.
That is an has been the point. You are basing your conclusion on a rumor, at least twice removed, that has not been corroborated in any way.
The issue isn't with the conclusion you draw its that you draw it based on facts that are nowhere near known to be true.

actually, my conclusion points out 3 possibilities for an outcome

1 - there's a lack of evidence that any individual tampered with the balls
2 - there is evidence that an individual tampered with the balls, but the outcome was unintentional
3 - there is evidence that an individual tampered with the balls, and the outcome was intentional

based on your logic, everything that is going on is based on nothing. which I guess is possible, but I would not bet on it

 

[ctpatsfan77]

It is also possible that there is simply a lack of information to say any individual is guilty of anything and that the league will review the process in the offseason

I disa1gree. It is now IMPOSSIBLE to put any of this off to the offseason. Goodell has done this crap before, letting the Patriots twist in the wind for an entire year. He either ANSWERS now or give the reins to someone better qualified to run the NFL operations correctly.

Pace, Joker. He's not saying that the NFL will table the investigation to the offseason, but that in the offseason they will review the process to improve it.

 

[Ring 6]

while it has not been confirmed either way, it is the default information to use in one potential outcome

to a certain degree it seems that credibility with you is partially based on what you want as an outcome.

What I (and I would assume all Patriots fans) want has nothing to do with gauging credibility of a report from an unnamed source that appears to be vague and has not been confirmed by a single source is 3 days.

Are you really arguing that you believing an unconfirmed report and drawing conclusion from it is a sounder approach than me questioning it until either it is confirmed or the real facts come out?
In other words you believe a rumor and are questioning my bias in not trusting a rumor. Very backward.

actually, my conclusion points out 3 possibilities for an outcome

1 - there's a lack of evidence that any individual tampered with the balls
2 - there is evidence that an individual tampered with the balls, but the outcome was unintentional
3 - there is evidence that an individual tampered with the balls, and the outcome was intentional

based on your logic, everything that is going on is based on nothing. which I guess is possible, but I would not bet on it

No, your conclusion, the one I am disagreeing with, is that air definitively WAS removed from the ball and that if Tom Brady denies it he is a liar and a cheater.

If you had posted your new conclusion before that bull, then there would have been no issue.

I'm not sure how you conclude that questioning whether Mort got the measurements right when no one confirmed it is 'my logic' that everything going on is based on nothing, but nice try at diversion.

 

[sambam94]

sorry, didn't read whole thread...but why did Bellichick talk so much in depth about how crappy their practice balls are. Secondly, why admit to having PSI a little higher in the future? If the requirement before game is 12.5 PSI minimum and the refs OK it, the teams are supposed to try to guess how the weather conditions might effect the PSI every game? That seems silly. Why not just state that the balls where set to legal standards before the game?

 

[IllegalContact]

No, your conclusion, the one I am disagreeing with, is that air definitively WAS removed from the ball and that if Tom Brady denies it he is a liar and a cheater.

If you had posted your new conclusion before that bull, then there would have been no issue.

I'm not sure how you conclude that questioning whether Mort got the measurements right when no one confirmed it is 'my logic' that everything going on is based on nothing, but nice try at diversion.

it was based on the scenario of the current information being accurate.......11 balls will not get from 12.5psi to 10.5psi on a 50 degree day without external action.........not going to happen. completely separate from whether 10.5psi is accurate or not.

you're not questioning Mort's numbers.....you're simply deeming them untrue and not possible until the source you want confirms......great way to be......

 

[Wrath Mania]

sorry, didn't read whole thread...but why did Bellichick talk so much in depth about how crappy their practice balls are. Secondly, why admit to having PSI a little higher in the future? If the requirement before game is 12.5 PSI minimum and the refs OK it, the teams are supposed to try to guess how the weather conditions might effect the PSI every game? That seems silly. Why not just state that the balls where set to legal standards before the game?

True. Why did he talk at all? WHy didn't he just go up there and mime his innocence? SOMETHING IS OFF I TELL YOU IM ON THE CASE.

 

[btdrnks]

True. Why did he talk at all? WHy didn't he just go up there and mime his innocence? SOMETHING IS OFF I TELL YOU IM ON THE CASE.

WHY ALL THE CAPS!?

 

[Ring 6]

it was based on the scenario of the current information being accurate.......11 balls will not get from 12.5psi to 10.5psi on a 50 degree day without external action.........not going to happen. completely separate from whether 10.5psi is accurate or not.

you're not questioning Mort's numbers.....you're simply deeming them untrue and not possible until the source you want confirms......great way to be......

You can make up whatever you want, but the fact is that you said with certainty air was removed and Brady either admits it or is both a cheater and a liar. Its right there in the thread. I said I don't accept Mort's story until its confirmed.

Difference, based on ADMITTEDLY not knowing the facts, you said YOU KNOW he did it.
I said I admittedly don't know the facts, so I draw no conclusion.

This really is pointless. You can continue to go on with you saying you know and me saying no one knows as meaning you are waiting for facts and I already concluded, but is that really where you want to go?

Lets just drop it. You don't have to admit you were wrong, you can just move on.

 

[Bella*chick]

Because they already did that and it ended up as this ****storm.