Be honest: Brady’s legacy and another SB loss

[Gronk]

There is not another QB who can compare to Brady currently (though Mahomes has potential to do so).

What? The rest of your post makes sense but you lost me at the idea that one season and one playoff game can put Mahomes (or anyone) on path of potential to reach 8 Super Bowls. It’s not even worth a thought until someone has made like, 5.

 

[JMC00]

It really is something to see the mental gymnastics people do when it comes to saying Montana going 4 for 4 in SBs is better than Brady going 5 for 8.

Brady gets knocked for going to more SBs in an era where that's not supposed to happen.

My argument for this is in 16 seasons Brady has gone to 8 SB (50%) In 13 seasons Montana went to 4 SB (30%). It's not better to lose earlier in the playoffs. Now if Brady had only won 2 SBs in 8 ya I could see the argument, but he's won 5

Using that dumb argument you would be saying Eli Manning at 2-0 has a better legacy than Roger Staubach 2-2 and John Elway 2-3 which you would be called an idiot if you argued that

 

[anditsgood]

I just don't want to see him lose another one. Last year almost killed me. I'm so sick of these Montana "4-0!!!" mother ****ers

Meh, haters going to hate. what ever, let them dwell in their jealousy, I rather enjoying this ride

 

[jumbo77]

I'll never figure out how people think it is a knock on a qb to go to the superbowl and lose. That means you had a better year than every other qb except the qb that wins.

 

[dannydyn]

I'd rather keep going and losing some of the time, than not making it to the big game at all.

 

[dannydyn]

I'll never figure out how people think it is a knock on a qb to go to the superbowl and lose. That means you had a better year than every other qb except the qb that wins.

The 2 losses to the giants were more on the defense unable to contain Eli and his receivers in the last moments of the game, than on Brady.

 

[denverpatsfan]

17-3
49-3
36-24

Those are the losing scores of Montana's 49ers in three straight one-and-dones. They were defending champs in the first. The last one was particularly bad as they were home as the heavy title favorite and Montana got benched in favor of Young after a disastrous start.

But hey, he's 4-0 in Super Bowls. He's the best!

Regards,
Chris

This is it exactly. Once he lost the 2008 Super Bowl it was over. Joe never lost.

 

[meatface]

The only people who care are Brady haters

 

[1960Pats]

A thread like this come up every year. People were fretting about Brady's legacy before each of the last several Superbowls.. I posted this in the thread preceding the last SB.

The Brilliance of Tom Brady

If the Pats win this SB with Brady at the helm, he will have a score of 1.333. If the Pats lose this SB Brady's score will be 1.389. If, instead, the Pats lose to KC, his score will be 1.444.

Compared to Montana's score of 1.909 any of these secures Brady's legacy as the best SB era QB of them all. Btw, no other SB era QB is worth doing this exercise for. No one comes close to consistently driving his team closer to the ultimate prize than has Brady. His legacy just on aggregate success is beyond secure, it is untouchable.

I've been keeping track of QB playoff success in a different manner.
1 point for making the WC round
2 for making the division round
3 for making the championship round
4 for making the SB
5 for winning the SB

I also kept track of one and done playoffs and the percentage of seasons each QB made the playoffs as a starter.

Brady leads by a huge margin of course. Here's the totals for the top ten of QB's with at least 3 seasons;

Brady - 3.35 (57 points in 17 seasons)
Wilson - 2.29 (16/7)
Ben - 1.87 (28/15)
Flacco - 1.55 (17/11)
Rodgers - 1.36 (19/14)
Goff - 1.33 (4/3)
Luck - 1.33 (8/6)
Newton - 1.13 (9/8)
Brees - 1.12 (19/18)
Manning - 1.00 (15/15)

I also have the totals for the inactive QB's;

Staubach - 3.13 (25/8)
Montana - 2.83 (34/12)
Bradshaw - 2.38 (31/13)
P Manning - 2.28 (41/18)
Kelly - 2.18 (24/11)
Starr - 2.07 (29/14)
Aikman - 2.00 (24/12)
Young - 2.00 (20/10)
Elway - 1.94 (31/16)
Unitas - 1.79 (25/14)

I didn't include the one and done totals but the leader is P Manning by a large margin with 9, which puts him well ahead of brother Eli and Big Ben with 4 each.

 

[1960Pats]

A simpler method of assessment is this: who's better, the athlete with 4 gold medals and 0 silvers (Montana) or the one with 5 golds and 3 silvers (TB)? And what does it do to his legacy if he adds another silver to that tally?

You could also add in bronze medals. That makes it;
Brady 5-3-5
Montana 4-0-2

 

[1960Pats]

Just saying, I’ve heard many a Boston fan hold all of Lebron’s losses in the Finals against him.

