Ben Watson Suspended 4 games to Start the Season

[captain stone]

More roster flexibility early in the season. Guy #54 on the roster who might get scooped up by another team at cut downs becomes guy #53 on the roster and getting cut week 5 means he is more likely to stay on practice squad, if eligible as other teams rosters are set...

It would seem to me that the best way to sneak somebody to the PS would be by including him among the almost 900(!) people flooding the market on Cut-Down Day.

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

It would seem to me that the best way to sneak somebody to the PS would be by including him among the almost 900(!) people flooding the market on Cut-Down Day.

But if you're looking for a quality player, wouldn't you be checking the Patriots cut downs rather than say the Cardinals or Dolphins????Look at how many Pats cuts recently even in off season got picked up by other teams...

 

[Patriot Missile]

I used to be a firm believer in the ped policy until Roger goofball Ghouldell decided that Peyton Manning, didnt even deserve an investigation after his ostrich neck surgery.

Before that, I accepted the suspensions as just, including Rodney’s. After Manning, I really don’t care anymore, as it signifies that it only applies to certain players. This is one of the many reasons on a tall list of why Rodger should be canned because he has created the stigma that it’s ok to rehab for peds with serious injuries only if your one of the faces of the league.

So with that, good for Julian if he did take them to rehab that knee, and everyone else that decides to do the same.

Integrity is non existent with the commissioner, so why should we expect anything different from the players?

 

[Tunescribe]

What's interesting about this is the Patriots signed him anyway knowing he'd miss the first four games.

 

[patfanken]

The PED isn't necessarily Test/a Test variant. It's possible it's growth hormone/HGH. IMHO if administered by an approved physician for a specific injury medical need under strict guidelines limitations and duration, I think it should be allowed (not saying Watson falls into this category). You frighteningly blow out your knee in a game and HGH will best help heal it -- and if true(?) HGH will help it -- I don't see this as a "performance enhancing edge" like using Test. I see this as trying to provide a best fix possible to a gruesome injury caused by a violent sport.
Just my opinion...

The only proviso I would add is that the drug has to be out of your blood stream BEFORE you return to any team activities.

 

[patfanken]

OK, sorry if this has been explained before this, but has Watson ever had a bad test before. There was a time when you got the 4 game suspension after your SECOND bad test. Is that not the case now?

BTW- Isn't 4 games a bit draconian since Watson had retired before he took the doctor prescribed medication and stopped it before he signed. So technically it could be said he wasn't even in the league when the banned drugs were taken.

That being said, the positives are that: 1. a 12 game regular season might be a plus for a 38 year old. 2. The Pats will have a better look at Beck, Izzo and whomever the other guy is after ASJ and Lacosse. 3. If one of the last 3 actually make the 53 man roster, it will be more likely the Pats will be able to hide on the PS once the season is well underway.

 

[Tunescribe]

OK, sorry if this has been explained before this, but has Watson ever had a bad test before. There was a time when you got the 4 game suspension after your SECOND bad test. Is that not the case now?

BTW- Isn't 4 games a bit draconian since Watson had retired before he took the doctor prescribed medication and stopped it before he signed. So technically it could be said he wasn't even in the league when the banned drugs were taken.

That's what I was thinking. You'd think under the circumstances he could be forgiven and not suffer a suspension. I haven't seen any mention of an appeal.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

The only proviso I would add is that the drug has to be out of your blood stream BEFORE you return to any team activities.

Well stated and agreed. That would be a good provision. While GH does do muscle density and maybe it even provides muscle size growth, I believe(?) there isn't firm evidence of the 'beyond genetic potential' growth levels. That's why, IMHO, GH isn't in that point blank competitive advantage category that Test is(which is a clear and unambiguous competitive advantage).

 

[SammyBlueCat]

Regarding testosterone research I believe both sides are right.

