PatsFans.com - Mobile
PatsFans.com
Search

DRAFT BGC 2021 Pre-Draft/Patriot-Type Prospect(s) thread

2021 Patriots Season:
Upcoming Opponent:
Next Up: at Chargers
Pick Results: NE: 66% at LAC: 34%

Sun
Oct 31st

Current Patriots Twitter Feed:

pazrul72

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job
2019 Weekly Picks Winner
I actually hate high light reels like this and it’s part of why I don’t watch college ball, make one guy miss and then be faster then everyone else for an 80 yard TD doesn’t fly in the NFL. For a RB I would rather see 20 times where he was stopped for a loss in the back field but turned it into a positive play as I feel that translates a whole lot better.
 

BaconGrundleCandy

#1 Mac Jones fan
PatsFans.com Supporter
Your work is as good as your name mmm bacon *drool* and I appreciate the clips and insights as I watch zero college ball and know nothing about the prospects besides height, weight, and position.
Appreciate it. College ball and the draft isn't for everyone but it's an enormous part of team building. I love the whole process though. Everyone has their hobbies I guess.
Just curious about your evaluation as far as what you value, how important to you is production over potential?
To be perfectly honest it's a case by case basis. In general I want to see it especially for certain positions - QB, WR, DE/OLB, RB but it's a deal breaker. Example - how hard can you fault a WR that has a crappy QB or QB that can't pass? Danielle Hunter & Michael Thomas had crappy production, more projection picks but didn't have huge numbers to fall back on. Thomas had 100 rec in three years I believe. You always want to see production but traits, technique and effort are more important.
How big a jump in grade does someone get for hitting prototype size, speed, strength numbers?
A little bit, depends on a few other things. Can they actually utilize all those gifts? Have they in put it together in college? Are they relying solely on those to produce?
Any brain dead meidiot can draft a top 5 guy who has the stats, the school, and the right body type its alot harder when something is missing.

So you have two DEs the first is 6'6 275 built like a Greek god, runs a 4.5, puts up 30 reps, and plays in the SEC. You put on the tape and he has 10 high light reel plays where he flashes but when you watch entire games besides those plays he is invisible. 2nd guy is 6'1 240 runs a 4.9 and does 20 reps, plays in a smaller school. Doesn't have great numbers but every time you watch him he is go go go and while he doesn't get sacks he is a disruptive force that consistently makes the other teams life difficult. What kind of grades are you giving these guys, where are you drafting them, and which one do you want on your team?
Neither are getting a good grade from the sound of your description. Guys that are 6'1/240 simply don't make it in the NFL so I'd gamble on the bigger body earlier but neither are getting high marks. If the smaller guy is running a 4.9 he's almost useless in today's game.
Similar concept but with recievers. First guy is 6'2 225 with 4.3 speed and makes 1 Holy **** catch a game but ends the season with 40 receptions 4 TDs. Versus I'm thinking Eldeman here who only has off the chart quickness everything else being ok at best.
I'm usually always going with the Edleman type. I don't look at X, Z or slot, just receivers so I want a guy to get open, catch and make a play after > prototype
 

pazrul72

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job
2019 Weekly Picks Winner
Appreciate it. College ball and the draft isn't for everyone but it's an enormous part of team building. I love the whole process though. Everyone has their hobbies I guess.

To be perfectly honest it's a case by case basis. In general I want to see it especially for certain positions - QB, WR, DE/OLB, RB but it's a deal breaker. Example - how hard can you fault a WR that has a crappy QB or QB that can't pass? Danielle Hunter & Michael Thomas had crappy production, more projection picks but didn't have huge numbers to fall back on. Thomas had 100 rec in three years I believe. You always want to see production but traits, technique and effort are more important.

A little bit, depends on a few other things. Can they actually utilize all those gifts? Have they in put it together in college? Are they relying solely on those to produce?

Neither are getting a good grade from the sound of your description. Guys that are 6'1/240 simply don't make it in the NFL so I'd gamble on the bigger body earlier but neither are getting high marks. If the smaller guy is running a 4.9 he's almost useless in today's game.