That may be because you can add up the total number of titles won by Lebron and Jordan and they fall short of the titles that were won by Boston's Bill Russell, the GOAT of all GOATS.

The funny thing is, there are a lot of players who played with Russell who have more titles than most of the rest of the NBA, but none of them have any without Russell. There's a reason for that.

 

[1960Pats]

What? The rest of your post makes sense but you lost me at the idea that one season and one playoff game can put Mahomes (or anyone) on path of potential to reach 8 Super Bowls. It’s not even worth a thought until someone has made like, 5.

The closest there is right now is Russell Wilson. He's made the playoffs 6 times in 7 seasons and been to two SB's with one win. This playoff season was the first that he didn't win at least one game (his 1st one and done).

 

[fightingirish595]

So if you win 4 sbs then get back to 2 more you are worse than if you lost in earlier rounds. But then if you get back to 3 more but win 1 you become better?

Not neccessarily. Seperate records from players. Only a fool would say “I don’t want to play any more superbowls because I might lose one” I think everybody would say, before the fact “Ill risk my 5-0 record for a chance to be 6-0.” Montana and Bradshaw have better Super Bowl wining percentages but one less ring. If Brady was still 4-2, one can believe he still is the better player than Montana and Bradshaw, and still think 4-0 is better than 4-2. Both can be true.

I don’t play in the NFL so I don’t know what it’s like to lose a Super Bowl. If I did and I was 0-2, I don’t think I’d say “I’d rather not go, than lose”. But if I was a quarterback who was 7-4 in the game with the most rings, I think I’d be okay with giving up lose 4 losses after the fact. I believe in the mystique/auorora of being undefeated on the biggest stage. But I’m not an nfl player so that’s easy for me to say.

 

[Quest4SevenHomie]

Montana was 4-3 in conference title games.

In those days, the NFC title game was the "Superbowl".......

=========================================

I don't care if Brady loses 10,000 Superbowls....just getting there is an amazing feat. See Jim Kelly and LeBron.

Oh God, please. LeBron constantly choked and ALWAYS switched teams whenever there was a legit opponent to challenge Lebron's all-star team.

Never compare Brady to LeBron.

 

[Quest4SevenHomie]

Win or lose the GOAT isn't going to be any less great and if he and Belichick succeed in dragging this roster with all it's holes to the promised land it will be right up there with XXXVI. There are always going to be azzclowns that completely ignore the 11 times he didn't get to the big game in glorifying Montana's 4-0. You can't fix stupid so there's no point in arguing with it. It's like playing chess with a pigeon.

What if that pigeon was Bobby Fischer?!

 

[Ring 6]

Not neccessarily. Seperate records from players. Only a fool would say “I don’t want to play any more superbowls because I might lose one” I think everybody would say, before the fact “Ill risk my 5-0 record for a chance to be 6-0.” Montana and Bradshaw have better Super Bowl wining percentages but one less ring. If Brady was still 4-2, one can believe he still is the better player than Montana and Bradshaw, and still think 4-0 is better than 4-2. Both can be true.

I don’t play in the NFL so I don’t know what it’s like to lose a Super Bowl. If I did and I was 0-2, I don’t think I’d say “I’d rather not go, than lose”. But if I was a quarterback who was 7-4 in the game with the most rings, I think I’d be okay with giving up lose 4 losses after the fact. I believe in the mystique/auorora of being undefeated on the biggest stage. But I’m not an nfl player so that’s easy for me to say.

This is wrong because in order to be 4-0 Montana has to lose EARLIER than the SB.
Undefeated in the SB because you got knocked out earlier isnt a mystique or “aurora”. It’s just being worse than the guy who got there regardless of whether he wins or loses.

 

[fightingirish595]

This is wrong because in order to be 4-0 Montana has to lose EARLIER than the SB.
Undefeated in the SB because you got knocked out earlier isnt a mystique or “aurora”. It’s just being worse than the guy who got there regardless of whether he wins or loses.

So was Tom Brady worse than the other quarterbacks who got to the Super Bowl the years he didn’t make it?

 

[Matthewschiefs]

As a non-Patriots fan I think Brady's legacy is pretty intact if he gets to another 10 super bowl losses. He is the best of his generation and it's not even close. He's going to be known as one of the best to ever play the game. Much respect

 

[Ring 6]

So was Tom Brady worse than the other quarterbacks who got to the Super Bowl the years he didn’t make it?

As far as winning yes.

 

[fightingirish595]

As far as winning yes.

Well winning isn’t the only way to judge somebody in a team sport.