BB: Our passing game isn't as efficient as it needs to be

[JMC00]

Football is 60 minutes.

I get that but my point was those weren't games like the Jags '07 Divisional game were he was 26 of 28 and had 3 TD or the '11 Broncos divisional game were he was 75% over 350 yards and 6 TD or the '16 AFCC.

Games where he shredded a team from start to finish and the game was never in doubt because he wasn't gonna let it be. The games I listed were games where he had moments of god-tier greatness that won the game

 

[sb1]

Spygate is a myth perpetuated by Goodell after a rule change on 9.6.06 that was not voted on by the league. Mike Tomlin tries to interfere with a live play and gets a 100K fine. It's an insult to my intelligence especially after learning the facts after Goodell did what he did.

This is like saying Deflategate stains Brady. It's embarrassing, really. Misinformation via the interwebs has made our country dumb. Congratulations.

No it wasn't a myth, it was Bill's desire as usual to be the smartest guy in the room so he played word games with the rulebook and the memo to try and outsmart his peers and even the commissioner. He was caught cheating. He even acknowledged he shouldn't have done it.

He is 100% responsible for the hell brought on this team and its fans ever since that incident.

Deflategate doesn't stain Brady given what we know now about the facts. Spygate is a different story.

 

[PatsRebuild]

It would be stupid for ANY true Patriots fan to hate BB. OK to become frustrated with some of his decisions or communication style, but other than Red Auerbach he is in a class by himself in the pantheon of Boston sports.

Exactly. There are plenty of things through 20 years I disagreed with him on. Absolutely. But, for our own fans to not like what he's provided? Bizarre.

It's a conditioning by the media who have spent 20 years trying to make him look bad because he doesn't put energy into trying to use them as a prop to make him look good like Pete Carroll does.

Pete Carroll is a tool.

 

[holyredeemer]

So, seriously, just so you know no QB BB ever drafted, per Bedard (I don't love the guy, but he has knowledge bit. but still likes to take shots out of anger he didn't get more attention from BB when he took over for Gasper, which is the pattern from all these bozos), was ever intended to be anything more than a developmental back up. This means BB never drafted any QB as an idea that they would push Brady to possibly take over. Even Mallet in Rd 3, I think it was. All of others were intended to be true back ups, hopefully good ones. Davey, Mallett, etc, or whoever else. That's why he usually brought in UDFAs or street guys.

Something happened after 2013, though (because his 2007-2012 postseason play was awful overall in big games)..........The idea was to throw stuff at the wall, which can be good, and just see what happens. That's why BB had 3 rookie WRs and Edelman out there in 2013. He wanted Brady to adjust. Nope. Didn;t work. BB then drafts JimmyG knowing it HAS to work somehow.

I mean, seriously, do the math a bit....BB knows what he wants as a QB. Go back and read his Browns days ideal QB for the future. It's literally Brady. Once Brady wanted something away from what made him, BB saw enough and knew the ego took over...........Chasing Manning stats, etc....His postseason and his cerebral play got worse. BB then drafts JimmyG....Just saying. The FACT he worked with JimmyG daily after he drafted him witbhh Brady seeing it, is not a coincidence why Brady all of a sudden got more serious again and Jimmy is 5 better OC plays called in a SB with a ring.

None of this has anything to do with Rhebein. It has to do with BB being so annoyed he couldn't get Testaverde, the closest thing to a Phil Simms, he could get in 1992. Modell didn't relent until 1993. He's been scarred by not having a QB of his choice ready, and he had one in Jimmy.

What in the world is wrong with you? He was simply stating that Rehbein was young, had many years of coaching /evaluation and was wondering how much more he may have contributed to the team with those skills. How hard is that to understand?

 

[PatsRebuild]

No it wasn't a myth, it was Bill's desire as usual to be the smartest guy in the room so he played word games with the rulebook and the memo to try and outsmart even the commissioner. He was caught cheating. He even acknowledged he shouldn't have done it.

He is 100% responsible for the hell brought on this team and its fans ever since that incident.

No.

Mangini was way overpaid and went to the Jets. Woody Johnson overpaid him specifically to weaken B's staff, since Crennel left a year earlier. With me?

So, then Mangini goes and tells Woody Johnson about how BB works.

The rule was changed, Goodell was hired, specifically to try to make the league more money. NY wants their money. The league technically does better when BOTH NY teams thrive. Didn't you see the Two Bills doc? It started back in 1997 with the Parcells tampering. It goes way back.