I'm usually always going with the Edleman type. I don't look at X, Z or slot, just receivers so I want a guy to get open, catch and make a play after > prototype
I love draft time, I just don’t have the free time to be more then casually informed, so I appreciate you making it easier for me to be so. Here is where I get confused, maybe I made the stats on the 2nd DE too bad, in the first example you go for the prototype but in the second you want the player/production. I guess I just wanted to understand more what makes you go ooo and give someone a first round grade? My favorite players have always been the undersized big motor huge heart chip on their shoulder guys. IMO there is so little that separates NFL players, drive, work ethic, and I want it more become the difference. I have a signed, framed pic of the original TB, #80 in your program number #1 In my heart because he was just a football player who did whatever it took.
 

BaconGrundleCandy

#1 Mac Jones fan
PatsFans.com Supporter
I actually hate high light reels like this and it’s part of why I don’t watch college ball, make one guy miss and then be faster then everyone else for an 80 yard TD doesn’t fly in the NFL. For a RB I would rather see 20 times where he was stopped for a loss in the back field but turned it into a positive play as I feel that translates a whole lot better.
It's very prevalent in today's game though. It's why guys like Kelce & Kittle are getting screens as well Deebo & T Hill. Everyone is fast but the ability to make a guy miss is just as important. Idk I think every team could use a back like that to make life easier on every other target. Nowadays the line is a little blurred with the WR who turn into RB with the ball in their hands/"just get ball in their hands" guys. Idk I think there's a place for all types. C Patterson and traditional WRs.
I love draft time, I just don’t have the free time to be more then casually informed, so I appreciate you making it easier for me to be so. Here is where I get confused, maybe I made the stats on the 2nd DE too bad, in the first example you go for the prototype but in the second you want the player/production. I guess I just wanted to understand more what makes you go ooo and give someone a first round grade? My favorite players have always been the undersized big motor huge heart chip on their shoulder guys. IMO there is so little that separates NFL players, drive, work ethic, and I want it more become the difference. I have a signed, framed pic of the original TB, #80 in your program number #1 In my heart because he was just a football player who did whatever it took.
So I'm just going strictly off of the profile you gave. Someone who is 6'1 240 can't play on the edge, even part-time. Probably too slow to really make a impact snap by snap at LB esp competing with others and ST would be tough running a 4.9.

A consistent player, albeit smaller like Edleman, Beasley who can contribute even though they'll never be a traditional WR1 is valuable and safer.

I love Troy Brown!! There aren't many of his kind around anymore. On & off the field just a class act.
 

holyredeemer

In the Starting Line-Up
Watching the Tylan Wallace Video, I have to ask. Wouldn't the hand movements that he makes be considered a False Start penalty? He clearly sets at the 2 second mark and at the 4 second mark he moves his hands a half-second before the "snap".
I’ve got a question too. Probably a silly one, so I’ll apologize ahead of time. Are these DB’s not allowed to bump the receivers at all during these senior bowl practices? All the reels I keep seeing are DB’s put into nearly impossible coverage situations. Is it to mostly focus on the DB’s pedal, hips, close etc?
 

BaconGrundleCandy

#1 Mac Jones fan
PatsFans.com Supporter
Watching the Tylan Wallace Video, I have to ask. Wouldn't the hand movements that he makes be considered a False Start penalty? He clearly sets at the 2 second mark and at the 4 second mark he moves his hands a half-second before the "snap".
I've seen some wide outs fix or tighten their gloves in a similar fashion but yes bad habit. Probably won't get called unless it's really egregious though. I know every single coach from offense, defense and ST would kill a WR for a false start.
I’ve got a question too. Probably a silly one, so I’ll apologize ahead of time. Are these DB’s not allowed to bump the receivers at all during these senior bowl practices? All the reels I keep seeing are DB’s put into nearly impossible coverage situations. Is it to mostly focus on the DB’s pedal, hips, close etc?
No silly questions and I believe it is allowed. Nothing more frustrating then a DB in press that doesn't use his hands.

And yea a lot of these drills are putting certain positions in a bad spot, DB especially bc of all the space the opposition has to work with.
 