There are scams and infomercials on television and radio

There is also some legitimate research

 

[Joker]

I KNOW players used PED's before Goodell...you MISSED MY POINT!! Goodell should have already decriminalized the use of these performance enhancers.He's overseeing an entertainment vehicle staffed by humans intent on delivering punishment at the zenith of human performance.WTF does it matter now whether the players are using HGH??????????????????????????? He should have addressed this issue in 2006! Instead what we;'ve got from this cretinous POS is some tawdry, carny clown show based on "integrituh!"...what the **** is wrong with you Stockholm Syndrome sufferers????????????? Goodell RAPED Tom Brady over a GODDAMED FABRICATED LIE!!! You STILL DON'T GET THIS???????
He's using the PED penalty to SELECTIVELY administer his own brand of Article 46 "INTEGRITY" It's sickening, insulting and more and more infuriating. He IS a scumbag of a human being, a useless, ultra-stupid, super narcissistic jerkoff...open your eyes and ears.

 

[Sicilian]

More roster flexibility early in the season. Guy #54 on the roster who might get scooped up by another team at cut downs becomes guy #53 on the roster and getting cut week 5 means he is more likely to stay on practice squad, if eligible as other teams rosters are set......
Just my rose colored glasses spin on ti....

There's also a really good chance that someone else on the roster goes on IR by week 5, so Watson just slides into that spot.

OK, sorry if this has been explained before this, but has Watson ever had a bad test before. There was a time when you got the 4 game suspension after your SECOND bad test. Is that not the case now?

BTW- Isn't 4 games a bit draconian since Watson had retired before he took the doctor prescribed medication and stopped it before he signed. So technically it could be said he wasn't even in the league when the banned drugs were taken.

That being said, the positives are that: 1. a 12 game regular season might be a plus for a 38 year old. 2. The Pats will have a better look at Beck, Izzo and whomever the other guy is after ASJ and Lacosse. 3. If one of the last 3 actually make the 53 man roster, it will be more likely the Pats will be able to hide on the PS once the season is well underway.

I'm not positive on this, I may have misheard it somewhere, but is that policy only in regards to certain substances, like HGH or recreational drug use? I think the more stereotypical "steroid" type fails aren't given that mulligan. But again, I may be confusing other things I've heard.

 

[Hyped]

The two bodybuilders I've asked about HGH have said it provides nearly immediate increase in their ability to lift more weight, for more reps, over a longer workout session. I'd call that performance enhancing.

Yeah, I'd allow it because if its healing properties...and I'd be OK if every player in the NFL used HGH. A rising tide rises all boats...

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

Look..it's an azzhead policy enforced by the biggest azzole in sports history...the damnable ultra-hypocrite, Roger Stokoe Goodell.Every single time the Patriots take a shot from this scumbag shythole commisoner's office, we sit around here and pro/con the ramifications. The speed,agility and musculature of today's NFL players DEMAND the use of these performance enhancing substances and you all know it. This is all about the goddamned pathological lying MORON holding to a standard that is in essence RIDICULOUS and then enforcing his ****in' harebrained "rules' as he sees (article 46) fit. Time for Roger Scumbagdell to get a punch in the face, a boot in the azz and "screw beat it, jerkoff" sendoff...out of the league and OUR passionate football fan lives. Sick of this jerkoff, this rich kid punk run amok like he's some kind of ****in emperor. My d!ck gets hard just thinking about smashing him in the mouth.

Allow Test/Test variants? Hmmm I don't know about that brother Joker. The potential strength/mass that would open up would make today's current size/strength levels probably very (and very noticeably) obsolete pretty quickly. Do a search for pre Test bodybuilding (1950s I believe) and modern bodybuilding aided by Test. LOL these guys aren't even in the same universe. Take a look at the East German women's olympic weight lifting team from the mid 60s compared to every other weight team (what the East Germans did was recklessly appalling). I know many will think "just working harder". Nope. A genetic potential is real, very real. Once reached that's about the best can be done. Sure through extremely hard work you can mess with the fine edges, but OD on Test (especially, supposedly, the 19 variant) can take you wwwwwaaayyyyyyyyyyy beyond genetic potential.
With that said, it's used probably 100% in muscle and fitness competitions at the professional level. And in football/pro sports I'd be surprised if all aren't taking it to a small degree(or more). I'm not sure on how the low level boost is done, however, if the testing is to check for above 1050 ng/ml and you naturally have 700 ng/ml, hard to believe you wouldn't boost it to, say, 1000. The effects probably won't be BIG but no doubt in my own knowledge it will get you a step beyond potential. But the underlying is, to allow it means an EXTREMELY unnatural size and performance ability, IMHO

 

[captain stone]

Watson's unavailability also underscores just how, shall we say, short-sighted Bill's refusal to draft a TE was.