Goodell's first official action on the job was changing the wording of the rule on 9.6.06.

Manboobs then comes into Foxborough and asks for a 2nd camera spot in January of 2007. The arrogance. BB hears of it and then puts Estrella on the sideline to flip off Mangini in the next game in NY. It's not cheating. At worst, it's a fine for BB for conduct unbecoming like for Tomlin tripping Jacoby Jones and literally affecting the integrity of the game.

Then, Woody Johnson thinks that somehow, some way, BB's streamlined and efficient scouting processes are an advantage. Maybe it was that good. But, that's not his business, but since he was the one who vouched for Goodell, and controls Goodell, he demanded he cheat our team. The bottom line is, the rule, the wording of that rule was changed to block NE's success. That's cheating. And, he's done it numerous times to our team since. Dynasties are VERY bad for NFL business. Don't be fooled. These owners think they should have MADE MORE MONEY then they have. Just because it's another world to us, doesn't mean it's not true. They're drunk with greed and trying outshine daddy as an owner. Note how many owners are sons of previous owners.

NE never cheated for anything. We've been framed to get our draft picks to weaken what BB has done. BB's success with Brady and Kraft irks owners.

 

[PatsRebuild]

What in the world is wrong with you? He was simply stating that Rehbein was young, had many years of coaching /evaluation and was wondering how much more he may have contributed to the team with those skills. How hard is that to understand?

I think it proves the opposite, actually. BB groomed Brady. Not Rhebein. The Rhebein angle is pretty arrogant. If passed away, how could he have been responsible for Brady's development? It makes no sense.

 

[holyredeemer]

I think it proves the opposite, actually. BB groomed Brady. Not Rhebein. The Rhebein angle is pretty arrogant. If passed away, how could he have been responsible for Brady's development? It makes no sense.

Don’t pull **** out of your ass please. Ian never said Rehbein was responsible for grooming Brady, and neither did I. Let’s take a step back here and focus on what my argument with you is. Ready? Ian said one thing and you took it out of complete context and ran with a completely different angle. Reminds of those media members you love so much to hate.

 

[PatsRebuild]

Don’t pull **** out of your ass please. Ian never said Rehbein was responsible for grooming Brady, and neither did I. Let’s take a step back here and focus on what my argument with you is. Ready? Ian said one thing and you took it out of complete context and ran with a completely different angle. Reminds of those media members you love so much to hate.

I just don't get the rhetoric about Rheibein's power. It's a lie, really. BOTH BB and Rheibein liked the potential of Bradyl not just Rheibein. See? BOTH.

Unless Ian thinks Brady would have been even greater if Rheibein had lived? Is that the premise? We win 6 SBs in 6 years if Rheibein lived? What is the point exactly? Rheibein would have developed Brady even better than BB did?

There's a technique that people use via the media to make it seem like BB is not good at what he does, and it's all dumb luck, which is hilarious.

 

[JMC00]

2) Benching Malcolm Butler and giving up a sure Super Bowl win.

I don't know. For Butler to not get a single snap in that one just seems like there is something he did that never will be heard because Bill won't throw a player under the bus and Butler won't say anything because it could make it go from "not playing Butler is why they lost" to "Butler is the reason they lost"

Also another underrated thing is it wasn't just Butler not playing, Jonathan Jones who got injured against the Titans ended up being just as big a missing piece. He definitely would have helped in that game.

But I do think some of that stain is lessened but Bill coming back the next year and having the best defensive performance ever in a SB and did it against the NFC's best offense. Plus that's coupled with the how they went to KC and contained Mahomes in the AFCC to get to the SB. I mean domestic abuser hill was a non-factor. That game was closer than it should have been because the Brady pick in the end zone and then the Edelman bobble INT that set them up in the red zone those go the other way and it's probably a 34-21 game.

 

[PatsRebuild]

I don't know. For Butler to not get a single snap in that one just seems like there is something he did that never will be heard because Bill won't throw a player under the bus and Butler won't say anything because it could make it go from "not playing Butler is why they lost" to "Butler is the reason they lost"

Also another underrated thing is it wasn't just Butler not playing, Jonathan Jones who got injured against the Titans ended up being just as big a missing piece. He definitely would have helped in that game.

But I do think some of that stain is lessened but Bill coming back the next year and having the best defensive performance ever in a SB and did it against the NFC's best offense. Plus that's coupled with the how they went to KC and contained Mahomes in the AFCC to get to the SB. I mean domestic abuser hill was a non-factor. That game was closer than it should have been because the Brady pick in the end zone and then the Edelman bobble INT that set them up in the red zone those go the other way and it's probably a 34-21 game.