BaconGrundleCandy

#1 Mac Jones fan
PatsFans.com Supporter
Lots of talk about the jete possibly trading for Watson. There's a great case for Watson but jesus give Sam a real chance. It's been embarrassing how incompetent they've been.

If I'm the GM and Watson is off the table for w/e reason (price too high, someone else had a better offer) I'm approaching the draft like this ...

#2 - Sewell is the target but I really want someone to come up and take a QB here. I'd auction this off for the right price, get another 1st and 2nd next year, plus a 2nd this year.
Anyway Sewell is the target here for a few reasons. First off he's a baby, we're talking multiple games as a pro before turning 21! When you're drafting this high everything matters! You're thinking about right now but absolutely hoping and planning on a cornerstone player. Unbelievable blend of athleticism, size and traits. His footwork/feet are special. It all starts there. + Balance, patience and mobility. So quick & controlled in space. I'll get around to a report but he could be a great player in this league for a long time.
Also I'm putting Sewell at RT to start off with. Becton showed tons of promise, potential and readiness at LT but also leadership. There were times he was tossing dudes out the way and screaming run behind me. Hes King Kong out there. I'm telling Sewell that the job at LT is his but he has to step in the steel cage and beat Becton. I actually don't mind Sewell at RT for a few reasons.
1)The backside lanes and space are important and have potential in LaFleur's run scheme with Sewell there. Look at SF at how wide They stretch the field using in run game. Sewell is perfect for that role.
2)The gap between RT/LT in terms of value isn't nearly as big as it was before. Nowadays lots of teams have multiple good rushers and every good DC with test the whole line.

Sewell and Becton are almost 700 lbs combined, athletic and play nasty. The potential here is incredible.

#23 - R Moore, Toney, Atwell, N Harris, ETN, Yup as much as I hate the thought of taking a RB this early the jete have been rebuilding for half a century now. They don't have time to waste. You have Darnold, a much improved OL and now another weapon to pair with Mims. All three WR can do a little bit of everything but most importantly make you miss. You have your big X in Mims and now your playmaker/X-Factor in one of the three. If they want to go RB take Harris. A safe, versatile pick that will make an immediate impact behind that OL (below). The jete need playmakers so why mess around?

#34 - Deonte Brown - Again why mess around? For those of you that have seen them play, please drop some thoughts on a line featuring Brown, Becton & Sewell. We're talking 1000+lbs right there of mean, mean people. Seriously, why not?

#98 - Tommy Tremble/Nick Eubanks/Tre McKitty - sense a direction here? I'm making it a point to change the attitude, style and talent on the OL overnight (even though it started with Becton) Tremble or Eubanks can make plays in the rec game but also help out in the run game.

5th round go BPA

I'm looking to create a culture. Make a statement and it starts with the los. Sam knows the team is behind him. He gets much need protection help and the run game should be a monster. Plus another rec threat with the second 1st round pick.

@JetFan79 thoughts? You like? You think most jete fans would like?
 

WaterfallJumper

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
@BaconGrundleCandy I'd love your thoughts on a few positions. I'm very late to the game this year. I'll be back with more questions!

DT: Alim McNeill vs Jordan Davis vs Naquan Jones.

WR: Tamorrion Terry vs Nico Collins vs Reggie Roberson

QB: Sam Ehlinger vs Jamie Newman
 

Patsgofor4

In the Starting Line-Up
Definitely, that's really the idea, what I want to do here. Just throw out as many prospects and give a little description on each.


Thoughts on Palmer? Is he a bit of an under-the-radar guy because of the putrid QB play at Tenn? BB seems to like to target offensive prospects with physical talent and untapped potential who drop in the draft because they were held back either by the scheme or their supporting cast and Palmer seems to fit the bill, no pun intended.
 

Patsgofor4

In the Starting Line-Up


“Frank Darby, WR, Arizona State: Talking to an NFL scout after practice, he told me that of the three Arizona State wide receivers to enter the NFL the last few years, it will be Brandon Aiyuk and Darby competing to be the better pro, not N’Keal Harry.”

1612030312241.gif
 

Top