 

[SBLIII]

Watson's unavailability also underscores just how, shall we say, short-sighted Bill's refusal to draft a TE was.

I don't necessarily call it that way but the talent is short at TE either way. Draft wouldn't have changed it though.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

I KNOW players used PED's before Goodell...you MISSED MY POINT!! Goodell should have already decriminalized the use of these performance enhancers.

That's not an action he can take. The CBA has a whole bunch of very detailed, negotiated language as to how the whole drugtesting regime works (tests, punishments, etc.). And before you say "well, Article 46!", that's not applicable. His Article 46 powers only apply where the CBA isn't specific about or doesn't address stuff. And with respect to PED and substance abuse testing the CBA is very specific.

If the players don't like it they'll have to bring it up in negotiations over the new CBA when the current one expires at the end of the 2020 season. And then they'll have to decide what they're willing to give up to get rid of the testing. Because there's no way the owners are going to let that go without getting a pound of flesh from the players.

 

[DaBruinz]

Testosterone is approved to raise testosterone levels in guys who are hypogonadal. The idea that testosterone leveles decrease with age is not well supported by data. Heavy marketing campaigns by drug companies promoted the notion that loss if male virility is due to low-T, and that testosterone can fix you. None of this is supported by scientific studies and has nothing to do with "healing.". There is lots of folklore at the gym about testosterone and many docs have prescribed it based on marketing and folklore including the things you mention. Controlled scientific studies do not exist to support these claims, which is the reason testosterone is not approved to treat the symptoms you mention. Much more is known about the risks.

NEJM Journal Watch: Summaries of and commentary on original medical and scientific articles from key medical journals

The Testosterone Myth

Clearly you couldn't be bothered to actually look at what I posted. Not gonna bother with yours..

 

[Joker]

That's not an action he can take. The CBA has a whole bunch of very detailed, negotiated language as to how the whole drugtesting regime works (tests, punishments, etc.). And before you say "well, Article 46!", that's not applicable. His Article 46 powers only apply where the CBA isn't specific about or doesn't address stuff. And with respect to PED and substance abuse testing the CBA is very specific.

If the players don't like it they'll have to bring it up in negotiations over the new CBA when the current one expires at the end of the 2020 season. And then they'll have to decide what they're willing to give up to get rid of the testing. Because there's no way the owners are going to let that go without getting a pound of flesh from the players.

Thanks for the edifying reply, QM. I assumed his article 46 power applied in toto to all league concerns.

 

[patfanken]

Thanks for the edifying reply, QM. I assumed his article 46 power applied in toto to all league concerns.

Never let the facts get in the way of an excellent rant. That's my motto.

 

[Joker]

I put nothing beyond this cretin, Ken. Of course it's a bias but one I truly believe is warranted.To me it all goes back to that interview he did in the 90's wherein he claimed he was a Redskin fan growing up and lived in western NY. I investigated this claim thoroughly and found out the truth was he lived in eastern NY near the CT line, went to school in Bronxville and was a NY Jets fan.In fact , his father had a box in Shea Stadium for young three sport star Roger. The lies just multiply with regularity after that.
As QM pointed out, Goodell has nothing to do with the PED testing according to the collective bargaining agreement. Officially. I put nothing beyond this cretin,however. He has shown the willingness to lie and cover his lies with more lies and use his position as a bully pulpit. I find it odd the independent collectively bargained entity that does tests specifically went WAY out of its' way to test a player retired from the league while he was retired. It stinks...as if some anonymous source named Goger Roodell sent a BOLO to the testers. Paranoid? You bet. As far as Goodell is concerned I suspect EVERYTHING.