WHich is the dumbest premise I've seen in the last 5 years about our team. Butler sucked down the stretch. The contract clearly messed with his head, but I think BB thought he'd break out of his slump, but he never did. Imagine someone offering you 8 mil per to play Star and being offended after working at Popeye's? I mean, what a world we live in.

As you say, rookie Jon Jones beat out Butler during the season. Another huge loss in the game for us. We missed so many key people.

There are probably 5-7 plays in that game, including Goodell cheating on one, as to why NE lost to Philly. Or, if Chung doesn't break his arm in a game with no Hightower or Edelman, NE cruises.

He had Ertz shutout. It was really then where the game got out of hand. Foles was hot early and I disagreed with BB at the time on how he aligned the D.

He should have bracketed Jeffrey with Harmon over the top and Rowe underneath similar to how he does it with Tyreek Hill. I said this going into the game, because Jeffrey is really on a homerun guy. He's not an underneath guy, so put your rangiest CB on him in man.

THen you put Gilmore on Agohlor. He would have taken him out because he's really the guy who runs all the routes. I think if BB did it this way and Chung doesn't break his arm, NE wins.

That said, Brady dropped a perfectly thrown ball on our trick play and Brady Fanboys act like it had no impact in the result. Comical. I could have caught that. There was no one near him.

 

[Ian]

So, seriously, just so you know no QB BB ever drafted, per Bedard (I don't love the guy, but he has knowledge bit. but still likes to take shots out of anger he didn't get more attention from BB when he took over for Gasper, which is the pattern from all these bozos), was ever intended to be anything more than a developmental back up. This means BB never drafted any QB as an idea that they would push Brady to possibly take over. Even Mallet in Rd 3, I think it was. All of others were intended to be true back ups, hopefully good ones. Davey, Mallett, etc, or whoever else. That's why he usually brought in UDFAs or street guys.

Something happened after 2013, though (because his 2007-2012 postseason play was awful overall in big games)..........The idea was to throw stuff at the wall, which can be good, and just see what happens. That's why BB had 3 rookie WRs and Edelman out there in 2013. He wanted Brady to adjust. Nope. Didn;t work. BB then drafts JimmyG knowing it HAS to work somehow.

I mean, seriously, do the math a bit....BB knows what he wants as a QB. Go back and read his Browns days ideal QB for the future. It's literally Brady. Once Brady wanted something away from what made him, BB saw enough and knew the ego took over...........Chasing Manning stats, etc....His postseason and his cerebral play got worse. BB then drafts JimmyG....Just saying. The FACT he worked with JimmyG daily after he drafted him witbhh Brady seeing it, is not a coincidence why Brady all of a sudden got more serious again and Jimmy is 5 better OC plays called in a SB with a ring.

None of this has anything to do with Rhebein. It has to do with BB being so annoyed he couldn't get Testaverde, the closest thing to a Phil Simms, he could get in 1992. Modell didn't relent until 1993. He's been scarred by not having a QB of his choice ready, and he had one in Jimmy.

My comment was said in passing about a guy who died too young who it would have been interesting to see his personnel contributions as a coach/scout went had he not died so young. Again, how you came to the conclusion that I have a negative opinion about Belichick (which caused you to vehemently defend him) or any other intention from my post (and subsequent reply) is definitely overreaching.

 

[PatsRebuild]

My comment was said in passing about a guy who died too young who it would have been interesting to see his personnel contributions as a coach/scout went had he not died so young. Again, how you came to the conclusion that I have a negative opinion about Belichick (which caused you to vehemently defend him) or any other intention from my post (and subsequent reply) is definitely overreaching.

Fair enough. I mean, no one knew who **** Rhebein was in NE until he did pass away. I just don't understand the point other than it's a sad story and he seemed like a good guy. He just got to the organization in 2000. He was there for barely a year.

 

[50-yard-line]

Michel is far from a "hit". Also I have never understood the argument that "Player X was a good pick because he is playing else where in the league". How the hell does that make it a good pick for Bill? The only one you could even argue for out of that group is Crossen because you got him in the 7th and flipped him for a 6th. If a player is picked by the New England Patriots and never contributes to the New England Patriots how exactly is that good?

The Pats have had a very talented DEEP roster for years now. Hard to crack. These guys playing elsewhere couldn't beat out JC Jackson, Gilmore, McCourty(s), Jon Jones...go figure.

 

[Ian]

Fair enough. I mean, no one knew who **** Rhebein was in NE until he did pass away. I just don't understand the point other than it's a sad story and he seemed like a good guy. He just got to the organization in 2000. He was there for barely a year.

He scouted and convinced them to draft one of the best players to ever play the game. Just saying, it would have been interesting to see what other late round gems he might have contributed to in finding. That’s really about the only point I was making.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

WHich is the dumbest premise I've seen in the last 5 years about our team. Butler sucked down the stretch. The contract clearly messed with his head, but I think BB thought he'd break out of his slump, but he never did. Imagine someone offering you 8 mil per to play Star and being offended after working at Popeye's? I mean, what a world we live in.

As you say, rookie Jon Jones beat out Butler during the season. Another huge loss in the game for us. We missed so many key people.

There are probably 5-7 plays in that game, including Goodell cheating on one, as to why NE lost to Philly. Or, if Chung doesn't break his arm in a game with no Hightower or Edelman, NE cruises.

He had Ertz shutout. It was really then where the game got out of hand. Foles was hot early and I disagreed with BB at the time on how he aligned the D.

He should have bracketed Jeffrey with Harmon over the top and Rowe underneath similar to how he does it with Tyreek Hill. I said this going into the game, because Jeffrey is really on a homerun guy. He's not an underneath guy, so put your rangiest CB on him in man.

THen you put Gilmore on Agohlor. He would have taken him out because he's really the guy who runs all the routes. I think if BB did it this way and Chung doesn't break his arm, NE wins.

That said, Brady dropped a perfectly thrown ball on our trick play and Brady Fanboys act like it had no impact in the result. Comical. I could have caught that. There was no one near him.

Imagine making 2 pro bowl teams like Butler did and being benched the day before the Superbowl. Not only that but asking your 3rd corner and free safety to play totally different assignments the night before the game, affecting the entire secondary as a result. The Patriots literally did not stop a single drive against Philly, Philly did not punt one single time that game....

.

 

[sb1]

No.

Mangini was way overpaid and went to the Jets. Woody Johnson overpaid him specifically to weaken B's staff, since Crennel left a year earlier. With me?

So, then Mangini goes and tells Woody Johnson about how BB works.

The rule was changed, Goodell was hired, specifically to try to make the league more money. NY wants their money. The league technically does better when BOTH NY teams thrive. Didn't you see the Two Bills doc? It started back in 1997 with the Parcells tampering. It goes way back.

Goodell's first official action on the job was changing the wording of the rule on 9.6.06.

Manboobs then comes into Foxborough and asks for a 2nd camera spot in January of 2007. The arrogance. BB hears of it and then puts Estrella on the sideline to flip off Mangini in the next game in NY. It's not cheating. At worst, it's a fine for BB for conduct unbecoming like for Tomlin tripping Jacoby Jones and literally affecting the integrity of the game.

Then, Woody Johnson thinks that somehow, some way, BB's streamlined and efficient scouting processes are an advantage. Maybe it was that good. But, that's not his business, but since he was the one who vouched for Goodell, and controls Goodell, he demanded he cheat our team. The bottom line is, the rule, the wording of that rule was changed to block NE's success. That's cheating. And, he's done it numerous times to our team since. Dynasties are VERY bad for NFL business. Don't be fooled. These owners think they should have MADE MORE MONEY then they have. Just because it's another world to us, doesn't mean it's not true. They're drunk with greed and trying outshine daddy as an owner. Note how many owners are sons of previous owners.

NE never cheated for anything. We've been framed to get our draft picks to weaken what BB has done. BB's success with Brady and Kraft irks owners.

I think the conspiracy theories have merit when it comes to Deflategate.

Not for the Jets incident of Spygate. That was cut and dried. Bill is not a habitual cheater but he cheated that time. He did so deliberately but that doesn't change the fact he cheated. Same as someone who injects steroids and films it for the public to see.

Why did he cheat? Because he thought he was smarter than everyone else. Nothing unusual for him.

 

[Kontradiction]

You mean to say BB is human and not 100% perfect. Hard to swallow but its true and he would tell you the same thing, because he is honest. BB is one of the 5 greatest coaches of all time, but we have built him up to godlike status in NE, because we have such a hunger for heroes to look up to. We can honestly criticize him without taking away from his accomplishments. Does he have an ego...yes...most great ones do. Does his ego and self confidence get in the way sometimes for decision making...yes. Has he made egregious mistakes in player personnel evaluations over the last 3 years yes.
That being said he is one of the greatest...and most true Patriots fans appreciate everything he has done for this franchise and hope for better days ahead.

He is no doubt the GOAT HC. There will never be another BB. The GOAT GM he is not.

 

[PatsRebuild]

I think the conspiracy theories have merit when it comes to Deflategate.

Not for the Jets incident of Spygate. That was cut and dried. Bill is not a habitual cheater but he cheated that time. He did so deliberately but that doesn't change the fact he cheated. Same as someone who injects steroids and films it for the public to see.

Why did he cheat? Because he thought he was smarter than everyone else. Nothing unusual for him.

Not true.

So, if he was truly cheating, why wasn't this an issue in 2006? You have a 3 hours for a game an not one NFL emplotyee on the sidelines said a word the whole year? Not buying it. The rule change was spedifically to target BB's greatness and BB knew it.

The rule was changed on 9.6.06 to start that season. It was clearly a way to try to weaken how BB's scouting works inside the organization. Mangini asked for a 2nd camera, a NE employee granted it, BB saw it, got pissed and then did it to Mangini. A bit petty? Sure. But, a 1st rd ppick and him lying about what he did to the NFL fans? Certainly not the first time there's been inter-divisonal feuds either.

Isn't the better question, why is there a new commissioner when Tagliabue was doing so well and why did the Jets owner hire the commissioner, and why wasn't a rule change not voted on by 32 teams like it always had been? Isn't that the question? 24 /32 teams need to vote to change a rule. That's in the Constitution and Bylaws. It's always been that way until Goodell arrived.

I mean, we learned during Deflategate that there is a clause in the the Constitution that talks about Article 46. So, we now know why Goodell cites to cheat. That's it. His lawyers told him he could use that to do whatever he wants without cause or reason or even rational thinking. I think BB simply didn't realize why Goodell as hired. I don't think Kraft fully knew either. I think he thought Woody Johnson would feel included as a big boy at the big boy table, but he didn't think Johnson and Goodell would be so slimy.

That's why it was easy to tell Deflategate was made up, too. NE knows what Goodell is looking to do. They know.

The bottom line is, BB is so great, the owners are not only jealous of Kraft (and Brady, etc), they tell Goodell to do these things. Goodell even gets caught red handed in federal courts! He's been told 3 times by 3 different judges he's a liar. What commissioner in sports history does this? Answer: NONE. The closest is Bud Selgi pleading ignorance to roids in front of Congress in 2005. The judges didn't believe the NFL's lawyers in Bountygate, Ray Rice Creepy Coverupgate (so Goodell can still play golf at Augusta with Bisciotti, apparently), or Deflategate. You know, he's not that smart and he's a liar, he can't keep all the lies straight. 56 proveable lies in the Wells Report. Whopps!

Note how the Ravens just cheated for the 4th time, like ACTUAL CHEATING that can be proven, and all they got were small fines. Where are the draft picks? Aren't they "repeat" offenders?

See?

Why did Goodell take picks from some teams during Covid and not the Ravens who brazenly ignored protocols? Where is the media on this anyway?

Anyone defending the actions of brazen Cheater Goodell is enabling the cheating. I mean, this guy has been caught changing wording of the rule AFTER a game we lost to make it look legit. Remember that one? Pats vs Jets OT in 2013? He cheated. The rule was taught that summer as a change from the "second level", which means players who aren't on the line with their hand in the dirt. CHris Jones is a DT and did not come from the second level. He simply sidestepped the guy next to him and slipped through to block the FG. The ref did what Rex Ryan demanded, and then Blandino was caught rushing the wording change of the rule to match what happened on the OT game winning kick by Folk. Remember? Blandino did this on NFL.com. I saw it! It's creepy as hell, man.

I've been watching the NFL and sports for 40 years and I've never seen a commissioner try to manipulate the league he oversees for financial benefit, but that, jealousy and abuse of power is what Spygate happened, dude. It's old news at this point.

I mean, even this last little doozy of the 3rd rd pick has Pats Haters even rolling their eyes of how obvious the cheating is from Goodell. You couldn't make this crap up if you tried.

 

[PatsRebuild]

He is no doubt the GOAT HC. There will never be another BB. The GOAT GM he is not.

Name the top 5 GMs in NFL history:

 

[denverpatsfan]

Right now Stidham is Ray Bourque trying to follow Brady/Orr. I am not saying he is a HOF QB, but good lord why on earth are people angry about giving him a chance??

Dude. You just lost all credibility comparing Stidham to Ray Bourque. Not even close. Please.